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Original poster

New employee is a fake, where to go from here?

956 replies

londonnotlangdon · 28/04/2022 06:56

It's a large organisation and I just had to send off her paperwork, passport, things like that

She was given the job after her second interview last week.

However, she has emailed me these documents (fine), and her birth certificate says born in September 2002?

That makes her 19?

This is a problem because, for example, her CV says she was an Executive Assistant to a Director in 2018? When she would've been in school?!

I've asked HR, who haven't replied properly, I've asked them to call. But someone replied to my email of concern with 'so you don't want this new me ever of staff? Why not?'

What can actually be done about this?

OP posts:
MyCatIsAJerk · 30/04/2022 01:36

londonnotlangdon · 28/04/2022 07:10

I don't think it's her using someone else's birth certificate surely? She sounds very British, looks British. Her mannerisms. She seemed very professional and able to command a room, speak in meetings etc

Yes I could be wrong, but it's unlikely.

Looks British? What exactly does British look like?

I’m born & raised in California but I’d wager that I “look British” too. My ancestors came to the USA from England in 1636 — I consider myself completely American, but I doubt I look any different than you, if you mean white with Anglo-Saxon features.
What mannerisms makes one look British?

But honestly I don’t know what you mean, because even I know there are many, many different races within Great Britain.

I mean… wow. I’m confused.

Please don’t think I’m picking on you. I’m just astounded someone in a professional position would say “looks British.” That’s like someone from where I live saying, “looks Mexican,” or “looks Chinese.” I just am not following, so I do apologize.

I completely & totally get “sounds British,” btw. Unfortunately, I know we Americans are immediately identifiable by speech and accent as well. And their actions abroad. Oh - and probably their attire and their poor manners.
Not all of us, of course, but enough that we earned the nickname “ugly American.”
How embarrassing.

MyCatIsAJerk · 30/04/2022 01:44

ZaraD · 29/04/2022 23:44

I’m a nurse id love a job starting at 40k!

@ZaraD

You and every other nurse the world over deserve far more.
Thank you for what you do. ❤️

DaisyQuakeJohnson · 30/04/2022 02:08

If it's a large organisation with an HR department, why are you vetting documents? There are legal implications concerning employment. It's unusual and lax for document verification to fall to someone outwith HR who doesn't have the access or skillset to complete verification adequately. Sharing id documents with other staff would usually breach GDPR too. There are very strict guidelines around passport access, storage, verification, etc.

me109f · 30/04/2022 02:13

Take it up with the HR employee who u notified. Ask him/her what action has been taken.

If they say nothing, or are evasive, find a senior executive manager and have an informal chat about it. It will not cost you your job, but it might have repercussions elsewhere.

Employees are a big investment for a business, and if there is a fraud they need to know about it.

RantyAunty · 30/04/2022 02:15

PegasusReturns · 29/04/2022 22:21

@RantyAunty

What's so hard about it?

I suspect you’re just being snidey but it’s one of this jobs that everyone thinks they can do but is actually extremely complex and involved.

It requires a high degree of organisation; an ability to influence and communicate from junior to board level; skilful management of multiple diaries, budgets, contracts and expenses and excellent problem solving skills.

It’s also a job that requires you to leave your ego at the door and be discreet.

Doesn't sound much different than when I did it years ago.

Most mums do these things 7 days a week without pay or recognition.

supermommyof4 · 30/04/2022 02:26

Although yes the legislation says education or training till 18, it isn't enforced. 3 of mine have left education before 18. One went full time work, hated college, and has become a manager through sheer hard work, he is now 23.
Daughter left college at 17, full time work, is in a very good job, and works from home most of the time, original plan was uni but the pandemic put her off so she got a job
3rd child left education at 17, worked self employed with dad for a bit, careers checked on him but didnt intervene when told he was working full time. Its not very enforceable.

RonaldMcDonald · 30/04/2022 02:27

Re checking exams - we don’t
we get a copy of the professional fitness to practice and they are supposed to have done that donkey work.
I know lots of places that ask for copies of doctorate, masters etc but never care at all about GCSEs or A levels

bruffin · 30/04/2022 04:03

RonaldMcDonald · 30/04/2022 02:27

Re checking exams - we don’t
we get a copy of the professional fitness to practice and they are supposed to have done that donkey work.
I know lots of places that ask for copies of doctorate, masters etc but never care at all about GCSEs or A levels

My Dh got asked for his cse certs from 1970s when he started current job
It was for security, it was one of proving he was who he said he was

BarbaraofSeville · 30/04/2022 05:51

Proving who you are and your work history for any job with security requirements is brutal.

DP applied for a job at the airport but having been a freelancer it would have taken days to list all his different jobs, contacts etc and often these didn't exist, he didn't know who they were, or knew they wouldn't co-operate (the employment agency who sent him to a particular building site for one week 3 years ago for example).

But even if he did that, he would probably have fallen down due to the 'unexplainable gaps' rule, because obviously they were interested in anyone who'd gone off to terrorist training camp, but it didn't work for someone who might have taken a few weeks off to catch up with some building projects in the house or just during a quiet period.

So he withdrew the application but seeing as this was in January 2020 that job as a baggage handler was unlikely to have gone anywhere anyway....

SnozPoz · 30/04/2022 06:16

From what I've read she's either lying about her age with a fake birth certificate, or lying about her experience, or lying about it all. It seems very "convenient" that her two first companies no longer exist. I would be calling her school, asking for exam results, dates, and a character reference and calling the employer who does exist as well for the same. Not using emails or numbers given by her but googling them and finding the real ones. I'd also seek out people who worked for the defunct companies and ask them if they remember her. Personally I would be very cautious about employing her.

Luculentus · 30/04/2022 06:50

MyCatIsAJerk · 30/04/2022 01:36

Looks British? What exactly does British look like?

I’m born & raised in California but I’d wager that I “look British” too. My ancestors came to the USA from England in 1636 — I consider myself completely American, but I doubt I look any different than you, if you mean white with Anglo-Saxon features.
What mannerisms makes one look British?

But honestly I don’t know what you mean, because even I know there are many, many different races within Great Britain.

I mean… wow. I’m confused.

Please don’t think I’m picking on you. I’m just astounded someone in a professional position would say “looks British.” That’s like someone from where I live saying, “looks Mexican,” or “looks Chinese.” I just am not following, so I do apologize.

I completely & totally get “sounds British,” btw. Unfortunately, I know we Americans are immediately identifiable by speech and accent as well. And their actions abroad. Oh - and probably their attire and their poor manners.
Not all of us, of course, but enough that we earned the nickname “ugly American.”
How embarrassing.

Show quote history

OP has already answered that upthread.

ThinWomansBrain · 30/04/2022 06:53

Her very first CV entry is something along the lines of junior assistant. The job started in 2015 and ended some years later

started in 2015 when she was 13? you need to have a conversation with her. Might be a typo, but you need to investigate - if she has lied on her application, can she be trusted in the work place? Presumably thare's something on your starting documentation that new/potential employees sign to confirm there application doesn;y contain any misstatements?

Luculentus · 30/04/2022 06:58

Applicant withdrew two days ago, people. OP doesn't need any more advice on this.

Moodycow78 · 30/04/2022 07:28

Have you spoken to her about it? That's what I'd do, see what she says.

RampantIvy · 30/04/2022 07:46

Posters still not bothering to read the OP's updates🤷

RachelGreeneGreep · 30/04/2022 07:55

Luculentus · 30/04/2022 06:58

Applicant withdrew two days ago, people. OP doesn't need any more advice on this.

Oh it will run on and on, regardless Grin

threatmatrix · 30/04/2022 08:01

Give her a chance, if she’s rubbish she won’t last long, Stop being a jobsworth you don’t get paid enough.

RedWingBoots · 30/04/2022 08:08

@BarbaraofSeville I get round it because I personally know professional people including doctors and lawyers from social activities who will provide references for me.

They have been checked up on as some organisations seen surprised that I personally know such people.

The only gap that has ever been deeply questioned was when I had a baby. My references all gave rather sarcastic answers and I offered to let the woman doing the referencing speak to my then 2 year old.

Magenta82 · 30/04/2022 08:14

Cancel the cheque OP.

For goodness sake I wish people would read the thread, or at least the OP's posts.

As for the people who are dismissing the difficulty of an EA job they are either ridiculous snobs or just clueless. It is a complex many faceted role that needs many different skills. The £40k salary wasn't for someone walking in after a few GCSEs it was for an experienced capable candidate, which is why the OP was questioning how a 19 year old would have this experience.

BarbaraofSeville · 30/04/2022 08:24

Thanks. It was one of those things that he might have been able to sort if he really wanted to, but would have been a tremendous effort. I'm not sure why he applied for the job to be honest, I came home from work one day and he announced he had an interview the next day at the airport and I was like 'but they'll want you to start at 4 am' or 'it takes over an hour to get there at rush hour' or 'they'll give you no shifts in November but want you to work 60 hours a week in the summer' (it was a low hours contract but it was clear that they expected you to work in accordance to demand, which is not unexpected, but he has some other work that keeps him very busy in the summer that he wanted to keep up with so it would have never worked anyway, pandemic or not)

But bizarrely, when my sister applied for a job that required security clearance and had to explain why she had been out of work due to being a SAHM, they accepted me as a reference and wrote to me to confirm that she had been 'a housewife' during the period in question (this was some time ago, DN is now 27).

CowboyFromHell · 30/04/2022 08:29

If only the Mumsnet site update had included a mechanism that only allowed people to post on a thread after they’d clicked on ‘see all OP posts’ and actually read then!

Mandyjack · 30/04/2022 08:33

londonnotlangdon · 28/04/2022 07:12

@MrsClatterbuck just says 8 GCSE's A* - C.

Doesn't mention anything else and to be honest we didn't focus much on that at interview

Maybe you need to ask her for copies of her certificates. Tbh I'd give her a quick call and say we just wanted to double check your dates on the cv as it would mean she'd be at school.
People do lie, I work for a LGA and have known of social workers lie. 1 lied about her visa which wasn't discovered till she was on maternity leave. Another wasn't even a social worker he'd lied about qualifications so it does happen. You wouldn't want someone whose dishonest working for you.

Mandyjack · 30/04/2022 08:35

CowboyFromHell · 30/04/2022 08:29

If only the Mumsnet site update had included a mechanism that only allowed people to post on a thread after they’d clicked on ‘see all OP posts’ and actually read then!

Not everyone has time to sieve through them all and tbh I only noticed it recently. Be kind to new users it can be hard to get to grips with this site especially with all the acronyms used

Mandyjack · 30/04/2022 08:42

londonnotlangdon · 28/04/2022 07:25

The thing is this, the first job she ever had was with a company, a very large one that people know, that went under

And the others are with big companies too. So not little ones where you can just exaggerate the job title there

A good example is the CV listing things like 'Managing multiple diaries for Director' or 'organising flights and accommodation across multiple time zones'

You wouldn't give that to a 13-15 year old surely, in a blue chip company

She could've got someone else to do her cv for her? Or is it possible she's using the cv of an older sister? I'd look her up online as others have said

Mandyjack · 30/04/2022 08:48

Sventon · 29/04/2022 22:35

the employee needs to be taken into a room with you and HR. She should be asked to talk through her CV and to explain her birth certificate. Depending on the answers etx you can make a decision from there. Personally, if she has lies on her CV I would terminate her employment as if the employment relationship is based on a lie, it’s not going to work.

A friend of mine had a job offer withdrawn purely for a typo on a application form. The company agreed it was probably a typo of a gcse result but being a large investment company wasn't able to employ someone who'd given a different answer on their form to their gcse certificate. Luckily her employer allowed her to withdraw her notice