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Boris Johnson to address nation as he describes Russian invasion as 'catastrophe for our continent

784 replies

Ponyclubkick · 24/02/2022 10:54

Anyone finding the tone of this really quite terrifying...

I’m not one to get myself in a tizz over sensationalised news but this is starting to feel very different!

OP posts:
Tigersonvaseline · 25/02/2022 10:45

Keep

Absolutely, the pics I saw were of incredibly young lads the age said 19 but I thought he was younger. Apparently many young lads were pretty much forced in, and sent to the front line.

Fodder as someone else's said.Sad

Putin needs to loose control of his army they need too turn on him.

Keepyourheadscrewedon · 25/02/2022 10:55

They do need to turn on him tiger for the love of God Russia needs to wake up out of their collective paralysis and some already are doing so. I recognise some brave souls have been for years and years and have paid the ultimate price.

This not a war against the Russian people or Russia, this is a war against one man that has gone completely mad and is now in danger of causing great harm to the whole world.

The Russians must know they have so much to lose now, not just their teenage boys. Putin will be emboldened by this, if he wins, and so will every other tin pot state - staging the perfect conditions for much, much more serious conflict.

TheReluctantPhoenix · 25/02/2022 11:03

@Keepyourheadscrewedon,

Were you alive in the cold war? You seem incredibly young and naive.

19 year olds cannot turn on Putin, you need politicians or generals to turn on him and, for years, he has been appointing yes-men to those positions.

That is the point of sanctions, to encourage those around Putin to decide that they, personally, would be better off with him gone.

But, if it works at all, it will take time.

Keepyourheadscrewedon · 25/02/2022 11:04

If the army generals pulled out their soldiers, and they did so collectively and turned on the Kremlin, it would be very difficult to see where Putin would go from there. It would be called a coup and happens more often than you imagine.

Jourdain11 · 25/02/2022 11:38

The situation is a little more nuanced than it's being reported by UK media, I think. Firstly, it is known and accepted that the original toppling of the pro-Russian presidency in 2014 was supported and to some extent sponsored by neo Nazi factions. Although it's ludicrous to make assertions of genocide or Ukraine being a Nazi state, this is why some in the region wouldn't necessarily dismiss that claim out of hand.

Zelenskyy is hardly taking a wholly responsible approach to his citizens' safety. I'm a bit dubious about the wisdom of encouraging people to run out and buy guns and sling Molotov cocktails around.

Moreover, the allegiance of people in the Ukraine isn't necessarily as clear cut as the media makes it out to be. In Eastern areas of Ukraine, there's a majority percentage of ethnic Russian population and a lot of people don't even speak Ukrainian. Many of them objected to the "Ukrainianisation" of their regions and feel closely aligned to Russia, culturally, historically and ideologically.

Sadly, I can't see Putin's strategy failing, because they know that NATO will only declare against them militarily if they put their troops onto NATO territory - and they won't, because they seem to have no need to.

I doubt Putin has much interest in Western Ukraine (Lviv, Ivano-Frankivsk, etc.) and probably the goal is to cut Ukraine in half via the Dnieper and siphon off the Eastern part.

Keepyourheadscrewedon · 25/02/2022 12:03

jourdain I believe the 2014 was horribly rigged in favour of Russia, which can be of no surprise to anyone, they had tried to install a pro Russian government into Ukraine. Ukraine have fought for their right for independence and democracy, you can hardly blame for choosing to continue with that given what they were up against massive with Russia interference and good for them!

There is a far right fraction in Ukraine but that can be said of every European nation including Russia.

I agree with your general sentiment that it is complex, but its not that complex. 90% of people voted for democracy and freedom, that to me is pretty straight forward.

Putin's long term strategy will fail, because he does not have the will or the consent of the people. Whatever happens with the war, there are 44 million people in Ukraine and not all are remotely pro Russian quite the reverse.

Alexandra2001 · 25/02/2022 13:02

Keep Less than 24hr's ago you said Russian soldiers were there solely to kill and that NATO needs to get in there and wipe them out.

Nothing has changed, so forgive me if i don't take your concerns on Russian lives at face value.

Keepyourheadscrewedon · 25/02/2022 13:15

Haven't you got anything better to do than constantly message me alex? I am going out in the glorious spring sunshine for the afternoon, so I will be leaving you to it, you can keep banging away fruitlessly with your 'personal' opinions. Have a good day.

Alexandra2001 · 25/02/2022 13:23

@Keepyourheadscrewedon

Haven't you got anything better to do than constantly message me alex? I am going out in the glorious spring sunshine for the afternoon, so I will be leaving you to it, you can keep banging away fruitlessly with your 'personal' opinions. Have a good day.
Facts are facts, thats what you said, you don't like the truth.

As for banging away, i ve been out for 3 hours and you ve been on MN none stop lol and i've never messaged you, thats an outright lie.

Enjoy the afternoon, its a glorious day.

Blossomtoes · 25/02/2022 13:29

@Keepyourheadscrewedon

If the army generals pulled out their soldiers, and they did so collectively and turned on the Kremlin, it would be very difficult to see where Putin would go from there. It would be called a coup and happens more often than you imagine.
Really? Last military coup in the world was where and when? Have you read nothing about Russia and its history?
5thnonblonde · 25/02/2022 14:39

Egypt was the last super big coup in 2013. The CAR was after that and the result of a coup. I think there was one in Burkina Faso like, around Christmas?

5thnonblonde · 25/02/2022 14:50

Christ this is bad tho. Surely by calling on citizens to take arms Zelensky has basically just OK’d Russia to open fire on any citizens they encounter? And the city must still be full as no one had any time to get out

TheReluctantPhoenix · 25/02/2022 14:59

There was a communist Russian coup in the 90s against Gorbachev (I think 1992).it was where Yeltsin heroically stood in front of a tank.

Russian military took the side of the people them.

Jourdain11 · 25/02/2022 15:17

@5thnonblonde

Christ this is bad tho. Surely by calling on citizens to take arms Zelensky has basically just OK’d Russia to open fire on any citizens they encounter? And the city must still be full as no one had any time to get out
Exactly - it is completely irresponsible.
Postdatedpandemic · 25/02/2022 21:15

@TheReluctantPhoenix

There was a communist Russian coup in the 90s against Gorbachev (I think 1992).it was where Yeltsin heroically stood in front of a tank.

Russian military took the side of the people them.

1991 but who care about facts
Postdatedpandemic · 25/02/2022 21:17

In front of a tank harks back to 1989 Tiananmen Square , but again, who cares about facts.

DinnoWoman · 25/02/2022 22:23

He was riding on top of a tank.

Jourdain11 · 25/02/2022 22:54

By way of comparison, there are quite a few million people in this country who don't want BJ as prime minister, but there's nothing they can actually do about it except wait for the next GE. In Russia, they don't even have that option because there are no free elections. The truth is that it's impossible to have democratic centralised rule of such a large nation state. This is why the US devolves so much power to state and regional level.

ABitBesotted · 25/02/2022 23:09

@Jourdain11

By way of comparison, there are quite a few million people in this country who don't want BJ as prime minister, but there's nothing they can actually do about it except wait for the next GE. In Russia, they don't even have that option because there are no free elections. The truth is that it's impossible to have democratic centralised rule of such a large nation state. This is why the US devolves so much power to state and regional level.
That's daft. The RF is divided into 85 federal subjects, for a start.
Jourdain11 · 25/02/2022 23:29

85 federal subjects with very little real devolved power though.

Keepyourheadscrewedon · 26/02/2022 10:49

It was sad to see the brave Russian protesters being dragged off and arrested just for asking for a needless war to stop. I worry about the older ladies that looked so scared but they were still there.

To me, it looks like the world is coming together firmly behind Ukraine, even China said they could not support this invasion. This may actually make the West even stronger in the longer term, we are no longer sitting behind our illusions of safety. Peace to Ukraine.

ABitBesotted · 26/02/2022 11:03

It was sad to see the brave Russian protesters being dragged off and arrested just for asking for a needless war to stop.

The Met Police attacking women at the vigil for Sarah Everard is still worse.

Where are our protests to stop NATO's warmongering?

Keepyourheadscrewedon · 26/02/2022 11:10

We will be having protests to stop the war and support Ukraine at 12pm central London if you are interested abit

ABitBesotted · 26/02/2022 11:21

In support of ordinary Ukrainian people (the ones fucked over by all this), yes.

In support of the Ukrainian government out Kalashnikovs to untrained teenagers, no.

In support of Biden, Johnson and all the other arseholes who have provoked this, no.

They don't give a fuck about Ukraine except as a means of getting at Russia.

Keepyourheadscrewedon · 26/02/2022 11:27

Paranoia talk - I can see Putin has really got you abit

It is the ordinary Ukrainian people you say you support that are being blown to bits, and having their lives ruined.

Those teenagers with arms are there out of choice and are defending their country - bless them from a marauding invasion (unlike the poor kids conscripted for Russia forced to fight a war they don't even understand, and are also starving I understand - see the link from Russia itself)

www.themoscowtimes.com/2022/02/21/russian-troops-at-ukraines-border-face-nightmare-living-conditions-a76488

And all the other arseholes that are showing great restraint by not going into Ukraine, are standing up for a small country that voted by a staggering 90% to be democratic and free.

Putin is dragging all of Russia into a total mess of its own making, one that ruin their lives for decades if not generations to come. Slow clap for Putin.