The Invasion is ongoing...Part 5

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Unbelievable to think that a few days ago the world was starting to look more positive..ye we find ourselves on a fifth thread discussing the horrors of the war in Europe. An unbelievable change has happened to the world we live in.

Some incredible firmed posts have been written, informing, discussing, and occasionally derailing. Let's hope the news is more positive by the end of this one.

Exactly my thoughts. The last few weeks has shown they will repeatedly say whatever “words” people want to hear, and then do the precise opposite.

I wonder where they learned that ?

@Lonelycrab

Sorry, but I find the idea of Russians requesting ceasefire negotiations as complete bollocks. Sure, they might be USING those words - but they are meaningless

Exactly my thoughts. The last few weeks has shown they will repeatedly say whatever “words” people want to hear, and then do the precise opposite.

actually there is very real pressure coming from china and india over this

but maybe you are right, but if so what is the alternative? let the fighting continue? let sanctions drag us into instability and a potential ww3?

BBC live

UN condemns invasion and demands withdrawal
The UN General Assembly has voted in favour of a resolution condemning Russia's invasion and calling for it immediately to pull all of its forces out of Ukraine.

The resolution was supported by 141 of the body's 193 members at a rare emergency General Assembly session called by the UN Security Council.

@DuncinToffee

James Clayton *@JamesClayton5*

Tech update:

Apple - has paused all sales in Russia.
Google - has blocked mobile apps connected to RT and Sputnik
Microsoft - has banned ads from state-sponsored media.
Meta - flagging content. Platform restricted in Russia
Twitter - flagging content. Platform also limited

I saw a video of an angry Russian man taking a hammer to his own ipad in protest at Apple's move. That'll show 'em, angry man!

Continu they are meeting though? They’ve had two sessions so far. Whether what Putin is suggesting is palatable to Ukraine I don’t know

Has this been linked?

A panel of body language and deception experts commenting on a Putin interview on Ukraine.

Bit more on UN meeting via Patrick Wintour

UN general assembly votes overwhelmingly for motion denouncing Russia's invasion of Ukraine. 141 in favour, 5 against, 35 abstentions. In 2014 UNGA 100 voted to oppose annexation of Crimea etc, 11 voted against, 54 abstained and 23 were absent. In short, Russia is losing friends.

@DrBlackbird

I’ve missed 6 pages on the thread while doing some work… but after listening to the news and reflecting on what some people have posted, I’ve come to two conclusion.

One, that even though this is just one tiny nothing thread on a platform for parents, I find it incredibly strange that we have so many experts on the history of NATO, Ukraine and Russia who are essentially being Russia apologists.

Two, I’m no longer engaging with any of those posts as this feels incredibly disrespectful to the thousands of Ukraine citizens being murdered as we sit here. Women, babies, children, men, the aged and infirm dying and 100’s of thousands displaced from their homes and their country.

Nothing, absolutely nothing condones the actions of Russia/Putin. Nothing. It’s bullshit of the highest order. Sickening even.

Fascinating isn't it, DrBlackbird? I agree entirely.

I am reminded of the Skripal incident. Many new posters with very "interesting" perspectives popped up then too.

When the only countries in the world who support you are Eritrea, Belarus, Syria, and North Korea, you're not in a great spot.

Putin asking for ceasefire negotiations...

Re clavionvas post earlier I found it interesting.

The idea that RA feels singled out or picked on I find complete nonsense. His daughter has spoken out about Putins atrocities.

I can't imagine he's that stupid to feel personally Scape goated or picked on.
I'e one hopes and I can't imagine otherwise his ire will be directed at Putin.
All these oligarchs who remain on good terms with Putin are the one's we need to put pressure on him And those around him. they are the one's using their plunder to enjoy the rest of the world outside Russia after all.

Agree with what @continu said

@MissConductUS

The weather is about to become a factor in Ukraine's favor:

www.reddit.com/r/UkrainianConflict/comments/t51mw2/general_winter_may_be_coming_to_ukraines_rescue/

Heavy snow will greatly hamper the movement of Russian troops and supplies.

That subreddit is pretty good, as is this one:

www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/

As always with Reddit, you have to be a bit skeptical but there is a lot of good info there.

So how is that going to help thousands of civilians who need supplying with food? Or are trying to evacuate? How is that going to help elderly who vowed not to leave their homes and have no fuel to keep warm? How is that going to help with the resupplying of munitions for the Ukrainans?

I am not sure poor weather is greatly going to improve things for either side. Most likely it will merely lead to a deterioation of conditions, with the most vulnerable worst affected.

I am really not sure how anyone can read that line and think its a good thing.

I seem to recall that the invasion had to be before the spring, because the warmer weather would be harder to move heavy vehicles as the ground thawed up a bit and got muddy. Or was I imagining that one?

actually there is very real pressure coming from china and india over this

Is there though? China seems to be trying to keep neutral, at least compared to the west, and are opposing sanctions. India were supporting Putin just a few days ago and Pakistan have just signed a huge trade deal with Russia haven’t they. How are they applying pressure?

Haven’t read the whole thread (also haven’t watched this whole video) but just wanted to highlight how terrifyingly accurate the start of this video is. It was posted over 2 years ago!

@Alexandra2001

I don't mean this facetiously, but will you join the international brigade that Ukraine is calling for?

I'm assuming no, because you realise that it would likely mean a senseless loss of your life with no material change in Ukraine's circumstances.

On that basis, how can you call for an escalation in this conflict which could conceivably end in a nuclear holocaust? There is no good outcome now, the best would be a minimally harmful peace process. Escalation will only mean millions more deaths.

There is no way for the west to resolve this militarily without risking nuclear war.

I’ve missed 6 pages on the thread while doing some work… but after listening to the news and reflecting on what some people have posted, I’ve come to two conclusion.

One, that even though this is just one tiny nothing thread on a platform for parents, I find it incredibly strange that we have so many experts on the history of NATO, Ukraine and Russia who are essentially being Russia apologists.

Have you noticed they only post when certain events happen, play the person not the ball and only post on certain topics?

You don't get too many of them getting involved in debates over whether its ok to eat McDonalds or the Masked Singer.

Odd isn't it?

@thunderonlyhappenswhenits

If you have YouTube (especially on a smart TV) there is masses of video and detail on this invasion of Ukraine. Continually updated.

agree with @Yeahthat

this isn't a computer game with us cheering for our favourite contender, sending them "out to bat" on our behalf.

so if the Ukrainians decide NOT to fight (which is perfectly arguable and obviously I don't know what I would do but quite possible the same) then they've failed and they "lose our goodwill"?

the media and the culture of jingoism builds people up then tears them down again.

I’ve been following these threads and appreciate the sensible and informed posts. Thank you.

I have a question. The Russian plan appears to be destroy the towns and kill the people. I don’t understand what of value will be left to lay claim to. In separatist areas I realise they’ll be welcomed with flowers, but what will be left everywhere else? Just space between the EU and Russia?

Thank you again for the helpful posts.

Statement from the Russian Embassy in Canada (blue tick account):

twitter.com/RussianEmbassyC/status/1498816008756383744

They are in another entirely parallel universe.

@Alexandra2001

Do you think we are then looking at Ukraine being brutally swallowed by Russia and then a division of Russia China and other countries like Pakistan, North Korea and others on one side and the west nato etc on the other. Will Ukraine lead to a new world order as some sort of new Cold War. That sounds awful and what will it mean for us all. What will the outcome of all of this be and how will that look for all of us?

Perhaps, though i do not feel China will take sides, they need eco growth to keep their vast country together.

I think Ukraine will be partitioned, and a new cold war, the millions killed and us standing by will be justified by "well better than WW3"

The problem with this is that the Russians will know that they can come back for more of the old USSR safe in the knowledge we will shy away from conflict.

@Muminabun that is the million dollar question! At the moment China is not fully rattling its war drums and has been more cautious of expressing full support for Russia. I guess it’s caution could be viewed as ethical holdouts (low likelihood imo), it’s usual pragmatism and caution (probably imo), or playing two sides (possibly an extra benefit to the situation and not the original intention I would say). We will have to watch and see.

@Alexandra2001 you might be right about partition but I couldn’t disagree more with your thinking that Putin sees he can take what he wants. The Ukrainians have clearly surprised him by their resistance. The EU have been remarkably united and swift once they made their minds up to be. Germany is rearming significantly and even the Swiss have ditched their neutrality. Despite the need to not fight directly arms have poured into the Ukraine. If Putin puts one toe over the border with NATO and the EU it will be war and I think that’s very clear.

On the other side of the world Japan is rethinking its ban on nuclear, which I find immeasurably sad.

Russia in the past has been a brutal conqueror and not very concerned about the paucity of life left even in its new lands. It doesn’t seem to be much different.

I can't find the original link on Twitter but it ties in with the Canadian embassy document that the terms Russia are asking for for ceasefire is denazification and demilitarization of Ukraine. Not sure how the fuck you 'denazify' and no way they'll all surrender weapons to let Russia do whatever they wish

@RedToothBrush

It's a good rule of thumb that whenever anyone writes anything you don't like on the internet, they're probably a Russian operative

No one's said anything other than that Russia's actions are evil, illegal and abhorrent.

Explaining is not condoning. Every conflict in history has root causes. If you want to leave it at, "Putin's evil" then no one disagrees with you.

I don't believe that this will help to reduce the possibility of such conflicts in the future though. I think that considering these events on a structural level may.