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The invasion has begun

999 replies

Damnloginpopup · 24/02/2022 03:50

Russia has begun it's invasion of Ukraine. Who knows where this will end.

apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-europe-russia-moscow-kyiv-626a8c5ec22217bacb24ece60fac4fe1

OP posts:
HillsBesideTheSea · 24/02/2022 16:39

China still has the para winter olympics to get through. Would be terribly bad form for them to get involved in anything before that concludes.

BeckyWithTheGoodHair010101 · 24/02/2022 16:41

Why is a tweet from the Ukrainian President misinformation?

Chocolattay · 24/02/2022 16:42

The Chernobyl news is coming from the official president of Ukraine’s Twitter account? Can that actually be considered a viable source? We don’t know if he has his own agenda here, a cry for help etc.

Keepyourheadscrewedon · 24/02/2022 16:42

Yes but facebook it is not good to have an aggressive crazy man in charge of an operation that can genuinely cause serious harm from radioactive waste. Ukraine needs to hold on to Chernobyl

FacebookPhotos · 24/02/2022 16:43

@BeckyWithTheGoodHair010101

Why is a tweet from the Ukrainian President misinformation?
The tweet itself isn't.

But to present a tweet from the Ukrainian president as if it were the opinion of the EU or "Europe" is misinformation.

Inkanta · 24/02/2022 16:43

Is this all Putin's idea, and did he think it all up during lockdown and gone bloody crazy in his mind?

If so then this should all stop when he is out the equation, and hopefully taken out as has been suggested.

Chocolattay · 24/02/2022 16:44

It could be exaggeration on the part of the Ukrainian president (not defending Russia). This was occurring in the early hours as well when officials were claiming Odessa was being stormed by troops.

BeckyWithTheGoodHair010101 · 24/02/2022 16:44

Facebook I wasn't aware someone had done that. Someone asked for the source, I linked the tweet. It's being reported in the independent also, if that's a more viable source of information.

dreamingbohemian · 24/02/2022 16:45

@Keepyourheadscrewedon

It is being reported by Swedish outlets that Europe consider it to be an act of war/aggression against Europe. It is clearly a severe act of war against Ukraine, that is obvious.
And you were just lecturing us about fake news! Come on.

Zelensky the president of Ukraine has said the Russian attack on Chernobyl is a declaration of war against all of Europe.

This is NOT something that 'Europe' (I guess you mean the EU?) is saying. Don't be alarmist.

HillsBesideTheSea · 24/02/2022 16:45

Aljazeera news is now distinguishing between verifiable sources (their eyes and ears on the ground, and news outlets they trust) and individuals on the ground with phones etc generated sources for their material. It is an interesting change in their reporting through the day. They have had some interesting pieces on things like Turkey's position and factors into their decisions.

FacebookPhotos · 24/02/2022 16:46

Yes but facebook it is not good to have an aggressive crazy man in charge of an operation that can genuinely cause serious harm from radioactive waste. Ukraine needs to hold on to Chernobyl

The aggressive crazy man (I assume you mean Putin) is already in charge of a huge nuclear arsenal and many nuclear reactors. Chernobyl is significant from a geographic perspective, but not from a "nuclear fallout" perspective.

Roundeartheratchriatmas · 24/02/2022 16:46

I don’t think there’s any doubt that Chernobyl is under attack and that yes a stray missile would be catastrophic but I don’t believe currently the EU themselves consider this in itself an act of war.

jacketsatdawn · 24/02/2022 16:46

@dreamingbohemian Russia has said that under article 51 part 7 they went into the Ukraine to defence the Russian citizens, having been asked to go in by the Russian citizens. The point here in fact is that they are saying they want to comply with international law and article 51 part 7 says it is legitimate until the UN takes measures. So this is an opening for the UN to negotiate peace keeping measures. I hope that makes sense now.

@Keepyourheadscrewedon the above is from BBC which I would hope you consider a decent source and not part of the misinformation war - which I haven't seen - but then again I tend to look at the BBC, the French news, the Indian news (which has had amazing coverage of all the issues, including those which affect Asia and the East)

Chocolattay · 24/02/2022 16:46

I don’t fully trust the Twitter account of the Ukrainian President not to be exaggerating the Chernobyl situation. But I don’t mean that in that I’m defending Russia. Just in the sense that Ukraine is in a complete panic and is a shitshow at the moment.

jacketsatdawn · 24/02/2022 16:47

.. and US mainstream news

FacebookPhotos · 24/02/2022 16:48

It is an interesting change in their reporting through the day.

It takes time to check sources and so the initial information was always going to be unverified. And it makes perfect sense that they're moving to more reliable sources now that they can.

CowboyJo · 24/02/2022 16:48

Incredibly sad and horrifying..

My 11 year daughter was the one to tell me about it all. She was so scared and it breaks my heart how the world is Sad

jacketsatdawn · 24/02/2022 16:50

*defend not defence

Alexandra2001 · 24/02/2022 16:52

@BeckyWithTheGoodHair010101

Why is a tweet from the Ukrainian President misinformation?
Because the poster said it was from the EU, that the EU was saying Russia had declared war on Europe.

that would be very scary.

HillsBesideTheSea · 24/02/2022 16:54

No, they are using the same footage but they have tweaked their language around it only. And they are stating their source of material when using it (eg verified/imagery coming out of). The imagery is the same, the language is modified. Subtle shifts.

dreamingbohemian · 24/02/2022 17:03

Russia has said that under article 51 part 7 they went into the Ukraine to defence the Russian citizens, having been asked to go in by the Russian citizens. The point here in fact is that they are saying they want to comply with international law and article 51 part 7 says it is legitimate until the UN takes measures. So this is an opening for the UN to negotiate peace keeping measures. I hope that makes sense now.

Please go back and read Article 51. Russia's invasion is NOT legitimate under Article 51.

Article 2(4) of the UN Charter prohibits the use of force by member states (in basic terms, it says war is unlawful). There are two exceptions: if the Security Council authorises collective security action (Chapter VII) or if a member state is the victim of an armed attack (Article 51).

Article 51 allows for individual self-defence (a state can defend itself) or collective self-defence (states can come to the aid of other recognised states).

It does not allow a state to invade another state to defend separatists or private citizens there. Putin can try to claim that it does but it does not. In fact in 1999 he objected to NATO intervening in Yugoslavia in defence of the Kosovo region, saying it was not lawful.

Keepyourheadscrewedon · 24/02/2022 17:03

Boris Johnson is speaking now (check out all news channels) and confirming that brave Ukraine is holding up well and defending their nation with ferocity.

Prayers for Ukraine.

Unsure33 · 24/02/2022 17:07

@Keepyourheadscrewedon

As with any bully, the world needs to stop right now cowering in the corner. We have to learn that appeasement simply does not work.

We have to stop worrying about his reaction, and start making this operation as painful and difficult as possible.

We need to stand up to him, as painful as it might be for some, we need to do so or there really will be WW3

When you say “we” do you mean NATO?
Roundeartheratchriatmas · 24/02/2022 17:15

Chatter online suggesting Russia have taken Chernobyl.

Unconfirmed.

Cocomarine · 24/02/2022 17:15

@CowboyJo

Incredibly sad and horrifying..

My 11 year daughter was the one to tell me about it all. She was so scared and it breaks my heart how the world is Sad

How did you manage to miss it until she told you?
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