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Being curious how many of you are thinking to vote Labour in May election just as a revenge to the superiority that carried by Tory?

449 replies

Return2thebasic · 13/03/2022 12:42

I haven't done my research yet, so can't say certainly I'd do it. But they're lots of things we are not happy with the local council. Usually may not warrant a change of vote (probably just not bother to vote). But the whole partygate thing made me almost determined to vote Labour in May.

Tory didn't care what the public feel or think, carrying on to find excuses for their corrupted government. And that guy, that guy who's born as a natural lier, I can't even bear to hear his voice anymore. Something needs to be done, when their party refuse to change or at least show the public their remorse. I feel I need to do something.

How many of you feel the same?

OP posts:
RemusLupinsBiggestGroupie · 14/03/2022 19:34

Yes, it's bigger than changing rooms - but that's what some people are citing as the reason for their feelings.

Women are potentially in danger from men every day (as are men, to be fair). Nothing here is convincing me that women are in more danger from people who have chosen to self identify as a woman than they are from men.

I really do think that MN has more than its fair share of transphobia, and that scares me.

KittenKong · 14/03/2022 19:48

Offending rates are the same - what don’t you understand? Males are emboldened to attack a woman’s March against violence against women - strutting around in a thin dress with his penis bulging. Gets a finger wag from the police.

Doesn’t that concern you that womens marches and rallies are attacked - these are protests against violence (3 women a week murdered in the U.K. - mostly by men) and some people just make it all about them, and are green lighted by the police to launch an attack when women are held in a cell for stickers that protest DV?

Whatdidisay · 14/03/2022 19:53

The amount of posters who seem angry that women won't vote for their party of choice because of their stance on a particular policy is laughable, you do know that people can vote for whoever they want and no amount of foot stamping, expressing your disappointment or belittling their reasons will chance their minds.
Women's rights are hanging over a cliff atm and many women will rightly do everything they can to stop them tumbling down.

RufustheFloralmissingreindeer · 14/03/2022 19:57

no amount of foot stamping, expressing your disappointment or belittling their reasons will chance their minds

In fact it may well make them more determined

MarshaBradyo · 14/03/2022 19:59

@RufustheFloralmissingreindeer

no amount of foot stamping, expressing your disappointment or belittling their reasons will chance their minds

In fact it may well make them more determined

True. Voting preference based on what you hold important is worth fighting for.

All the insults etc just put me off

Greenfields124 · 14/03/2022 19:59

@KittenKong

Offending rates are the same - what don’t you understand? Males are emboldened to attack a woman’s March against violence against women - strutting around in a thin dress with his penis bulging. Gets a finger wag from the police.

Doesn’t that concern you that womens marches and rallies are attacked - these are protests against violence (3 women a week murdered in the U.K. - mostly by men) and some people just make it all about them, and are green lighted by the police to launch an attack when women are held in a cell for stickers that protest DV?

They don't want to understand or listen..

I think that's the crux of it.

Greenfields124 · 14/03/2022 20:00

@Whatdidisay

The amount of posters who seem angry that women won't vote for their party of choice because of their stance on a particular policy is laughable, you do know that people can vote for whoever they want and no amount of foot stamping, expressing your disappointment or belittling their reasons will chance their minds. Women's rights are hanging over a cliff atm and many women will rightly do everything they can to stop them tumbling down.
Totally agree.
BlueSlate · 14/03/2022 20:05

@RemusLupinsBiggestGroupie

Yes, it's bigger than changing rooms - but that's what some people are citing as the reason for their feelings.

Women are potentially in danger from men every day (as are men, to be fair). Nothing here is convincing me that women are in more danger from people who have chosen to self identify as a woman than they are from men.

I really do think that MN has more than its fair share of transphobia, and that scares me.

Unfortunately, I'm not able to cite a source but theist recent stats I read were that 50% of TW in prison are there for sexual offences against women. That's far higher than the % of men in the general male population who are in there for sexual offences, which is around 11%.
BlueSlate · 14/03/2022 20:06

And that 11% is all sex offences against anyone.

KittenKong · 14/03/2022 20:07

And of course we can’t split the ‘genuine’ from the ‘bad faith’ because we can’t ask can we? We have to take people at their word - purely so. Maybe those rates are higher because - not here’s a radical thought - sex offenders aren’t the nicest or most honest people on the planet and might make up fibs for what they think is a ‘softer’ jail option or to gain access to women (and children) who can’t escape from them.

teawamutu · 14/03/2022 20:10

@RemusLupinsBiggestGroupie

Yes, it's bigger than changing rooms - but that's what some people are citing as the reason for their feelings.

Women are potentially in danger from men every day (as are men, to be fair). Nothing here is convincing me that women are in more danger from people who have chosen to self identify as a woman than they are from men.

I really do think that MN has more than its fair share of transphobia, and that scares me.

The point is, all the available data suggests the risk is the same.

I.e., all the reasons we have single sex spaces in the first place do not magically disappear on the basis of the feeling in the male's head.

Safeguarding is based on anticipating and mitigating, not 'ah it'll probably be grand most of the time'. And women are not validation accessories, support humans or shields.

OvaHere · 14/03/2022 20:14

@RemusLupinsBiggestGroupie

Yes, it's bigger than changing rooms - but that's what some people are citing as the reason for their feelings.

Women are potentially in danger from men every day (as are men, to be fair). Nothing here is convincing me that women are in more danger from people who have chosen to self identify as a woman than they are from men.

I really do think that MN has more than its fair share of transphobia, and that scares me.

It's not all about danger though, whether real or perceived. That's just part of it although I would point out that in the case of prisons and refuges the danger is very much real. Women have been and are currently being harmed in the worst imaginable ways in the countries that lock up violent male sex offender and murderers with women on the basis of self identity.

It's also about privacy and dignity. On a day to day basis I don't feel in any particular danger from my brother in law or the guy who delivers the post but I sure as hell wouldn't strip naked next to them in the female change rooms. Women and girls have a right to feel comfortable in our own spaces.

In addition to that there's the issue of fairness and structural inequality that isn't fully addressed for women yet.

It's not fair when men take women's spaces in sport, take our medals, records, sponsorships and scholarships with ease. What happens to the women and girls who have devoted thousands of hours of training to be the best they can just to have a low ranking (in men's leagues) person waltz in and clean up. This isn't a hypothetical scenario it's something happening right now.

Ditto when awards that should have gone to women go to men who have barely 'lived as a woman' for a year. To men who are 'gender fluid' and pick which day of the week they feel like a woman.

Or perhaps even worse we lose women's categories altogether in favour of the nebulous gender neutral category which almost always ends up being very male centric (no matter the identity of the men).

Can you truly say none of it bothers you at all?

-A vulnerable woman in California (or insert other country) who may already have experienced abuse in her life ends up in prison due to debt or drug offences and is expected to shower and sleep next to a convicted male rapist because he told the prison authorities he felt like a woman.

  • Women losing their jobs and being hounded out of public life because they believe in biological sex and that women exist as a sex category.
  • Young women being silenced by their sports coaches and sporting authorities and being too scared to speak out other than in complete anonymity about the man dominating their swimming competition and making them uncomfortable in the change room by exposing himself. The whole time people are falling over themselves to laud him as brave and give him magazine covers whilst the young women feel desperate and terrified that this is being done to them.

So absolutely none of this makes you think for even a second "Is this something that should be happening to women and girls? Is it right that they have so little power or agency that even things designed with them in mind can be taken away if a man wants it?"

RemusLupinsBiggestGroupie · 14/03/2022 20:30

I don't agree that convicted rapists should ever be able to mingle with women in a women's prison, no.

I'm out of here now. I still find it alarming that so many people are dismissing Labour whilst not considering the stance, if any, of other parties.

And I still think a lot of what I'm reading here is transphobia, sometimes with genuine seeming concerns behind it and sometimes totally blatant.

Just be prepared for plenty more shite if you choose to vote Tory.

MarshaBradyo · 14/03/2022 20:32

And I still think a lot of what I'm reading here is transphobia, sometimes with genuine seeming concerns behind it and sometimes totally blatant.

This is a mistake imo

It is protecting women’s rights that is fundamental to me.

RufustheFloralmissingreindeer · 14/03/2022 20:36

I don't agree that convicted rapists should ever be able to mingle with women in a women's prison, no

Some people would absolutely call you transphobic for saying that

OvaHere · 14/03/2022 20:38

I don't agree that convicted rapists should ever be able to mingle with women in a women's prison, no.

So why, in your opinion, is it something that's happening then? Why are women attacked and called bigots for raising concerns?

My own opinion is that it's the natural end point of pretending people can meaningfully change sex and that someone's own self perception matters more than any kind of reality. That any harms arising from that should be chalked up to necessary collateral damage in the pursuit of 'trans rights'.

EdgeOfACoin · 14/03/2022 20:55

I don't agree that convicted rapists should ever be able to mingle with women in a women's prison, no.

Lisa Nandy would disagree with you on that. She is on film stating that all prisoners should be housed according to their gender identity. This came out during the Labour leadership campaign.

You can look it up on YouTube.

I've been thoroughly unimpressed by Labour in this issue. I also have a young daughter I need to consider.

I won't be voting Labour.

BlueSlate · 14/03/2022 21:04

@KittenKong

And of course we can’t split the ‘genuine’ from the ‘bad faith’ because we can’t ask can we? We have to take people at their word - purely so. Maybe those rates are higher because - not here’s a radical thought - sex offenders aren’t the nicest or most honest people on the planet and might make up fibs for what they think is a ‘softer’ jail option or to gain access to women (and children) who can’t escape from them.
Quite...
TooBigForMyBoots · 14/03/2022 21:36

TooBigForMyBoots
So he waffled and refused to say that only women have a cervix. Ok.

Yeah. If you only read that one line... Do we have to keep banging on about context?

He did not conflate sex and gender and, unlike Starmer, made no stupid comment about the word woman including any man who wants to use it.

I read the whole article @SamphiretheStickerist. He waffled, was noncommittal and refused to say that only women had cervixes. He threw some crumbs and you're stretching for them.

SamphiretheStickerist · 15/03/2022 08:38

@TooBigForMyBoots

TooBigForMyBoots So he waffled and refused to say that only women have a cervix. Ok.

Yeah. If you only read that one line... Do we have to keep banging on about context?

He did not conflate sex and gender and, unlike Starmer, made no stupid comment about the word woman including any man who wants to use it.

I read the whole article @SamphiretheStickerist. He waffled, was noncommittal and refused to say that only women had cervixes. He threw some crumbs and you're stretching for them.

Do take into account everything I write instead of constantly taking small pieces of any entence or post to make your point. That context thing, again! It's tiresome otherwise.

a) I clearly stated that Johnson at least understood the difference between sex and gender and didn't mangle them as he spoke, unlike Starmer who very clearly has said that transwomen are women, in his mind and in law!

b) You seem to be asserting that I am a Johnson supporter - stretching for crumbs - dspite my having repeatedly stated thatI have nobody to vote for, may well spoil my ballot, again!

thegcatsmother · 15/03/2022 08:44

Liz Truss says that women have vaginas, and wants Stonewall out of government departments.

MarshaBradyo · 15/03/2022 09:26

@thegcatsmother

Liz Truss says that women have vaginas, and wants Stonewall out of government departments.
Good
Ereshkigalangcleg · 15/03/2022 09:28

Absolutely no way will I support Labour when they insult women in the way they do. I will see who is standing as an independent. It's a pretty safe seat so whatever I vote for will be a protest vote.

bellinisurge · 15/03/2022 09:29

Liz Truss is an idiot but just about smart enough to
a) know what a woman is because she is one; and
b) know what will keep votes away from Labour.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 15/03/2022 09:31

I believe in safe spaces for born/biological women, I believe in safe spaces for trans men/trans women, and I believe everyone should have the right to a seat at the metaphorical table.

Perfectly reasonable. Labour don't, though. Which is why many women are not going to vote for them. My vote. Not anyone else's.