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Original poster

The Invasion is ongoing...Part 5

999 replies

Damnloginpopup · 01/03/2022 15:57

Unbelievable to think that a few days ago the world was starting to look more positive..ye we find ourselves on a fifth thread discussing the horrors of the war in Europe. An unbelievable change has happened to the world we live in.

Some incredible firmed posts have been written, informing, discussing, and occasionally derailing. Let's hope the news is more positive by the end of this one.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
14
DuncinToffee · 02/03/2022 17:06

Interesting

Millions of Russians are turning to BBC News for independent information about Ukraine:
⬆️English-language t.co/2ZzBrjzmve visitors in Russia up 252% to 423,000 last week
⬆️BBC’s Russian news website more than tripled its year-to-date weekly average to reach 10.7m people
twitter.com/pressgazette/status/1499065178545082372?t=nXmyRngmdm63_-XC9MxlTdeyZxbxfW8tZWDZwmRg9tE&s=19

Tigersonvaseline · 02/03/2022 17:07

What do people think of troops , ours, massing on the border?
Too provocative or perhaps it Will apply pressure to the Russian army?

continu · 02/03/2022 17:07

@jgw1

Its is all well and good saying that the UN should send in peacekeepers, but the UN does not have an army. Peacekeepers come from the militaries of members of the UN. There are only a handful of nations who have both the expertise and numbers of troops to lead such an operation in such a large country. I doubt that the presence of 10,000s of US troops as peacekeepers is going to go down very well in Moscow, because that is what you are suggesting.
Forces acting under UN mandate.

Also, it is what Russia suggested themselves, they said they were going in pursuant to article 51 part 7 which states refers specifically to it being a temporary measure until UN send in peacekeeping measures.

notimagain · 02/03/2022 17:07

@continu

I think public opinion should be ceasefire with UN peace corps and then negotiations

  1. I think there’s the sticky issue of the Russian veto.
  2. Then there’s the issue of enforcing a cease fire..and
  3. would be willing to put troop forward for this peace corp you mention?
FatFucker · 02/03/2022 17:09

@DuncinToffee very interesting, thanks!

MarshaBradyo · 02/03/2022 17:10

Continu how certain are you they wouldn’t be bombed or killed?

DrBlackbird I appreciate your post

DGRossetti · 02/03/2022 17:11

[quote DuncinToffee]Interesting

Millions of Russians are turning to BBC News for independent information about Ukraine:
⬆️English-language t.co/2ZzBrjzmve visitors in Russia up 252% to 423,000 last week
⬆️BBC’s Russian news website more than tripled its year-to-date weekly average to reach 10.7m people
twitter.com/pressgazette/status/1499065178545082372?t=nXmyRngmdm63_-XC9MxlTdeyZxbxfW8tZWDZwmRg9tE&s=19[/quote]
BBC is broadcasting on Short Wave apparently.

Just a general observation for some that the terminally dim struggle to distinguish "understanding" and "condoning". In fact it's a easy way to filter out the noise. (Regular Westminstebnders will know what I mean. )

notimagain · 02/03/2022 17:14

BBC is broadcasting on Short Wave apparently.

Thanks for the info, though wonder if the Russian listeners are getting an earful of the Red Army Choir and similar when they tune in Wink

SpinningTheSeedsOfLove · 02/03/2022 17:14

RT tv is now off the telly.

This service is currently not available

continu · 02/03/2022 17:14

[quote notimagain]@continu

I think public opinion should be ceasefire with UN peace corps and then negotiations

  1. I think there’s the sticky issue of the Russian veto.
  2. Then there’s the issue of enforcing a cease fire..and
  3. would be willing to put troop forward for this peace corp you mention?[/quote]
  4. The Russian veto was not to do with article 51part 7 - they themselves referred to article 51 part 7.
  5. The Russians have asked for negotiation over ceasefire 3 times now and Ukraine is basically going in hardline - I think suggesting to them both that a ceasefire with peacekeeping forces while they negotiate is at least worth a try
  6. arguably better and cheaper than the current war destruction in Ukraine, cost of refugee crisis, sanctions causing economic destruction (and thereby more war) and fear of ww3
DuncinToffee · 02/03/2022 17:15

[quote FatFucker]@DuncinToffee very interesting, thanks! [/quote]
Hope it helps cleaning up your tik tok history a bit Grin

jgw1 · 02/03/2022 17:15

*Forces acting under UN mandate.

Also, it is what Russia suggested themselves, they said they were going in pursuant to article 51 part 7 which states refers specifically to it being a temporary measure until UN send in peacekeeping measures.*

Are you suggesting that the Russians in Mariupol are there for peacekeeping?

I thought the threads with posters trying to defend Boris' birthday party had some odd posts.

notimagain · 02/03/2022 17:16

I rather suspect the Russians will happily acquiesce to UN intervention when they have got what they want out of this war.

StormzyinaTCup · 02/03/2022 17:16

Just a general observation for some that the terminally dim struggle to distinguish "understanding" and "condoning". In fact it's a easy way to filter out the noise. (Regular Westminstebnders will know what I mean.)

Polite request, please don't bring your sneering attitude over to this thread. Thank you.

continu · 02/03/2022 17:17

@MarshaBradyo

Continu how certain are you they wouldn’t be bombed or killed?

DrBlackbird I appreciate your post

By whom? They wouldn't go in unless it was approved by both Russia and Ukraine in which case it would only be the risk of renegades, which at the moment i don't think is high risk.

I can't get my head round why the US isn't pushing for ceasefire

FatFucker · 02/03/2022 17:18

is what is so desperately sad-these countries don’t hate each other (or didn’t until now)

In a couple of days, Ukrainians won't be giving the young soldiers hot drinks and letting them phone their mum. I've been in Theatre I've seen what people can do to each other, when full of rage and revenge.

I think the world are going to be shocked how quickly things move, and this will be one of the first time we will actually see it as it's happening. So many atrocities to come. This isn't going to have a Hollywood ending.

I wish we could step in and stop it, but fully understand why we must just sit and watch.

Although I have no doubt there is a hell of a lot going on in the sidelines.

Furries · 02/03/2022 17:18

Sorry, but I find the idea of Russians requesting ceasefire negotiations as complete bollocks. Sure, they might be USING those words - but they are meaningless.

CallyfromBlakes7 · 02/03/2022 17:20

I wonder if Putin heard about the queues of lorries going into Dover and wanted to create a longer one

yes anything we can do he can do better

sorry I don't want to minimise what's happening and completely agree that nothing excuses his actions

MarshaBradyo · 02/03/2022 17:20

Continu what does Putin want in return for a ceasefire?

continu · 02/03/2022 17:20

@notimagain

I rather suspect the Russians will happily acquiesce to UN intervention when they have got what they want out of this war.
I haven't a clue what is going on behind the scenes but they have asked for ceasefire negotiations several times.
DrBlackbird · 02/03/2022 17:21

But I’m thankful to RedToothBrush for posting that comparative analysis with the Finnish experience and am going to hold onto this piece of sentiment it includes: So I remain reservedly optimistic because some positive outcome for the Ukrainian people and for (more) liberal democracy are what we all are hoping for. Most of us anyhow.

jgw1 · 02/03/2022 17:21

@Furries

Sorry, but I find the idea of Russians requesting ceasefire negotiations as complete bollocks. Sure, they might be USING those words - but they are meaningless.
It does seem to have escaped some posters notice that Russia invaded a sovereign nation without provocation and has set about destroying parts of it.

But can we hope that there is a growing realisation in Moscow that they are not going to get all of Ukraine?

DuncinToffee · 02/03/2022 17:25

James Clayton @JamesClayton5

Tech update:

Apple - has paused all sales in Russia.
Google - has blocked mobile apps connected to RT and Sputnik
Microsoft - has banned ads from state-sponsored media.
Meta - flagging content. Platform restricted in Russia
Twitter - flagging content. Platform also limited

Lonelycrab · 02/03/2022 17:25

Sorry, but I find the idea of Russians requesting ceasefire negotiations as complete bollocks. Sure, they might be USING those words - but they are meaningless

Exactly my thoughts. The last few weeks has shown they will repeatedly say whatever “words” people want to hear, and then do the precise opposite.

continu · 02/03/2022 17:26

@MarshaBradyo

Continu what does Putin want in return for a ceasefire?
I have said this upthread - there is a lot of pressure on Russia to ceasefire from its partners (for want of a better word) isn't there? A ceasefire with UN peacekeeping corps would be on the basis that all the issues would be discussed and negotiated after ceasefire - that would be around Crimea, Donbas region. This is achievable and doesn't erode Ukraine's position at all. The issues are highly complex, they aren't the sort of thing which could be agreed in an hour or two and the longer this goes on, the more destruction and casualties there are. So to answer - what I am suggesting is that there is a commitment to negotiate the real and preexisting issues in the region. Worth a try, do you not think?