The Invasion is ongoing...Part 8

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Following on...

@youhadmeatjello

Why is the DM publishing boris’s six point plan? Surely that defeats the object of making a grand presentation of them in the coming days? I don’t understand why he’s pushing through to take centre stage like this - it’s making me More and more uneasy. He really does believe he’s Churchill doesn’t he?

I genuinely just think why have you done this. Have you said anything new…no. It’s just provocative again again from the UK. Does it need to be said no. I worry him and Liz Truss will just open their mouths as usual without thinking about wider implications

I think he did. Maybe not everywhere, and not Kiev, but definitely in the areas with bigger Russian population.

Then again, I was certain he wouldn't invade, or of he did, he would "only" do so in the separatist areas, so even I would take my words with a pinch of salt.

@Autumnwater same. Now really isn’t the time for posturing. I was anxious about the threats initially, then I calmed down and rationalised but I’m starting to worry again now. I can really see Putin doing some to make an example of us/as a warning to the rest of NATO. I don’t know what the solution is though!

Do you think maybe other politicians in other countries do the same in their newspapers but we just don’t see it? (Hopeful)

[quote youhadmeatjello]@Autumnwater same. Now really isn’t the time for posturing. I was anxious about the threats initially, then I calmed down and rationalised but I’m starting to worry again now. I can really see Putin doing some to make an example of us/as a warning to the rest of NATO. I don’t know what the solution is though![/quote]
I am sick of going onto BBC to see him spout more of the same, it’s like he is using this war as a stage for him to show the world his huge balls, I doubt they are impressed, he and liz should be banned from saying anything more, the US has issued far more sanctions yet they aren’t being dragged by Putin, I was nervous and then I calmed down but now it’s right back up again, I think Boris in general is a joke but he’s really taking the piss now.

@Galdb interesting, not sure. But we do tend to have reports on what other politicians (from other countries) are saying about the crisis and there hasn’t been a huge amount. They probably pick and choose what they publish here so as to make Boris look the most statesman like.

@Galdb

Do you think maybe other politicians in other countries do the same in their newspapers but we just don’t see it? (Hopeful)

I have been following a few countries news and I don’t see them piping up the way ours do

@Anoooshka

Someone mentioned the endgame?

Putin wants Ukraine and will stop at nothing to get it, even if it means killing half the Ukrainian population and destroying the country. Look at how many Ukrainians were killed by Stalin. Millions starved.

I don't understand how on the one hand Putin is saying that Ukrainians are Russians, and that they should (re)join the Russian family, and on the other hand he seems intent on bombing them into oblivion.

Its only the neo Nazi Ukrainians that he is bombing obviously.

Yes me too @Thewayshetalks Boris is doing all the poking and then he will merrily tuck himself away in his bunker with his family.
We’ve done well to unite in the west but I think the world leaders should make statements together at this point to show they are United and it’s coming from all of them.

It's not just us if anyone needs reassuring:

twitter.com/LindseyGrahamSC/status/1500149918912200704?t=wijMpsi61ervUb41TYF2iA&s=19

Actually, the 6 post plan is reassuring.

It stops short of what Ukraine is pushing for, namely a no fly corridor which would mean direct NATO involvement, which will be reassuring for Moscow as well.

Putin will willy wave, but there is nothing new and threatening in this plan to warrant him escalate.

[quote Gingerwarthog]@ChardonnaysPetDragon
Do you think he really believed he would be welcomed with flowers? Maybe the soldiers/ conscripts did but could he be so deluded?[/quote]
If everyone around you is to afraid to tell you the truth and just tells you what they think you want to hear, then I think it is perfectly possible he believed.

@ChardonnaysPetDragon

Actually, the 6 post plan is reassuring.

It stops short of what Ukraine is pushing for, namely a no fly corridor which would mean direct NATO involvement, which will be reassuring for Moscow as well.

Putin will willy wave, but there is nothing new and threatening in this plan to warrant him escalate.

I don’t mind reading what the general direction is from here either

And think it’s bluster from Putin in return

@FurryBandito

Can someone explain why our government publish strategies such as Johnsons 6 point plan for defeating Putin? Isn’t information like this supposed to be secret?

They like to be seen to be doing something.

If you read the plan you will quickly notice that it does not actually involve them doing anything.

If they really want to help Ukrainians they would be making it amazingly easy for those who want to to come to the UK.

Thanks that’s a bit reassuring. I suppose Boris does have to be seen to standing strong in the face of the specific threats to Britain.
Boris must be very aware of the amount of Russian involvement and funding in our government and want to be seen to be taking action without actually doing too much I guess…

@cakeorwine

• The German defence ministry was reportedly surprised by the government announcement, because the Strela missiles were declared obsolete and placed in storage in 2014. They are at least 35 years old and had been declared unsafe. The German defence ministry was reportedly surprised by the government announcement, because the Strela missiles were declared obsolete and placed in storage in 2014. They are at least 35 years old and had been declared unsafe.

The Ukrainian government reportedly specifically requested the missiles despite their age.*

Not sure if there’s misinformation involved but there’s claim and counterclaim being doing the rounds on the whole issue. I guess to be generous it’s possible this is down to a government minister, non specialist, making a stupid decision.

The only saving grace is the professionals involved spotted the problem and weapons didn’t get shipped.

Can someone explain why our government publish strategies such as Johnsons 6 point plan for defeating Putin? Isn’t information like this supposed to be secret?

Nothing on there appears unexpected, and they have to be seen to do something because the public opinion is hardening. The media are pushing this as far as they can.

Ukraine is of course asking for more because they were promised a lot by NATO and the West and now are increasingly feeling abandoned.

Excellent post by @FacebookPhotos

"I know it is going back a bit, but a couple of things about what history is taught in schools.
Firstly, individual schools (particularly academies) have a huge amount of choice over what to teach. Some may do ww2 in great detail, others not cover it at all.
Second, there has been a tendency of secondary schools to start gcse in year 9, so for “options” subjects the kids will necessarily learn less if they don’t pick that one. There is some pushback on this from ofsted.
Thirdly, if a school covers ww2 causes as part of the gcse they are likely to not cover it in much detail in ks3. So kids who don’t take history are limited to what their primary school did (which is necessarily very sanitised).
Fourth, some kids pay absolutely no attention in school and their parents don’t care. Even where kids / parents do care they will prioritise subjects they view as important. I work in a naice school with pretty good behaviour. Yet I regularly hear “my mum said not to worry about rubbish grades in history/geography because I’m dropping it”.

Of course it would be perfectly possible for a government to make “citizenship” type gcse equal standing with maths and English (in school ranking and ofsted terms). And ensure it covers really important stuff, like how politics, international relations (inc war), courts etc all work. But there isn’t the will to do it. Nobody really cares that much if kids understand how our country or the world works."

And from @DuncinToffee about media vids circulating re captured Russian military some of which breach Geneva convention .

I was appalled at video of Russian soldier crying and breaking down .What a low PR stunt by Ukraine .I couldn't help wondering if he'd been offered something stronger than what looked like the tea he couldn't stop drinking .

Ive been relatively calm up until now but Boris and his 6 point plan after Putin singled the UK out in his speech has spooked me a bit and i struggled to sleep last night. Im generally not an anxious person but i really do feel anxious right now and wish Boris would just stop blustering and antagonising Russia.

@Anoooshka

Someone mentioned the endgame?

Putin wants Ukraine and will stop at nothing to get it, even if it means killing half the Ukrainian population and destroying the country. Look at how many Ukrainians were killed by Stalin. Millions starved.

I don't understand how on the one hand Putin is saying that Ukrainians are Russians, and that they should (re)join the Russian family, and on the other hand he seems intent on bombing them into oblivion.

Absolutely, and if all Ukrainians want to be Russian and are being 'saved' then why are most of them fleeing west, and not into Russia!

@jgw1
@ChardonnaysPetDragon
Makes it even more worrying if he believes his own bullshit....

@smilingthroughgrittedteeth

Ive been relatively calm up until now but Boris and his 6 point plan after Putin singled the UK out in his speech has spooked me a bit and i struggled to sleep last night. Im generally not an anxious person but i really do feel anxious right now and wish Boris would just stop blustering and antagonising Russia.

It’s the opposite for me. I was feeling more anxious but as time goes on Putin’s words mean less. Don’t worry about a six point plan it’s not going to start repercussions.

It's a hard one. With the world already against him I can't see Putin escalating this with other countries first. He would just be inviting a world war that he would just not want or cannot afford right now.

With the warning of no fly zones from putin yesterday it has assured me its definitely not something we would want to do. I do worry that Putin may still say any more arming of Ukraine he will take that as assisting them in the war etc.

I can only hope that both sides start to compromise during peace talks now. As awful as Putin has been he needs an off ramp to save face while the war can end and Ukraine can rebuild. I'm assuming releasing of some sanctions may need to be part of these agreements.

As much as Zelenskey has been an absolute hero, surely it comes to the point where he would rather have some parts of his country left rather than the whole thing flattened. Part of me was wandering if his condemnation of the west may be part of this plan to save face for him. Saying he would love to continue to fight but he doesn't have the support from the west so he's had to make some concessions.

Nobody really cares that much if kids understand how our country or the world works."

In fact it suits many in power to ensure general ignorance prevails.
I used to ask my Y10 PSHE groups, as a starter to Citizenship, what is the (full and proper) name of the country they live in. I think I only once got the correct answer. Many adults have no idea how Parliament or Government work, or anything to do with elections other than the most basic mechanism of casting a vote, if that.