(Wrong) English etiquette guides for Europeans.

[GaiusHelenMohiam]

I was chatting to a customer yesterday at work. She’s lived in the UK for a few years but has yet to make any meaningful female friendships, works with a load of blokes who she gets on fine with but is looking for real friendship.

Anyway, one of the first things she said to me was ‘you have beautiful eyes’ which was lovely if a bit out of nowhere (and I did wonder if she was chatting me up).

A little bit later we ended up chatting at the bar and she told me about the friends thing and that she was reading a book (in her language) about English etiquette and that apparently the done thing is to find something to compliment your new acquaintance on.

I think this is great, if slightly bonkers advice, and I wish it really was an English thing to do. I always make a point of sincerely complimenting people on a particular dress, shoes, etc but it’s not routine.

I did say to her I’d probably steer clear of commenting on hair, eyes or anything physical, because it can come across a bit intense, and that it’s not particularly a very British thing to do but I think it should be.

I just love the idea that there are books floating around Europe with completely off base ways of behaving more like the locals when you move to the UK.

I’m really curious what else her book tells her but alas I didn’t get a chance to ask before closing time. If she comes back I’ll find out.

I read a Japanese detective novel and the conversations seemed completely normal to me.

PermanentTemporary obviously reading one detective novel tells you more than living in the country for a couple of years Or were you being ironic?

DH is German and I have managed to train him not to say “you are wrong” to people he doesn’t know well rather than “ I think you might be mistaken” or similar.
Austrians are worse, we have Austrian rellies and while they are actually lovely people you need a thick skin to survive a visit

@Mikeythecat

Not really linked, but I met à French guy in a bar 15 years ago who (upon hearing my English accent) came up to me a said, "Grrrr. You English people with your fucking Neighbourhood Watch! Fuck your Neighbourhood Watch!"

I'd love to know what happened to him.

Love this!

@MurciaMarmalade

My partner is Spanish and we live in Manchester. He couldn't get his head round everyone saying 'see you later' as a goodbye when no-one has any intention of seeing anybody later! He was also told we all stop to drink tea at 5pm

A Scouse friend of mine, who has lived in London for 40 years, periodically goes back to Liverpool; and she used the phrase 'see you later' to an old friend - who was baffled.

She assumed they'd be getting together later on.

It appears that, back in the 80's, they didn't say that in Liverpool either!

@BillGigolo

This thread is reminding me of a lovely job I had working with EFL mature students at university. We had a big group from the Middle East and they loved learning Glaswegian/Scottish phrases and decided to use them as much as possible. So you’d get the Saudi dads coming down the hallway saying awrite ma man to the academics and without fail someone would ask me if I was going oot and aboot at the weekend.

Re other points on this thread, I find when I’m abroad quite often people conflate British with English but that doesn’t mean they don’t see Scotland as insignificant, just separate. Which I can’t really get bothered about tbh, I don’t put a lot of stock in having a ‘British’ identity beyond what it says on my passport.

I live and work in the ME and I've experienced similar with the Bahraini/Omanis who have spent time I the UK.

Me: "thanks ever so much for doing that Khalid"
Them: "most welcome FiveGs, lovely jubbly"

@GaiusHelenMohium please change your username to @GaiusHelenMohiumSheOfTheBeautifulEyes

I knew a PhD student from South Korea who was determined to perfect "the English gentleman". He had a book (in English, or I'd obviously not have understood it!) explaining what to wear and when, where to buy suits (Saville Row - not PhD budget-friendly!), how to make tea properly (so many people I've met believe the teabags go in after the water, he didn't!), gosh there was so much.

He took it very seriously. I can understand because he came from a culture with a lot of rules and traditions (from what he said), and it was incredibly important to get them right, so as no r to offend people. I think in the U.K. while there are definitely social norms, it's not too problematic if people, especially foreigners, don't get them 100% right.

‘Funny Peculiar or Funny Ha-Ha’ is a quote my DDdad used to say and I now use.

(Google tells me it’s from a 1936 play called The Housemaster?!)

@UntilYourNextHairBrainedScheme

crustybreaddarling 22 years here 🤣😜

Stronger nerves than me :) 21 for us, but we moved to splitting time between here (Hessen) and the UK in 2013. Post Brexit we're now resident here again, but I still use as many days as I can in the UK.

That's not to say I don't like living here - when I'm here I miss England and when I'm in England I miss Germany.

Round here a fairly standard greeting is 'now then' but pronounced 'nah then' , that can confuse the non natives.

@FinallyHere

My DH is half German and still doesn't believe me that its more polite to turn up to a social engagement at an English person's house 5 minutes late than ten minutes early...

I grew up in Germany, now live in England.

No one would arrive 10mins early in Germany. They will get to the location 10mins early then walk up and down so they can ring the bell exactly at the time for which you are invited.

When my mother used to warn new people that that is how it works there. They would often not believe her, til they had their own party and looked out the window a few minutes before the time set to see everyone walking up by and down, ready to press the doorbell at the appointed time.

Oh, that's interesting.

I'd say in my in-laws area (southern) that's more the case. Round us (Hessen) it's definitely always the German lot who arrive slightly ahead of the stated time and the Brits who roll up 10-15 minutes later.

I met friends for breakfast yesterday and the cafe owner was most tickled that I was the first there and the Germans were late. This would be because I'm walking distance and they're not, the Gemeinde had kicked off a bit of unexpected tree felling and shut the road into town. As you do.

We had some online cultural diversity training at work.
Some was correct and really useful. Eg if a Japanese client gives you a business card, don't write on it as this would be really offensive. Common practice otherwise so that was worth knowing .
Other parts not so accurate. I was amused to learn that Englishmen always wear waistcoats. If you are invited to visit their home, you will be offered a cup of tea on arrival and it would be considered rude to refuse.

@GlacindaTheTroll

Oh dear - I thought that this was going to be a thread on how to tease the unwary (a bit like spoof magazine tips columns)

Like 'it's always polite to take the seat right next to someone when the rest of the carriage is empty, no-one wants to feel alone and snubbed'

Oooohhhh cozy!

LOL!!!

My DH is half German and still doesn't believe me that its more polite to turn up to a social engagement at an English person's house 5 minutes late than ten minutes early

OMG, it’s awful to arrive early at someone’s house when they may still be rushing around getting ready! I’ve spent 10 minutes walking round the block in freezing cold rather than commit the social sin of arriving early. It’s just politeness.

I had a guest once arrive half an hour early when I was still in my dressing gown — I’d got everything ready before putting my party dress on, as people often do.

Of course it’s fine to arrive early for an appointment at someone’s workplace, where you can wait in the reception area till they’re ready. Or if meeting people outside, or at a cafe or venue — it’s good to be early then.

FinallyHere my DH has lived in Germany all his life aside from 7 years in his 20s and we've lived in Germany many years together and raised our children here. People absolutely do turn up 10 minutes early and ring the bell. Its stressful when hosting children's parties until you recalibrate and are psychologically prepared for a start time 10 minutes before the time you wrote on the invitation. By the start time all the children would always have arrived (and taken off their shoes )

I'm from NE England. Y'alright is a common greeting that's should be answered "y'alright?" or "yeah, you?"

Fine can mean it's fine or mean anything but fine. If an English person says it's fine then please tread carefully

If you are in the North of England it is expected that you will speak to randoms in the street, at bus stops or on public transport. Making eye contact is also the norm as is smiling.

I work for an airline that used to often serve a cream tea. The clotted cream being plopped into coffee was a common occurrence.

I have a lot of customers abroad. An alarming number of Americans have said the phrase "oh my god, I love your accent! Do you know the Queen?".

Cheers or ta are local equivalents of thank you and can cause confusion.

Most people assume if you are English then you live in London whereas I'm much closer to Scotland than London, geographically as well as culturally.

I’m in Yorkshire and it’s not uncommon to say “cheers” instead of a Thank You.
That has caused some confusion for some Indian Clients

@UntilYourNextHairBrainedScheme

I lived in Japan for a couple of years and Japanese people (especially women) put British cultural norms of not saying what is meant in the shade. In Japan group harmony is paramount, and nobody says what they mean except in private conversation with good friends/ family.

It's ironic that someone was told up thread that British people don't say what they mean while studying Japanese in Sweden given Japanese cultural norms!

Yes and his teacher was Japanese.

There was also a conversation about slippers and how many pairs is normal, which rooms you could wear them in.

On the subject of time there isn't just Indian time, there is also Deaf time. In Deaf culture you do not leave a place until you have said good bye to everyone you know, personally, not just a wave.

Also before modern communication if you went to see a Deaf friend you wouldn't just knock on the door and go if they didn't appear, you would go to look in all the windows, the back door, to make sure the person was actually out.

Fine can mean it's fine or mean anything but fine

If I say I am fine, my friend always asks 'fine fine ? or fucked off fine'

@BashfulClam

You have used UK and England interchangeably in your OP and I always find that a bit annoying being a Scot, just my opinion.

Here the customary greeting is usually ‘Awright?’ and the reply is ‘no bad’. I was in Spain a few years ago at an apartment complex where the guests are mostly Scottish (about 98%). The young waiter was working on his English and asked me one morning ‘How are you today? Fine or no bad?’ I didn’t tell him that was mostly a Scottish way of speaking. Also if in Scotland and exiting a bus you should thank the driver, not sure what for but we do it

I've lived in Scotland for 20 odd years but am English. The bus thing is a northern English thing too. I was always taught to do that

sashh that's really interesting about deaf culture!

Ever hear a German person say "happy hunger" to you as you start to eat?

If so, they probably learnt it from someone I knew who taught English in Germany , where his students refused to believe the English had no equivalent to "guten Appetit" or "Mahlzeit".
Eventually he admitted that there was an equivalent but it was rather petit bourgeois and not often used. It became very popular.

@Hoppinggreen

I’m in Yorkshire and it’s not uncommon to say “cheers” instead of a Thank You. That has caused some confusion for some Indian Clients

This is also a thing in London.

*parts of London.