Why is children's behaviour worse these days?

[salviapages]

I recently retrained as a primary teacher, did placements in a few schools then worked as a supply teacher so seen a wide range and I've been shocked at the behaviour. Nothing like how I remember kids in my class at primary being.

Every teacher I've spoken to about this says behaviour has gotten worse over the years and I've seen mumsnetters say the same, including in the current thread about teachers leaving the profession.

So - why is this? Have we changed how we raise children? Have schools changed? Why the rise in bad behaviour?

There should be a clear distinction between parent and child. One is in charge, one is not.

"“The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers.”

Socrates

Gentle parenting..

Never saying no ever, so as the child rampages around say the shop or hits friends at play day tea instead of immediately removing said child like a surfboard under an arm it's 'oh darling, we use kind hands, give Billy a hug to say sorry' as if Billy wants a hug after being bashed over the head or pushed over

I think schools are overcrowded and not enough support is given to the children that need it

@ReggaetonLente

We do gentle parenting. It involves firm boundaries while still acknowledging feelings and allowing children to work through and process them.

For example, 3yo DD didn't want to turn off the TV and come and eat her dinner yesterday. Lots of yelling when told it was dinnertime. My mum would have told me tough, life's not fair, now come and eat until you've cleared your plate - and TV turned off. She was a good mum but wanted to be authoritative, when actually she was being authoritarian. I would have felt resentful and angry but knew I had to do what she said because she was an adult basically.

I told my DD that I understood she wanted to carry on watching, and I love that she loves this show, but it was dinner time now and that means TV goes off. Her dinner - lovely fish and rice that she loves - is waiting next door for her and we'll all be there tucking in when she's ready to join us. And left her face down on the sofa.

She wandered through happy as Larry less than a minute later to join us to eat. No shouting, no tension. She knew the score and knew I meant it. It really works for us and she behaves for preschool and my mum as well. It's about understanding the way a family and a society works as a team and their place in that, rather than 'adults tell and I just do'.

It's not just letting them do what they want and it's not the easy way out. Believe me, shouting and laying down illogical rules would take far less effort and self control.

@ReggaetonLente We've always done gentle parenting too and it's great, far less conflict. No shouting.

I've got two autistic DC, one with a PDA profile. I have very firm and clear boundaries and I never say anything I don't mean. I always get complimented on how kind my DC are.

Gentle parenting done properly is excellent parenting. The trouble is that lots of people think they know what they mean by gentle parenting, and usually what they mean is shit parenting. All of the "oh please don't do that" and ignoring children who are misbehaving isn't gentle parenting. Gentle doesn't mean ineffective.

We do gentle/therapeutic parenting, my son is well behaved and well mannered (including when I’m not there).

I run rugby tots in my area, so children 3-7, I’m yet to have any children who haven’t behaved well, have ignored instruction etc.

My son (6) sometimes has a friend round, so far none have behaved poorly, been rude etc.

If behaviour is worse in children and young people now, why are rates of pregnancy, smoking, drinking, drug taking and crime lower than in a very long time?

@Itsbackagain

Parents rarely bring up their children these days - nurseries and childminders do this and they have to go by the book. The 'look' a parent can give, they simply can't.

Yes, it is obviously the fault of the mother.. how dare they go to work.

Doesn't it ever occur to you to wonder why if your generation's parenting was so superior you collectively managed to raise a generation who have chosen pretty resoundingly not to emulate it?

This is a very sweeping statement. I was very well patented (in the 80's) and have tried to take the best from that when raising my own children. I wasn't routinely beaten either. My parents were basically progressive liberals we were consulted on everything and always felt listened to and understood. We were weĺl behaved too apart from a few teenage misdemeanors.

@Refrosty

For half term, I have taken my child to a (pricey) activity in an expensive private school. The school is in the posh/naice end of the wider area. I can tell a lot of these kids know each other from school, but I don't know if it's that exact school. Anyway, it's been worth the cash. The sessions are good. The parents are nice. But interesting observations:

• kids who are older than mine (6) were being dressed by parents. One kid sat next to mine and did all the movements my toddler does when I'm dressing him. It's easy to spot since the children dress/change at the same time, and I'm one of the few parents who is not assisting. My kid is one of the youngest.
• one very unfortunate exchange in the dressing room between a mother and her daughter (daughter showing off in front of friends by belittling/being sarcastic towards the mother, and the mother laughing along with it. I had sympathy for the mother but I could see that child also spoke to some friends with that tone too)
• parent politely asking their toddler to not put the belongings of another person into their mouth, with explanations of why they shouldn't (obviously fell on deaf ears. I have a toddler. I don't ask in these situations, I will take the item from him say something like 'no, that's not yours' or whatever)
• a kid crying when the instructor raised their voice at them (for their own safety!). The parent calming their kid didn't help (a lot 'of oh I'm sorry, that was quite scary wasn't it' etc... erm cuddle them of you need to, but also tell your kid to listen to instructions and not faff about with risky equipment)
• just a lot of explaining of every process, every decision made, all the options, etc. it's weird because in some ways. Maybe I'm just a witch, but I find it all bit much. I do wonder if this is overwhelming for the kids, but I'm sure they're fine and I'm just a witch who explains things sparingly lol.

I don't know about generalised behavioural issues in kids 'nowadays', but it's been 'interesting'. These kids weren't 'bad' just 'inappropriately (or not at all) challenged' by the parents. I've been to similar clubs across the wider area but this one has been a bit of an eye opener.

This is it, the overexplaining of everything! Sometimes children don’t need to identify a feeling, have a rundown on what’s just happened or reject on how someone might feel. They need to be told no. They need to recognise sometimes they and others (so parents model this) say something that’s mean and that’s part of being a human. I say this as a primary teacher. The handwringing that goes on if their child is seen to be in trouble with their parents scrabbling to give a reason as to why their child hit/called someone names, is just depressing. Your child can be a pain just like everyone’s child, it’s normal so do something about it in the moment then move on!

I'm sure everyone has seen this before. While in the past (1950's and certainly prewar) there was probrably too much authoritarian parenting now there is a tendency to be a bit permissive. Both equally harmful in their own way.

I think much behaviour is less considerate these days. Not just kids.

My dd is in year 4 at school. So 8/9 year olds. We have had problems all through this year with bullying and constant disruption in her class. I’ve been into school multiple times for meetings with her teacher and the head. My daughter has said that there is a group of half a dozen children that constantly call out, disrupt lessons, throw chairs, pull display s down, bully her directly and are fighting. I’ve been trying to get my head around this issue. The school have acknowledged that this class is difficult and there has been big behaviour issues. Could it be down to a teacher with poor behaviour management? Maybe there’s a bit of this. I think, but I don’t no for sure that there is a large amount of SEN kids in the class. Probably not enough support and resources. Some of the class have mobile phones and there’s cyber bullying going on. Maybe too much games like fortnite. Parents not accepting that their children are doing wrong. No clear boundaries ect. There seems a mix of working parents and stay at home parents. Now I don’t no if this is a issue generally and this will happen anywhere, but I’m almost at the point of removing my child from this school. It’s an ofsted rated good school and we are in a fairly affluent area. The kids in her class are uncontrollable and have been making my daughters life a misery.

Last week I saw a small child rolling on the floor in Tesco having a massive tantrum, screaming his head off. The mother just standing there ignoring him! I wouldn't have dared behave like that as a child!

Maybe the child was autistic ??

@Itshothothot

Gentle parenting has a lot to answer for.

Children don’t fear their parents these days like they did many years ago.

Many parents give in to their children for an easy life

I mean, I'm pretty happy my kids don't fear me 😂

A teacher of 30 years here. I don’t agree with you. In my experience, behaviour for the vast majority of children in primary schools has improved. Teachers are leaving in droves mainly as a result of management and excessive workloads. Where behaviour is a factor, it’s generally that management don’t support the teachers well.

@lollipoprainbow

Last week I saw a small child rolling on the floor in Tesco having a massive tantrum, screaming his head off. The mother just standing there ignoring him! I wouldn't have dared behave like that as a child!

Maybe the child was autistic ??

Maybe the mother was autistic ? I must say in that situation that you do pick the kids up and remove them from the general public having to listen to it.
It’s generally not gonna help anybody to do nothing

Because parenting is more focused on the children's happiness rather than making them conform and be quiet. 'Gentle' parenting tactics acknowledge that your child will most definitely not be the most well behaved but they will feel contented and accepted for who they are, giving them emotional freedom to grow into who they should actually be, not just a bag of anxiousness trying to not get told off.

It's so many things which have been mentioned already. Essentially various combinations of modern life. Not sure if anyone has mentioned diet or sedentary lifestyles yet? The pressures on working families often means later bedtimes so tired children. More fast food and ready meals meabs more additives, salt, sugar etc in diets. Technology as a massive one in my opinion. I teach in secondary and nothing interests teenagers any more, they are so used to instant gratification with you tube, tik tok etc. Then of it's the jmpact of lots of screen time, playing games above their age, not being out running around.
I also think kids are more spoilt now, they all have smartphones and games consoles, nithing wrong with any of that but I don't think they see the value of things in the same way, lids at my school are quite destructive of school property and equipment. Role models, I teach lots kids who just want to be influencers and don't care about their grades. I also think the school day has become more challenging, teachers are under more pressure than ever to cram so much in and keep up the pace, I think that sometimes the kids need a break.

@ReggaetonLente

We do gentle parenting. It involves firm boundaries while still acknowledging feelings and allowing children to work through and process them.

For example, 3yo DD didn't want to turn off the TV and come and eat her dinner yesterday. Lots of yelling when told it was dinnertime. My mum would have told me tough, life's not fair, now come and eat until you've cleared your plate - and TV turned off. She was a good mum but wanted to be authoritative, when actually she was being authoritarian. I would have felt resentful and angry but knew I had to do what she said because she was an adult basically.

I told my DD that I understood she wanted to carry on watching, and I love that she loves this show, but it was dinner time now and that means TV goes off. Her dinner - lovely fish and rice that she loves - is waiting next door for her and we'll all be there tucking in when she's ready to join us. And left her face down on the sofa.

She wandered through happy as Larry less than a minute later to join us to eat. No shouting, no tension. She knew the score and knew I meant it. It really works for us and she behaves for preschool and my mum as well. It's about understanding the way a family and a society works as a team and their place in that, rather than 'adults tell and I just do'.

It's not just letting them do what they want and it's not the easy way out. Believe me, shouting and laying down illogical rules would take far less effort and self control.

I agree with this. This is how we raised our children too. Gentle parenting, not permissive parenting is very time consuming but the pay off was no toddler tantrums and no teenage strops. Two teens who loads of people comment are extremely polite to their parents because their parents have always been polite to them. Not perfect, but we've never had eye rolls, screaming, flouncing, doors slammed, walk outs, I-hate-you etc - stuff that lots of people say is normal. Gentle parenting is very effective done properly.

My DD is 23 and believe me there were some awful behaved and spoilt children at her primary school in the 2000s.

Last week I saw a small child rolling on the floor in Tesco having a massive tantrum, screaming his head off. The mother just standing there ignoring him! I wouldn't have dared behave like that as a child!

It's not what I do myself but 'just ignore a child having a tantrum' is really, really common advice - and I wouldn't say it's particularly modern or recent advice either. I'm pretty certain that it was the conventional wisdom on what to do when I was a child myself.

@Porcupineintherough

Those are all lovely strategies if you are parent with 1 toddler *@BertieBotts* but less useful in a classroom with 30 15 year olds. There comes a point, and ideally it comes fairly early on, that sometimes you just have to pipe down and follow the rules so that everyone can get on.

I know. I wasn't suggesting they are classroom strategies. Posters were talking about gentle parenting at home, so I was responding with how it can be used in the home. I'm not really up on classroom management techniques but as I said above, probably the real answer is smaller class sizes because at the moment it's like we're expecting the kinder, less harmful discipline techniques to have the same effect as the old fashioned fear based ones and that will never work. We shouldn't go back to fear (IMO) so something else needs to change. Unfortunately I think it's all money - so not sure whether or when it will.

Because a lot of parents have to both work full time so they carry the guilt then don’t want to come home and say no to their kids.

Lack of consequences. Parents too scared to punish their kids. I don’t believe in smacking but just repeatedly say the same thing over and over without doing anything about it.

School there’s a lack of punishment or discipline. My boy is a handful but is general well behaved once warned as he knows I’ll follow through.

School have these two minute chats which he does not care about he can sit there and ignore her. On the third phone call home I told her you are in charge of gi. Whilst he’s at school you need to deal with it. He needs boundaries. Keep him in a break, take golden time off him (year 1) and make him do lines but he needs to know he’s gone to far and a two minute chat he will just switch off.

She couldn’t believe what I was saying. I told her their discipline/behaviour policy is useless.

@DragonOverTheMoon

I think teenage behaviour is much better. Drugs, sex and risk taking behaviours have decreased. I like that we have changed as a society to see that young teenage girls are being abused whereas back in the day it csa wasn't taken seriously.

Primary age DC in my experience are pretty awful now. Rude, answering back - especially rude to parents.

There needs to be a way where dcs needs are met, gentle parenting and learning how to regulate themselves occurs- but with boundaries.

What if there’s a link between the two things? In the sense that if parents rule via fear with younger kids, they’re left without tools to effectively parent teenagers they can’t control in that manner anymore, and teenagers who’re less likely to trust or communicate honestly with them?

That’s definitely something I’ve read in a “progressive” parenting book - that one major goal of the gentle approach many on here distain is having the kind of good relationship with your kids that’s crucial to parenting when they’re teens.