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Original poster

I was out with a group of middle aged men last night

163 replies

DetailMouse · 20/02/2022 14:49

And I had a nice evening. We went to see a band in a pub and just by a fluke of who was/wasn't able to make it, I ended up being the only woman.

The youngest was 49 up to 57, I'm at the lower end. One single the rest either married or living with a partner. Two I've known since school although seen little of them in recent years, two I know through a hobby and two I didn't know at all until yesterday.

We all had a lot to drink, they were good company, but not overly charming (which I hate) they are all (I realised afterwards) in surprisingly good shape, not a beer belly between them, especially considering the beer that was consumed last night Grin and had made an effort to be pub smart for a Saturday night.

No one did or said anything inappropriate and no one even came close to making any kind of move on me.

There's no point to the post, except that this is my experience of most men. Have I lead some sort of charmed life or is the picture often painted on here reality for the majority?

OP posts:
AgathaAllAlong · 20/02/2022 17:57

I said this was my experience and asked if I've been exceptionally lucky or if my experience is more common than the very traumatic things some women have experienced at the hands of men.

If this is an honest question and you really don't have an agenda, I think the answer is: it's both. You are lucky to not have ever been assaulted, and extremely lucky to never have experienced anything unpleasant at the hands of men just for being a woman. But also, most experiences with men are like the one you describe.

The thing that folk seen to be missing is it just takes one assault or near miss, to you or a friend, to make you feel unsafe even in situations with harmless men. So yes, even if 99.9% of your experiences with men are positive, that 0.01% will (depending on how bad it was) be life ruining or at least put you on edge in certain situations. And the point is: that bad situation is almost always experienced by women, at the hands of men. It's rarely the other way round.

DillonPanthersTexas · 20/02/2022 17:57

I’m fascinated at all these men and women who just know their Male colleagues and friends are 100% good guys

Well we don't know 100% if they are good guys in the same manner you don't know 100% if your female friends are well behaved when you are not around. I can only judge my friends on the behaviour I see, so far my peer group are not a bunch of people who are racists, homophobes who hate women. If I found out a mate was some closet nazi or was physically abusing his partner we would not be friends for long. I don't know if my old uni mate of 20 plus years cat calls school girls when driving about town, I like to think based on everything I know about him to date that is extremely unlikely, so no, I don't know 100% that he is definitely a good guy but he has displayed zero behaviours in my presence that suggests he is not.

LocalHobo · 20/02/2022 18:00

@lljkk

OP can't speak about her good experiences of people (who happen to be men) without those statements "quietly" shaming women who had a different experience & want to talk about it... did I get that straight?

quietly shame women for speaking of their bad experiences of men...

The only sense I can make of that comment is to presume that PP thinks it's outrageous to ever say anything positive about any male person.

So that's MN nowadays. No one must EVER say anything nice about any person who happens to possess a penis. Simply intolerable.

Remember this MN rule when you want to say anything about your SONS.

Exactly. Where are our sons in this? I (and DH) have reared a decent male. Haven't you?
Adeleskirts · 20/02/2022 18:00

I don’t really understand the point of this? I work in a male dominated industry so am frequently thr only woman there. I relish my female friends, and it is a different vibe when out with blokes.

But men are just like women in my view, decent people overall. Yes sone people are bad or unpleasant, but it’s not the majority of either gender.

AmyDudley · 20/02/2022 18:04

There's no point to the post, except that this is my experience of most men. Have I lead some sort of charmed life or is the picture often painted on here reality for the majority?

That's the nature of posts on forums. The vast majority of people you encounter male or female are generally reasonably pleasant and normal. But people post because they are having problems with the rarer unpleasant ones. Obviously the men who do nasty stuff are the minority, but I have encountered a few over the years.
It's not 'this is Mn so everyone hates men. It is just that people post about hateful men because they need help dealing with/escaping from them at home or at work. And people reply saying ' what a dreadful man' because they are being supportive.

It's just the way it is - like no one was posting a few weeks back 'the weather is pleasant and unremarkable' but over the weekend there are several threads about storms.

TatianaBis · 20/02/2022 18:06

This can't be a real thread.

Cameleongirl · 20/02/2022 18:06

I agree, @DillonPanthersTexas, you can never 100% know whether anyone will behave in every situation, but you hopefully get a sense of them after knowing them for a while.

You may turn out to be wrong, but then that applies to almost every situation. One of my friends was shocked when another friend (whom I barely knew) left her DH and three children for her affair partner. My friend said it was so unlike this woman...shows what she knew.

BigFatLiar · 20/02/2022 18:09

My boss used to joke you could tell which male clients were married, as their shirts were whiter and had actually been ironed/ironed well.

I was bared from doing the ironing as I didn't put the creases in properly. OH did the washing and ironing (he actually quite enjoyed it - still does). Used to go to work with shirts and blouses pressed and starched any skirt or trousers pressed and clean. The girls were always smart and tidy, all down to him. Years of living on his own led to him doing for himself. Kitchen and toilet were always clean but the rest of the flat was a bit scruffy.

Original poster
DetailMouse · 20/02/2022 18:14

@Crikeyalmighty

Following on from my post above I can honestly say I’ve never as an adult women had a disrespectful experience when out socialising with a bunch of middle aged guys — my experience of disrespectful behaviour has always been behind closed doors in relationships/marriage— if you haven’t experienced it in a relationship context OP you are indeed a lucky lady.
No, u honestly haven't. I married the man I met at 19 and stayed married until he died though, so perfectly willing to accept my experience is narrow.

My parents are still married and bicker a lot, but if anyone is controlling in that relationship it's mum. I've certainly never seen anything that could be considered abusive from dad.

OP posts:
Original poster
DetailMouse · 20/02/2022 18:15

I ironed a shirt the week after we married and DH complained I hadn't got the creases right. I never ironed another shirt in 30 years Grin

OP posts:
RufustheFloralmissingreindeer · 20/02/2022 18:26

Remember this MN rule when you want to say anything about your SONS

Well its not actually a rule so i reckon I’ll be fine

tellmewhentheLangshiplandscoz · 20/02/2022 18:42

@Cameleongirl

What makes me roll my eyes is the vibe of "this has never happened to me or other women I know" as if we should pipe down with our experiences.

@tellmewhentheLangshiplandscoz

Perhaps I'm misunderstanding the original post, but I don't think the OP was saying that she's never experienced anything bad. I've been surrounded and sexually assaulted by a group of men (luckily other people heard my yells before anything worse happened), felt up on public transport, and followed, but I still think that most of the men I know IRL wouldn't do this.

I'm sorry for what happened to you Thanks

There have been posts on this thread which have given me that impression.

I sincerely hope none of the men I love would do these things but I wouldn't kid myself it's an impossibility.

JasperTheHungry · 20/02/2022 19:13

I’ve had many, many nights out with men which have been lovely. My ex was often amongst those men. Everyone thought he was a gem, and he was a gem on those nights out. Wouldn’t have made a pass at or been inappropriate with anyone. Totally gent all round. Raped me over a 100 times though. I’m not sure what this thread is demonstrating. Or my post tbh. Some men are good, some not so much.

Alisae · 20/02/2022 19:30

‘If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals.’

In my experience some men will behave VERY differently to women they perceive to be their equals, and those who are in some way inferior/vulnerable.

A middle class professional woman sat with peers in a public place is extremely unlikely to experience how one of them ‘may’ treat a woman they consider inferior when they get the opportunity/power imbalance.

There was a shocking difference between how I was treated by male friends when I was wealthy/good career and poor/disabled.

5128gap · 20/02/2022 20:17

@RufustheFloralmissingreindeer

Remember this MN rule when you want to say anything about your SONS

Well its not actually a rule so i reckon I’ll be fine

I have an adult son and a male partner. That doesn't change my view that the majority of men behave inappropriately to women in one way or another. In the unlikely event I became aware that my son and partner did this (and in all honesty, it is unlikely I'd become aware, as men don't show that side of themselves in front of their mothers and partners) I would be as critical of them as I would any other man. I don't see the conflict.
RufustheFloralmissingreindeer · 20/02/2022 20:23

i would be as critical of them as I would any other man. I don't see the conflict

Well yes…im sorry what do you think I’m saying?

RufustheFloralmissingreindeer · 20/02/2022 20:24

Cos I’m saying that this…No one must EVER say anything nice about any person who happens to possess a penis. Simply intolerable

Isnt a rule on mumsnet

RufustheFloralmissingreindeer · 20/02/2022 20:25

Oh bum

Bold fail

Eastie77Returns · 20/02/2022 21:01

OP, I have enjoyed many nights out with male friends that sound similar to the one you described. No surprise since they are my friends so the changes of any of them assaulting me or acting inappropriately are slim. I don’t know why you’d think it noteworthy that your friends behaved well. What else would you expect?

I have no idea if my male friends would behave similarly if they were out with a different woman. How can I? I think they are decent guys but honestly, no-one really knows another human being 100% and everyone has the capacity to surprise you. I went out for a drink with a male married colleague who has 2 children and was one of the sweetest guys I’d worked with. As the evening wore on a few more men arrived from the office and as the drinks flowed I overheard him talking about some of our female colleagues using some of the most disgusting language I’ve ever heard. This was a father of young daughters laughing about rape.

If you’ve never been unpleasantly surprised by a man’s behaviour you’ve had a charmed life.

DillonPanthersTexas · 20/02/2022 21:04

Oh bum

Ha, you said bum!

RufustheFloralmissingreindeer · 20/02/2022 21:06

@DillonPanthersTexas

Oh bum

Ha, you said bum!

😀
LondonQueen · 20/02/2022 21:07

Most men are lovely. It's the odd few that ruin it.

EveryFlightBeginsWithAFall · 20/02/2022 21:36

This is not a safe space for women, it's not a safe space for anyone! It's a huge online forum ffs Grin

5128gap · 20/02/2022 21:40

@RufustheFloralmissingreindeer

i would be as critical of them as I would any other man. I don't see the conflict

Well yes…im sorry what do you think I’m saying?

Sorry Rufus, I was intending to comment on the post you had quoted, not your comment, which I agree with. My mistake.
RufustheFloralmissingreindeer · 20/02/2022 21:43

Oh thats no problem 5128

Thanks for getting back to me…I’m easily flummoxed 💐