Ukraine-invasion-part-16

[PestorPeston]

Warsaw Russian is letting out a lot of smoke - there has been no decision on who among them will be the next pontiff.

Biden is going there Friday

Is Boris Johnson the designated survivor?

Who the heck let me be in charge?

I don't think our propaganda is anything like as extreme as Russia's. I've been following academics and journalists on Twitter who are specialists in this area (i.e. not just randoms) and Russia has shut down all normal broadcasting to show wall-to-wall propaganda shows, they are telling people America wants to nuke them, that they should nuke Warsaw and that Ukrainian Nazis are crucifying Russian children. They are creating videos with people pretending to be rescued Ukrainians and putting them on the news.

All this talk of 'cancelling' Russia concerns me, after all - they said that the only reason for the use of nuclear force would be if Russia was put at existential risk. This sounds like the building blocks of the lie that Russia is at existential risk.

Seems to me that he's going for something divisive. He knows exactly how things work in the west and how much power the "culture wars" have to split people. I have strong suspicions that he's been behind stoking them in the past using teams of social media trolls or the like. He's hoping this will cause a lot of arguments - I'd like to think that this time it won't work as even the most ardent Rowling-hating TRA will see that comparing her comments and the response to the ACTUAL murder of thousands of innocent civilians is utterly ridiculous. I do however think that suppression of Russian culture (music etc) around Europe is a silly empty gesture that plays right into his rhetoric. I mean... "Russophobia" 🙄 I'd say you couldn't make it up but clearly you can!

I don't think our propaganda is anything like as extreme as Russia's.

Doesn't make it any less effective. Or sinister.

All that have been cancelled are concerts or performances by Russian orchestras and performing companies (like ballet) as part of the sanctions process.

Tchaikovsky, Shostakovich etc have not been cancelled. That's just false information - as just about everyone who contributes to these threads know.

As an example, here was the concert last night by the RSNO (Royal Scottish National Orchestra) in Dundee.

The Russiophobia thing, the other day it was reported that Helsinki University social media/student forums was being bombarded with anti-russian hate speech from both. They suspected its actually the work of Russian trolls, trying to make it look like there's more anti-russian sentiment than there is, to show the West as hating Russia.

@Natsku

The Russiophobia thing, the other day it was reported that Helsinki University social media/student forums was being bombarded with anti-russian hate speech from both. They suspected its actually the work of Russian trolls, trying to make it look like there's more anti-russian sentiment than there is, to show the West as hating Russia.

What you mean Russian backed trolls come into forum and stir up discontent. Surely not.

Shostakovich

"Have you heard any Shostakovich ?"
"No, but I stepped in some on the way here."

(can't remember where I heard that gem ....)

The RSNO obviously hasn't got Putin's memo.....this is planned for next month

James Waterhouse @JamWaterhouse
The UN says it's confirmed 1081 civilian deaths so far.

It's thought to be higher because of the difficulty in reaching some cities - like Mariupol - where a mass grave with up to 200 bodies has been identified.

Idress Ali @idressali114 (reuters)
March 25 (Reuters) - Russia's defence ministry said on Friday that the first phase of its military operation in Ukraine was mostly complete and that it would focus on completely "liberating" eastern Ukraine's Donbass region.

The announcement appeared to indicate that Russia may be switching to more limited goals after running into fierce Ukrainian resistance in the first month of the war.

This is significant.

What you mean Russian backed trolls come into forum and stir up discontent. Surely not.

@DGRossetti

Shostakovich

"Have you heard any Shostakovich ?"
"No, but I stepped in some on the way here."

(can't remember where I heard that gem ....)

Sir Thomas Beecham. Almost a caricature of rudeness. I think it was Stockhausen though, not Shostakovich, who could write a beautiful melody even Beecham couldn't sneer at.

@RedToothBrush

Idress Ali *@idressali114* (reuters) March 25 (Reuters) - Russia's defence ministry said on Friday that the first phase of its military operation in Ukraine was mostly complete and that it would focus on completely "liberating" eastern Ukraine's Donbass region.

The announcement appeared to indicate that Russia may be switching to more limited goals after running into fierce Ukrainian resistance in the first month of the war.

This is significant.

Oh god I’m turning into one of those posters. Was so pleased to see you thought so 😂

Christopher Miller @christopherJM
Potential shift in Russia's military operation after month of things going very wrong for Moscow & fierce Ukrainian resistance: General Staff says not ruling out "storming" Kyiv, Kharkiv, other key cities but with 1st phase complete will focus on "complete liberation of Donbas"

Chief of the Main Operational Directorate of Russia's General Staff Col. Gen. Sergei Rudskoy claims the "special military operation" ordered by Putin had two "options": Limit operation to Donbas or attack across all Ukraine...

Rudskoy said Russia chose to attack across all Ukraine in order to stretch Ukrainian forces thin so they couldn't reinforce forces in the Donbas. But that goes against what we've seen & seems to be face-saving comment after an embarrassing performance, failure to secure victory.

Rudskoy claims Rus never intended to storm Kyiv, etc. & falsely states all "Kyiv, Kharkiv, Chernihiv, Sumy and Mykolaiv" are "blocked" by Russian forces. Russia does control large areas near those key cities & still pounds them with artillery.

Rudskoy says "Kherson & most of the Zaporizhia region are under full control." Again, he claims this was planned all along, and that controlling these areas now will help as Russia focuses its attention on capturing all of the Donbas.

Rudskoy also claims the Russian military "defeated 16 major military airfields in Ukraine" and "39 storage bases and arsenals...which contained up to 70% of all stocks of military equipment, materiel, and fuel, as well as more than 1 million 54 thousand tons of ammunition."

We'll see if changes on the ground in coming days indeed show a shift in Russia's focus and switch to more limited goals after a disastrous military performance that's seen 1000s of troops killed & wounded, 1000s more weapons destroyed & lost, & goal of Kyiv's surrender fail.

Here's a link to Interfax's report with Rudskoy's comments, which were also reported by RT Russian and other state-run outlets:
www.interfax-russia.ru/main/genshtab-rf-rossiyskie-voennye-skoncentriruyutsya-na-polnom-osvobozhdenii-donbassa

sorry, I can't see where it says about the Kremlin tallking about holding the Donbas region. Sometimes we don't see exactly the same as Uk based people. Could someone link it please?

[quote RedToothBrush]Christopher Miller @christopherJM
Potential shift in Russia's military operation after month of things going very wrong for Moscow & fierce Ukrainian resistance: General Staff says not ruling out "storming" Kyiv, Kharkiv, other key cities but with 1st phase complete will focus on "complete liberation of Donbas"

Chief of the Main Operational Directorate of Russia's General Staff Col. Gen. Sergei Rudskoy claims the "special military operation" ordered by Putin had two "options": Limit operation to Donbas or attack across all Ukraine...

Rudskoy said Russia chose to attack across all Ukraine in order to stretch Ukrainian forces thin so they couldn't reinforce forces in the Donbas. But that goes against what we've seen & seems to be face-saving comment after an embarrassing performance, failure to secure victory.

Rudskoy claims Rus never intended to storm Kyiv, etc. & falsely states all "Kyiv, Kharkiv, Chernihiv, Sumy and Mykolaiv" are "blocked" by Russian forces. Russia does control large areas near those key cities & still pounds them with artillery.

Rudskoy says "Kherson & most of the Zaporizhia region are under full control." Again, he claims this was planned all along, and that controlling these areas now will help as Russia focuses its attention on capturing all of the Donbas.

Rudskoy also claims the Russian military "defeated 16 major military airfields in Ukraine" and "39 storage bases and arsenals...which contained up to 70% of all stocks of military equipment, materiel, and fuel, as well as more than 1 million 54 thousand tons of ammunition."

We'll see if changes on the ground in coming days indeed show a shift in Russia's focus and switch to more limited goals after a disastrous military performance that's seen 1000s of troops killed & wounded, 1000s more weapons destroyed & lost, & goal of Kyiv's surrender fail.

Here's a link to Interfax's report with Rudskoy's comments, which were also reported by RT Russian and other state-run outlets:
www.interfax-russia.ru/main/genshtab-rf-rossiyskie-voennye-skoncentriruyutsya-na-polnom-osvobozhdenii-donbassa[/quote]
I can't remember which analysis said that when Putin wanted an off-ramp, he would find it himself. I wonder whether that's what's happening here.

oh cross posted with RTB, never mind !

@RedToothBrush what do you anticipate being the change, if any, on the ground?

https://news.sky.com/story/jk-rowling-responds-to-vladimir-putin-after-russian-president-said-author-was-cancelled-12574969 JK Rowling hits back at Vladimir Putin after he drags her into row over 'cancelling Russian culture'

@RedToothBrush

Idress Ali *@idressali114* (reuters) March 25 (Reuters) - Russia's defence ministry said on Friday that the first phase of its military operation in Ukraine was mostly complete and that it would focus on completely "liberating" eastern Ukraine's Donbass region.

The announcement appeared to indicate that Russia may be switching to more limited goals after running into fierce Ukrainian resistance in the first month of the war.

This is significant.

Pause in the north around Kiyv while they move more troops and equipment in. Over a longer period of time. Bet you.

I can't remember which analysis said that when Putin wanted an off-ramp, he would find it himself. I wonder whether that's what's happening here.

I bloody hope so 🙏

ONce the war ends one way or another - I wonder if his restrictions on Western media and social media will ease up? If so, there's going to be information flowing in again.

The fierce part of me hopes that the Ukrainians keep going until every last Russian soldier is driven out of Ukraine but given how many lives would be lost maybe it is better to settle early rather than late :(

I think it was Stockhausen though, not Shostakovich

Ah, rings a bell now

I do think we shouldn’t underestimate that the relationship between the west and Russia has changed (again) on a fundamental level.