Ukraine Invasion Part 14

[MagicFox]

New thread

@Igotjelly

Yeh Poland and Denmark aren’t proposing going it alone, they’re bringing a proposal of a NATO peacekeeping mission to a meeting of the Security Council.

Exactly, if Twitter or anyone else are saying they're sending in peace keeping forces on their own it's mis-reporting or poor headlines. They have never said this.

Now imagining Twitter sending it its own peace keeping forces.....

Personally at this stage, from a UK perspective, there is so much more we can be doing to support the Ukrainian people. This includes those refugees trying to get to the UK. It’s absolutely shameful the hoops they are currently having to jump through. We need to sort our own shit out before we go guns blazing into anywhere else.

[quote PaperTyger]@Alexandra2001

Yes that's right.
As I keep repeating, it looks like a break away of individual countries going in as a peaceful mission.
Poland, Denmark etc.[/quote]
.... i think you need to look at the military capability of these countries

[quote PaperTyger]@Alexandra2001

Yes that's right.
As I keep repeating, it looks like a break away of individual countries going in as a peaceful mission.
Poland, Denmark etc.[/quote]
It really isn’t.

I wasnt aware she even had a heart.

7 NATO countries have Said they would back,go in as a peace mission.

Or within a polish lead peace mission.
Ideas being floated.

@Igotjelly

Does anyone else struggle to believe Russia’s claims of successfully using a hypersonic missile, has the faint whiff of bullshit about it…

They probably did use it. A weapon increases its desirability if it has been tested in the theatre of war conflict.

www.dailysabah.com/world/europe/hypersonic-missiles-used-in-western-ukraine-says-russia

I've seen a couple of reports that say one was used on 10th March, not verifiable. Other think yesterday was first use. After the crap they have had with some of their equipment, they need to test every thing.
Even Putin must have noticed by now that some of his YES men have been telling porkies about the hardware's condition.

@Igotjelly

Does anyone else struggle to believe Russia’s claims of successfully using a hypersonic missile, has the faint whiff of bullshit about it…

I haven’t looked at the details of the report (yet) but TBF some of their short range ballistic missiles that we know have already been used in this conflict can be hypersonic (I.e. traveling at >= Mach 5 ) at some point in their trajectory..

The devil may be in the detail of exactly what was claimed…

“ScrollingLeaves

This morning on the World Service radio there was an American speaking who said he thought it had been a mistake for NATO not to have created a protective no fly zone over Ukraine before Russia invaded their territory. He asked what could Russia have said? You can’t do that because we want to attack? ( My paraphrase.) He said he felt we were being reactive rather than proactive which was a mistake. Unfortunately I missed his name. Did anyone else hear?

I thought perhaps his approach might coincide in some way with the suggestions I have just been reading here about a peace keeping mission.”

The programme was “Newshour” on the World Service. The person speaking was the former Supreme Commander of NATO forces, Wesley Clark. He came on 9.47 minutes in. This of course is simply his point of view rather than an official plan, but perhaps worth hearing. Interestingly, I saw in Wikipedia, his paternal grandparents had emigrated to America from Belarus.

@PaperTyger

On the flip side.

What is the word to describe people trapped under rubble in the theatre? With hand to hand fighting all around them?

Slow death? Fanciful?

It's really sad and in no way including posters because we all know the difficulty here but isn't that sad.

We have the man power, superior, the arms, superior, everything to go in and save those people under the theatre but it's fanciful to suggest it.
When Putin has hired ruthless fighters to Keep those people stuck under ground with fighting all around them.

If we went in likely we wouldn't save them though

Some of the Ukrainian MP interview by Matt Frei this morning mobile.twitter.com/LBC/status/1505131387992657923

The only person who could allow help into the besieged cities is putin. He could give the order for cease fire and it would all stop. He could tell his soldiers to stop shooting fleeing civilians and they’d be safe to get out or get bread or whatever. He could tell his troops to let the humanitarian aid convoys in. He could do so much.

A cease fire needs to come from putin, asking Ukraine to stop when he hasn’t is like asking a child to lie down and take the punches and kicks from a bully without shouting or fighting back. There are no two sides to this. The aid convoys are trying to get in but are being attacked by the Russians.

Re thermobaric bombs have been asked about a few times in this last couple of threads. As far as I’m aware the Ukrainians captured at least one of the launchers for these. It was also verified in the early days that Russia had used them. Then Russia started indiscriminately bombing and flattening cities. It doesn’t really matter what sort of bomb they use, dead is still dead. Trapped is still trapped.

@Igotjelly

Does anyone else struggle to believe Russia’s claims of successfully using a hypersonic missile, has the faint whiff of bullshit about it…

Agree -it's just classic intimidation tactics.

No one asks Ukraine to stop fighting and no one waits for Putin to stop the attack.. they go in to target humanitarian crisis pinch points, armed and in number's.
Attack us Putin and we attack back, but we are here to rescue.

If Putin and Ukraine want to keep fighting around them they can. it's Putin's Risk I'f his troops kill someone from Poland etc

@elephantmarchingin

About testing weopons etc in actual use - apparently the T-14 tank has turbine parts that only two places in the world make. One is in Germany one in ... Ukraine.

I imagine they'll want to keep the T-14 under dust covers for a while.

Assad visited the Crown Prince of UAE yesterday. An unpleasant alignment is being made.

I've been reading about the Russian treatment of people in the Donbas region and Crimea since 2014. Any peace treaty which concedes those regions to Russia is condemning people to a future of disappearances, rape, torture, executions and prison camps (and that's the best case scenario.) No wonder Ukrainians are fighting so hard.

The US has had a Global Hawk (a high-altitude, remotely-piloted surveillance aircraft) up for over 24 hours, it is just back in Sicily now. They will know what the Russians have been firing. They might not choose to tell us.

These planes can fly for 30 hours, unmanned, quite remarkable.

it's Putin's Risk I'f his troops kill someone from Poland etc
Realistically if that happens, nothing will come of it, see all the other peacekeeping missions where troops get killed, it just likely ends with them being pulled out as it's not safe for them to operate in a peacekeeping capacity as the other option is they start fighting in the actual war which is what the rest of the world wants to avoid.

The axis of evil potential makes me want to 🤮

@PaperTyger

No one asks Ukraine to stop fighting and no one waits for Putin to stop the attack.. they go in to target humanitarian crisis pinch points, armed and in number's. Attack us Putin and we attack back, but we are here to rescue.

If Putin and Ukraine want to keep fighting around them they can. it's Putin's Risk I'f his troops kill someone from Poland etc

This wouldn't work like that though!

A Twitter person to follow twitter.com/IuliiaMendel
ex Spokesperson to the President of Ukraine.
Facts according to the Ukrainians in English.
She avoids gory images.

[quote PaperTyger]@Alexandra2001

Yes that's right.
As I keep repeating, it looks like a break away of individual countries going in as a peaceful mission.
Poland, Denmark etc.[/quote]
It was said at a meeting by one of the Polish leader I think, but I think they meant UN peacekeeping.

NATO going in under any guise would be a red rag to a bull. If ceasefire terms are agreed it is quite feasible that the UN could and should go in with Russia's agreement. There are a lot of normal people with guns, there is Azoz to consider, there are the trenches and war zone of Donbas, all of which would need to be cleared, disarmed. Not to mention the re-building.

Presumbably you are potentially looking at the same forces, but under UN mandate not NATO mandate.

This was my assumption, I might be wrong.

@PaperTyger

No one asks Ukraine to stop fighting and no one waits for Putin to stop the attack.. they go in to target humanitarian crisis pinch points, armed and in number's. Attack us Putin and we attack back, but we are here to rescue.

If Putin and Ukraine want to keep fighting around them they can. it's Putin's Risk I'f his troops kill someone from Poland etc

Appreciate your passion on this but without US backing, there is simply not the numbers of NATO troops to do this, i don't people quite realise the cuts we have had across Europe in defence..

I was in Namibia when UNTAG deployed, there needs to be a peace to keep first or one imposed such as in the ex Yugoslavia.

If the Russians are bringing in supplies via the rails in Eastern Ukraine, does anyone know why the Ukrainians haven't blown the rails up?

@PestorPeston

A Twitter person to follow twitter.com/IuliiaMendel ex Spokesperson to the President of Ukraine. Facts according to the Ukrainians in English. She avoids gory images.

Thank you 😊