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The Invasion is ongoing...Part 6

999 replies

Damnloginpopup · 02/03/2022 20:49

Things are ramping up. No end in site as yet.

Link to thread 5 here: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/4494173-The-Invasion-is-ongoing-Part-5?pg=1

OP posts:
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12
HeadPain · 03/03/2022 15:29

I can't copy all of it.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/putin-hid-ukraine-invasion-plan-from-cabinet-who-are-now-too-scared-to-resign-q9rmxbqgc

Putin ‘hid Ukraine invasion plan from cabinet, who are now too scared to resign’
Officials fear treason charges if they speak out

President Putin concealed his plans to invade Ukraine from his cabinet and officials were not prepared for the scale of punishing international sanctions against Moscow, an investigative website has reported, citing sources close to the Kremlin.

The government was aware that Putin planned to recognise the two Kremlin-backed separatist regions in eastern Ukraine and had formulated its economic policies on the understanding that sanctions would be relatively light, the Agentstvo media outlet said.

“This is fed up. They are out of their fing minds!” a source told the outlet with regard to the invasion. They said many government officials were ready to resign in protest, but were afraid as this would be seen as an act of treason, adding: “Resignation will lead only to a prison camp.”

The Kremlin has denied that it plans to impose martial law. Analysts and media outlets have suggested that the measure, which would allow Moscow to close borders, seize property, detain foreign citizens and close down all independent media, could be announced at a meeting of the upper house tomorrow.

Dmitry Peskov, Putin’s spokesman, said: “This is a made-up story that people are sending to each other on social media.”

mybeautifulnewwashingmachine · 03/03/2022 15:29

[quote dreamingbohemian]You are saying that you think that some separatists are ethnically Ukranian? Do you have a credible source for that? Because I haven't seen that.

My credible source is the entire Internet. Go have a google, it will take 2 seconds.

Sorry to be rude but you come on here admitting you hardly know anything about this and then challenging people when they try to explain things!

For anyone who legitimately wants to learn more about the relationship between ethnicity and separatism in the Donbas, this is a very good (academic) article:

www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/1060586X.2018.1447769[/quote]
I am sorry to be rude, but your posts are not helpful at all and have gone off tangent. The point is, the videos show the horrendous situation in the East, does it not? I used the phrase "russian speaking" as that is how it had been refered to - but ignore that if you think that is not sufficiently accurate - focus on the content which shows horrendous conditions and horrific situation. Try to focus on the point I was making. Thanks.

mybeautifulnewwashingmachine · 03/03/2022 15:31

I am now behind with work! I think if people take the time and trouble to post , others should show a bit of common decency and either engage or not engage, not be rude or imply they are a feckin' bot!

And breathe....

mybeautifulnewwashingmachine · 03/03/2022 15:32

@alltheapples I am trying to find my source re weapons, I will try again tonight, it is hard as everything moves so fast and there is so much information on the net

WeAreTheHeroes · 03/03/2022 15:33

Garry Kasparov the chess grandmaster wrote a book about Putin. Here's a link to his recent tweets which make for interesting reading.

twitter.com/search?q=garry%20kasparov&t=wGg9Elh-Ta-uaq6fRyKeYw&s=03

DuncinToffee · 03/03/2022 15:33

@youhadmeatjello

Financial Times has some free stuff on the war. Fair bit actually. If you Google FT free to read Ukraine you’ll find it
Thanks for the tip!
Postdatedpandemic · 03/03/2022 15:35

[quote alltheapples]@Iknowitisheresomewhere I usually agree with this. But most topics do not have paid bots invading.[/quote]
Most the long running threads require an interest in politics and history plus the desire to do some research
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_in_Donbas this should cover the basics

HeadPain · 03/03/2022 15:36

alltheapples

HeadPain

Also, is it accurate that we made Ukraine give up their nuclear weapons upon the promise we would protect them...?

Yes it is accurate.

I don't know how to quote that properly. I wish I knew what the agreement actually said because it doesn't seem to mean much really. Why didn't Ukraine make sure to join NATO before giving up their nuclear deterrent? I'm assuming NATO existed then.

Postdatedpandemic · 03/03/2022 15:37

Oh and long links, not ones like this

Red gave me such a bollocking one day for a short link Grin

CaveMum · 03/03/2022 15:39

[quote WeAreTheHeroes]Garry Kasparov the chess grandmaster wrote a book about Putin. Here's a link to his recent tweets which make for interesting reading.

twitter.com/search?q=garry%20kasparov&t=wGg9Elh-Ta-uaq6fRyKeYw&s=03[/quote]
He took part in the BBC documentary that I keep banging on about (Rise of the Nazi's: Dictators At War)! He was the expert on Stalin, I'd wager there are more similarities between Vlad and Joe than we realise...

dreamingbohemian · 03/03/2022 15:40

Lol my posts aren't helpful? You asked a bunch of questions, I answered them. But no worries, I'll leave you to it.

CaveMum · 03/03/2022 15:41

@HeadPain this might help explain a bit more: www.armscontrol.org/factsheets/Ukraine-Nuclear-Weapons

alltheapples · 03/03/2022 15:41

I read the free stuff on Financial Times on Brexit. It was excellent and explained the issues to me when I was still trying to learn about it.
They assume they are speaking to an intelligent audience so cover things in some depth.

And so many mainstream news sites are talking about martial law coming in Russia I would be surprised if it does not happen.

dreamscantcometrue · 03/03/2022 15:41

@dreamscantcometrue

Will the people of Ukraine largely be going about their daily business? Working, food shop, visiting relatives, school etc?
Bumping as thread moves quickly and didn't want this to be missed. I'm just wondering how the war impacts the civilians going about their life.
alltheapples · 03/03/2022 15:44

@Postdatedpandemic I know I have read and watched a lot about Ukraine over the last few days. But I do not trust Wikipedia as a credible source of information.

alltheapples · 03/03/2022 15:45

@dreamscantcometrue everything I have seen is about people preparing for the Russian troops coming by making Molotov cocktails or barriers, trying to flee, or preparing basements to hide in.
What would you do if an invading army was rolling ever nearer to where you lived?

dreamingbohemian · 03/03/2022 15:46

@HeadPain

alltheapples

HeadPain

Also, is it accurate that we made Ukraine give up their nuclear weapons upon the promise we would protect them...?

Yes it is accurate.

I don't know how to quote that properly. I wish I knew what the agreement actually said because it doesn't seem to mean much really. Why didn't Ukraine make sure to join NATO before giving up their nuclear deterrent? I'm assuming NATO existed then.

This is the actual text of the agreement on Ukraine and nuclear weapons:

treaties.un.org/doc/Publication/UNTS/Volume%203007/Part/volume-3007-I-52241.pdf

It is very short. You will see right away that Russia has violated it, going back to 2014 and the annexation of Crimea.

Russia's justification for violating the treaty back then was that the new Ukrainian government was not legitimate and therefore it did not have to honour existing treaties. This is NOT true in international law.

HeadPain · 03/03/2022 15:46

[quote CaveMum]@HeadPain this might help explain a bit more: www.armscontrol.org/factsheets/Ukraine-Nuclear-Weapons[/quote]
Ok thank u, I'll have a read of that

BeyondPurpleTulips · 03/03/2022 15:46

Dreams I did see one news story (bbc breaking feed) that mentioned schools being closed, but apart from that I don't know how many people would be working etc. obv things like power stations they have to, but I don't know if all food is currently being rationed rather than bought - shelves look pretty empty

HeadPain · 03/03/2022 15:47

Thank you too @dreamingbohemian

NNat · 03/03/2022 15:47

This reply has been withdrawn

Withdrawn at poster's request

BeyondPurpleTulips · 03/03/2022 15:47

(Ps - I apologise if anyone of my typing is shite - my hand is strapped up atm. It is not a sign that I am a bit Grin )

BeyondPurpleTulips · 03/03/2022 15:48

*BOT

badlydrawncat · 03/03/2022 15:49

DuncinToffee Thu 03-Mar-22 15:10:27
Problem with the Financial Times is their paywall

The FT's War in Ukraine section is free to view :-)
Al Jazeera English has some really useful reporting too

ClaudineClare · 03/03/2022 15:49

@mybeautifulnewwashingmachine

I am now behind with work! I think if people take the time and trouble to post , others should show a bit of common decency and either engage or not engage, not be rude or imply they are a feckin' bot! And breathe....
Maybe if you hadn't name changed just before posting on this thread people would not be so wary?