Why is children's behaviour worse these days?

[salviapages]

I recently retrained as a primary teacher, did placements in a few schools then worked as a supply teacher so seen a wide range and I've been shocked at the behaviour. Nothing like how I remember kids in my class at primary being.

Every teacher I've spoken to about this says behaviour has gotten worse over the years and I've seen mumsnetters say the same, including in the current thread about teachers leaving the profession.

So - why is this? Have we changed how we raise children? Have schools changed? Why the rise in bad behaviour?

Anyway I'm OK with being soft. That's cool with me. As a child I was very sensitive and cried a lot and was constantly told to just buck up, shut up, get on with it and forced to do things I didn't want to do in the name of character building.

Anyway that did absolutely fuck all except screw with my mental health so, you know, no I won't be parenting my own child that way. I respect who he is and won't try to force him to be something else.

@Porcupineintherough

Those are all lovely strategies if you are parent with 1 toddler *@BertieBotts* but less useful in a classroom with 30 15 year olds. There comes a point, and ideally it comes fairly early on, that sometimes you just have to pipe down and follow the rules so that everyone can get on.

^^ I agree with this. And let's face it, can apply to a family of 4, a group.of friends or hobby group, never mind a class of 30. Everyone has to be willing to cooperate and compromise for the good of the group sometimes.

It’s a new age of parenting where we would rather discuss behaviour and treat them as autonomous individuals rather than expect blind obedience.

Quite, and frankly for all the accusations of lazy parenting IMO it is much lazier to simply scare your children into submission to get them into comply. Not doing that requires a lot more effort and patience.

Parents want to be on their phones so they are more willing to ignore certain behaviour?
Anecdotally it’s rare to see a parent following through. I’m a big fan of it and I think it sets a good example. It also empowers other parents. I can only think of a few parents I know who follow through. The majority do the “do that again and I’ll take all your toys away” nonsense

@Penzinola

Why? My parents both worked , funnily enough both of their parents worked - i work as does my husband…in a multi generation of working parents (both sides) there isn’t any issues. Grandparents raised 5 well adjusted children now nearing retirement and my parents raised 3 girls - who all work whilst being good parents?

Inclusion has also had an impact on behavioural standards. Previously children with clear additional needs would have been sent to special schools if not institutions.

Gentle parenting is all about firm boundaries and natural (ie linked) consequences, just laid down and applied in a respectful way that acknowledges the child's feelings. Anyone that takes gentle parenting to mean loose boundaries is doing it wrong. Kids need their parents to be calm confident leaders. You're in charge, but you are kind about it. It works a lot better for getting well behaved and well adjusted kids than a more authoritarian approach in my experience.

I doubt anyone on here is advocating scaring children are they?

@Rockmehardplace me too, particularly offensive is the thought that sen children should be placed in an institution.

Inclusion has also had an impact on behavioural standards. Previously children with clear additional needs would have been sent to special schools if not institutions.

I'm so glad we don't lock disabled children away nowadays so that don't inconvenience non-disabled people.

Instead of blaming children with additional needs for the (imagined) behavioural problems of an entire generation, perhaps direct them at the government who has chronically underfunded schools.

I doubt anyone on here is advocating scaring children are they?

Dunno, I mean we have posters advocating putting disabled children into institutions so...

I think there’s now a generation of parents who were never parented themselves.

And again @Nothappyatwork that's fine when your child is in a situation where they can have 121 attention but how does it work in a classroom setting? Do you really think the teacher can simultaneously monitor and provide personal behavioural strategies for 30 kids and teach math?

Whilst I totally appreciate it is essential for many families to have 2 full time working parents I also feel that this fuels a lack of quality time that would enable parents to, well, parent more effectively - so many lack the time to really engage. Devices, particularly mobile phones & gaming consoles, have created a generation of zombies….I really think (/hope?) in 20 years time they’ll look back and think WTF?!!

I doubt anyone on here is advocating scaring children are they?

Half the thread is people blithely stating that the problem is children aren't afraid of their parents any more.

The school i work at reward bad behaviour imo.The challenging kids know theyll get to have time in the quad messing with a football or other things seen as treats to other kids if they act up during lessons.

@Porcupineintherough

And again *@Nothappyatwork* that's fine when your child is in a situation where they can have 121 attention but how does it work in a classroom setting? Do you really think the teacher can simultaneously monitor and provide personal behavioural strategies for 30 kids and teach math?

No I don’t think that at all but in an ideal scenario and I have more than one child, I literally was a bit like the von traps at one point with a whistle, if each parent could instill into each child on an individual basis before they got to school then collectively the group of 30 should be fine. But realistically the main reason my children went to private school is because the numbers were halved, the teachers were doubled in that worked incredibly well as a system.

In my humble opinion it's two working parent families or single parent families that cause a huge problem. Obviously there are always exceptions but me included, as a working mum I seriously struggle to parent at my best. I also ignore my dc when we're together s sometimes as I'm so exhausted and I know it's not great but after a days work I can't start up again. They are always asking me to play with them and I just can't summon enough energy. I'm sure I'm not alone and I do believe it has an impact on dc, simply me pacifying them with food/screen time/toys is replacing what used to be a mother looking after their dc and giving them a lot more attention.

I remember when I was at school all the mums used to volunteer to help the teachers, they'd sit in groups helping dc who were struggling to read, if your mum couldn't have you on any night there was always another mum willing to step up to help because no one really worked and because they knew it's tough so hopefully you'd return the favour.

If I could go back I'd save enough money I didn't need to work until at least dc are slightly older. For me preferably once primary is out the way. I think dc need us more than society wants to admit it. I don't exclude fathers either but I do believe in the majority of the cases it's mums (and mums together supporting each other) that can really make changes to dc behaviour.

All the people saying parents are too soft nowadays- if you're saying that going back to when kids were slapped, hit with rules and belts and demeaned, I think you should take your rose tinted glasses off- I remember my dad telling me stories of him being whipped for the tiniest of things. Yes he grew up to be respectful, responsible and lovely but I'm not sure being terrified of most people in his life as a child contributed to that!!! Also remember kids should be seen and not heard? Well now kids are allowed be kids. And I'm not head in the sand, yes there is horrendous behaviour out there, but there are also fantastic, helpful, caring, funny, fantastic, lovely kids too!!

Why? My parents both worked , funnily enough both of their parents worked - i work as does my husband…in a multi generation of working parents (both sides) there isn’t any issues. Grandparents raised 5 well adjusted children now nearing retirement and my parents raised 3 girls - who all work whilst being good parents?

Believe me I wasn't having a go at working parents. I work myself albeit part time and freelance. My son went to nursery. But I just think objectively it is bound to be better for children in the early years to be cared for by their parent who is happy in their SAH role than in a nursery. That's only taking the wellbeing of the child into account though. If finances don't allow for it OR neither parent would be happy being at home then of course it is better for the child to be in childcare.

I just know that I used to feel lonely having a working mum (she had to work so this not me blaming her).

Half the thread is people blithely stating that the problem is children aren't afraid of their parents any more.

I think the problem is parents are afraid of their children.

I’ve worked in some tough classes, and it isn’t the SEN children that cause the most problems, it’s NT children whose parents won’t parent.

That said I do think there should be quieter schools especially for those with autism who struggle with change and find noise difficult to concentrate with distractions.

@Torontoflyer

I doubt anyone on here is advocating scaring children are they?

I'm totally fine with kids being scared of the consequences of bad behaviour. I'm not sure its healthy that they grow up thinking they can vandalised stuff, hurt people, steal things with no concern about what might happen if they are caught. Too many children feel untouchable- and other children suffer for it.

The other thing I would say as well if you don’t have to hurt a child to get them to behave.

I have boys and they physically need to burn energy off so yeah I made them walk to school and I may or may not of followed behind them in the car to make sure they got there. They needed lots of food at lunchtime to make sure they weren’t grumpy articles in the afternoon. If they were naughty I made them move the lawn as punishment. I had them out collecting wood for me so I didn’t particularly need, just to give them alone time brooding probably calling me all the names under the sun but by the time they had done their time they were back to being normal humans again.

I suspect the desire many parents have to be their child's best friend and the fear their child won't love or like them if told no might influence some children's behaviour. 'Come on, mate,....don't you think...'

I also have met parents who genuinely never wanted their child to be told no in case it permanently ruined their child hood and optimistically persisted when the evidence demonstrated the profound unhappiness of the child from taking this approach.

potterpants myself and dh were saying the exact same thing, both of us feel guilt that we are so wrecked we're only half the parents we used to be pre exhaustion (me going back to work and dh having to work and do pick ups, homework etc)