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Ukrainian invasion part 13

999 replies

Alexandra2001 · 15/03/2022 07:40

Seems to be required.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
18
DGRossetti · 15/03/2022 10:28

Regarding DC, there is a very old adage that you don't discard tools because you don't like their design. Which is a point of view a lot of people should really consider when they are bewailing the fact they can't find a political party that thinks exactly as they do.

Sideorderofchips · 15/03/2022 10:30

twitter account has gone

DrBlackbird · 15/03/2022 10:31

What an utter dickhead Cummings is. His writings are the equivalent of "Look at me, I’m sooo smart. Everyone else is sooo thick." Yes, thanks to you dickhead, we have another one leading the country during the worst series of crises we’ve experienced for decades.

Even if we avoid general war the effects of recent events on energy, food markets and so on will be profound. Sharp sudden price rises for food have often sparked revolutions, e.g 1848

But of course when he makes such a pronouncement, we must all realise that this is not ‘thrashing around in an emotional spasm’, but obviously his calm, measured and informed analysis. For which we’re meant to thankful. Hmm

MarshaBradyo · 15/03/2022 10:33

@DrBlackbird

What an utter dickhead Cummings is. His writings are the equivalent of "Look at me, I’m sooo smart. Everyone else is sooo thick." Yes, thanks to you dickhead, we have another one leading the country during the worst series of crises we’ve experienced for decades.

Even if we avoid general war the effects of recent events on energy, food markets and so on will be profound. Sharp sudden price rises for food have often sparked revolutions, e.g 1848

But of course when he makes such a pronouncement, we must all realise that this is not ‘thrashing around in an emotional spasm’, but obviously his calm, measured and informed analysis. For which we’re meant to thankful. Hmm

😂 glad to find someone who feels the same way
DuncinToffee · 15/03/2022 10:36

@Sideorderofchips

twitter account has gone
The @MarinaOvsyy account was previously flagged as Juan Arrendondo (an American journalist wounded in Ukraine, alongside Brent Renaud who was killed).

Why do this? It's incredibly ghoulish.

twitter.com/newschambers/status/1503679145628286977?s=21

thereisonlyoneofme · 15/03/2022 10:37

Macron has gone all macho and copying Zelensky!

Tuba437 · 15/03/2022 10:38

Interesting from one of zelenskeys advisors saying the war will either be over in the next week or 2 if these peace talks are successful. If not he expects a second wave of attacks and the war to be over by early May following more peace talks after the second wave.

Snuginagrobag · 15/03/2022 10:39

Placemarking again!

DuncinToffee · 15/03/2022 10:40

EU passes ban on exporting luxury goods to Russia

Jessica Parker' BBC News, Brussels

The EU has unveiled its fourth package of sanctions against the Kremlin. It's targeting luxury goods exports as well as investments in Russia's energy sector.

More oligarchs and people who spread so-called "disinformation" will be added to the list of individuals subject to EU asset freezes. Sources have told the BBC that list will include Chelsea football club owner Roman Abramovich, who's already been sanctioned by the UK.

There'll also be a ban on exporting luxury goods, such as expensive cars and jewellery, to Russia. Also, restrictions on the import of Russian steel products and on new investments in the Russian energy sector.

While the EU has gone further and faster on sanctions than many expected, diplomats have told the BBC of an increasingly evident rift; between Poland and Baltic states - who want ever stronger measures - versus a more cautious approach favoured by countries such as Germany and Italy.

DuncinToffee · 15/03/2022 10:44

Lewis Goodall @lewis_goodall

NEW: UN says that nearly 3 million people have fled Ukraine since the start of the war. 3 million in 3 weeks. That’s 7% of Ukraine’s prewar population.

1.8 million have fled to Poland.

Idroppedthescrewinthetuna · 15/03/2022 10:51

@Sideorderofchips

twitter account has gone
What do you mean?
DuncinToffee · 15/03/2022 10:56

Sideorderofchips
twitter account has gone

What do you mean?

The account was a fake and Twitter has removed it.

Damnloginpopup · 15/03/2022 10:57

Twitter account hasn't gone. It's showing to me as flagged for unusual activity - do not assume that she has any input on it. Do not hope for or expect good news for that poor, courageous girl. Her life ended the moment she made her stand. Whether she lives or dies her life is over.

So brave. So tragic.

RedToothBrush · 15/03/2022 11:00

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-60749863
Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe has UK passport returned, MP says

She has been detained in Iran for more than five years on spying charges after being arrested there in 2016 while taking her daughter to see her family.

Tulip Siddiq said Mrs Zaghari-Ratcliffe was still at her family home in Tehran.

The Foreign Office said it would not comment on speculation but had long called for the release of "unfairly detained British nationals in Iran".

Things. Happening. Diplomacy. Iran Again. Why now?

DuncinToffee · 15/03/2022 11:05

Things. Happening. Diplomacy. Iran Again. Why now?

Oil

52andblue · 15/03/2022 11:14

I was interested to Cummings thoughts above.
I think he views himself as a super-bright 'outsider' who wishes to change structures to improve things for everyone (& get kudos for that).
Actually, he is just 'an emotional spasm' made flesh, thrashing around, creating chaos. Johnson is similar in a way - his character flaws affecting the world at large. And Putin's character flaws affect us all.

RedToothBrush · 15/03/2022 11:21

Cummings believes everything is broken so the solution is to burn it all down and start again.

This is fundamentally flawed as it causes power vaccums and plays to disaster capitalism. Disaster capitalism is a gift to the ultra rich at the expense of everyone else or gives opportunities for thugs and con artists.

Post cold war Russia was founded on disaster capitalism.

He isn't wrong about many of our problems in society. His 'solution' is about as fucked in the head as it comes though.

DesdamonasHandkerchief · 15/03/2022 11:27

@MarshaBradyo

Over 44000 have signed up to refugee home scheme

Has anyone here? Out of interest

Do other countries do the financial support

I have, but we're not in a town and I'm unsure of how to 'find' my own refugee! I've signed up to a couple of Facebook groups that help with this. I'm nervous it will be very difficult, we'll be potentially dealing with young children (it's a long time since I've had children living in the house!) and grieving people who have left loved ones behind in life threatening conditions, not to mention the mechanics of sharing our home with strangers but it felt like the least we could do. I'd be lying if I didn't admit that I'm hoping it will be a short term solution however, and that the Ukrainians will be able to go back to their country and start the rebuilding process sooner rather than later, but we're all hoping for that anyway I guess, this would just be another reason to hope for it.
DesdamonasHandkerchief · 15/03/2022 11:33

On the support front I heard Poland were offering around £9 a day equivalent, but that's from memory.
We were going to offer a room without the financial support but if we do host a refugee/refugees we will probably use the money to source an old car for them assuming they can drive.

Yeahthat · 15/03/2022 11:35

@ClaudineClare

Ages ago I signed up to Dominic Cumming's substack thing out of curiosity, but wasn't prepared to pay for the privilege of reading his long essays, so didn't bother further. I got this email last week, I though some might be interested in reading his ramblings...although a lot of it seems to be "I was right!" there are some interesting bits.

Twitter is great for tracking news in some fields. In some Twitter communities there are intelligent, insightful, good-faith discussions. It’s appalling for politics and intolerable during a war. Westminster is addicted to it. The addiction adds to the worst dynamics of the old media organisations: constant hysteria, distortion, the collapse of standards for judging ‘facts’, a desperate search for clicks, no explanations of (or even interest in) the real wiring of power deep in the system, international relations and war reduced to stories much more simplistic than the classic fairy tales we read to children

Much more ‘news’ is invented than people realise. It was clearly worse in summer 2019 than 2016. It got worse in 2020. And it’s always worse in a war. Many front page stories are pure inventions. Many senior western journalists now retweet army training scenes from years ago and literally video game footage as if it’s ‘heroic UKR defence’ — some of them do this while also pontificating on ‘disinformation’ and ‘what a heroic job the media is doing’*

As the media thrashes around in one emotional spasm after another, herding towards some conventional wisdom then, after a spasm, herding in a new direction, the narrative whiplash intensifies: closing the borders is racist against China… closing the borders is obviously sensible only Brexit idiots oppose it… masks don’t work … wear masks or you’re evil… ‘the rule of law’ is fundamental, ‘process’ is good… seize the evil’s people stuff now, ‘process’ is an intolerable smokescreen… sanctions won’t hurt normal Russians just the regime … we’ll use sanctions to wreck their economy and anti-war Russians (the most anti-Putin!) must be booted out of everything from chess to opera (even though it’s what Putin wants us to do)… it’s an invasion, he wants millions of Ukrainians in Russia… it’s genocide, he wants to kill all the Ukrainians…

Many of them are now cheerleading for things like a ‘no fly zone’ in total ignorance of the history of nuclear near-misses and how lucky we were to survive the Cold War. They’re emotional and they’ve spent years venting their emotions on Twitter … do something, don’t worry about nuclear war because … err… ‘World War Three has already started’! Imagine what the survivors of nuclear holocaust would make of that meme

Advice: only use Twitter with Lists on something like Tweetdeck. I have lists for e.g science, national security/military/intel, finance, and I have a specific list for politicians and political journalists so I only see them when I want to

The current situation could escalate towards a general war. In summer 1914 we had a much more serious set of people in crucial jobs and the crisis moved much slower than a nuclear crisis does. They were overwhelmed by scale, speed and complexity and made disastrous decisions. Those in charge in the west now, such as Biden and Boris, are an order of magnitude less serious/competent. They’re dealing with something moving potentially hundreds of times faster than summer 1914 (decisions on nuclear weapons potentially have to be made in minutes) with potential casualties on the scale of ~billion. For years I’ve warned that this scale, speed and complexity — systems problems requiring systems thinking — is far beyond the capabilities of our critical institutions which would collapse in a major crisis. Covid proved the point. But of course these critical institutions have not changed

In the UK the situation is worse than in spring 2020 because a lot of very able people came to help then, they’ve almost all gone and the few left are marginalised and/or looking for other jobs. Rather than changing the institutions, in the UK the PM has led a campaign to rewrite the history of covid and the collapse of No10 and the Cabinet Office. This has guaranteed no learning from the collapse. The broken No10/Cabinet Office system — a system that cannot communicate the most simple things, never mind execute something hard — is now responsible for signals concerning nuclear escalation

Even if we avoid general war the effects of recent events on energy, food markets and so on will be profound. Sharp sudden price rises for food have often sparked revolutions, e.g 1848. Huge economic disruption is colliding with a) deluded energy policies in the west for 20 years, b) over a decade of roughly zero/negative real interest rates (unprecedented in centuries), and c) supply chains already reeling from covid and changes in China
dominiccummings.substack.com/p/dan-wang-and-ryan-petersen-on-china?s=w

© 2022 Dominic Cummings

Interesting post. Particularly like the part about the narrative whiplash. Cummings is bang on here.
MarshaBradyo · 15/03/2022 11:38

It’s weird how Cummings has become the person for the left and now he has takers in that sphere.

He plays anyone who listens like a fiddle

MarshaBradyo · 15/03/2022 11:40

On the plus side he seems content with blog posts now rather than actually in number 10

TheOnlyMrsMac · 15/03/2022 11:41

The BBC are reporting that Marina has been detained and her lawyer cannot find her.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-60749279

DGRossetti · 15/03/2022 11:44

@RedToothBrush

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-60749863 Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe has UK passport returned, MP says

She has been detained in Iran for more than five years on spying charges after being arrested there in 2016 while taking her daughter to see her family.

Tulip Siddiq said Mrs Zaghari-Ratcliffe was still at her family home in Tehran.

The Foreign Office said it would not comment on speculation but had long called for the release of "unfairly detained British nationals in Iran".

Things. Happening. Diplomacy. Iran Again. Why now?

If nothing else, the current situation has given a lot of "enemies of democracy" an unexpected shot at redemption. What better way to distract from all the unpleasant things you get up to in the shadows if you're being praised for joining the club.

Going back to WW2, the USSR were our besties, just as long as they were anti-fascist. Then the whole world order changed, and as long as you were "anti-communist" you were automatically BFFs with the US of A. As the parade of failed totalitarian regimes propped up in the name of "democracy" shows.

Yeahthat · 15/03/2022 11:55

@DGRossetti

Exactly. As the saying goes - there are no permanent allies or enemies in international politics; the only permanent is self-interest (or something along those lines).

The government has to make rational choices to maximise our self-interest whilse balancing that with our ideals.

Another example of this is US officials recently meeting with Venezuelan officials in Caracas.