DC feels aggrieved because school friends have ‘more’

[Foolsrule]

A bit of a strange one. We live in a nice house in a nice area. DC attend a school with a mixed catchment and have friends from a range of backgrounds. Eldest DC is under the impression that we are poor as we don’t have a huge wide screen TV, she doesn’t have her own phone and I send her to school swimming with a plain John Lewis towel as opposed to a branded/themed Disney one. She seems envious of her friends who seem to have a lot of ‘stuff’ on a daily basis, but don’t have the holidays, the range of out of school activities etc. and opportunities she has. I have explained that different families do things differently, we place value on different things but neither way is right or wrong, and she still seems to feel hard done by. Some of it might be about fitting in? Any ideas, anyone?

@Insert1x20p

I hate threads like this because it makes me feel that no matter what I do, my kids will inevitably moan about it when they're adults

Of course they will. It's what kids do. I still moan about my mum being super crunchy (before it was a thing- pretty sure she invented vegan Mondays) because it was "embarrassing" when all my mates had white bread sandwiches and a kitkat. Also wasn't allowed to watch Grange Hill or Eastenders (social death). Obviously at the time I didn't appreciate the good things she did (very engaged parent, took us to so many places, taught us loads of cool stuff), because everything was so unfair and mortifying but now I do.... I just still moan about the lentil stew

I'm with you. Kids are meant to moan and whinge a bit. Parents are meant to get grumpy and tell them they don't know they're born. There will be a lecture about the meaning of money and a fair amount of eye rolling on all sides. All part of life's rich (okay, comfortable) tapestry.

Fitting in really is over rated, it really has shades of being easily led/ gullible/spineless.

I slightly disagree with this @MultiStorey. I was that child who didn’t fit in, and stood out because I owned and wore things that were “different”. When you have a shy and unconfident child why would you impose your desire to be different on that child?

As an adult I now don’t care what other people think, but being a little bit “different” as a child really didn’t help my self-confidence.

When DD was a child she didn’t want to look “different”, and with the school uniform rules it was easy anyway. At 21 she doesn’t look like a clone of other 21 year old girls, but has developed her own style, but this was her decision, not mine.

[quote SarahAndQuack]@Silverswirl, did you miss the posts suggesting that the OP should get the towel for Christmas? There were a few![/quote]
No I didn’t miss them and in fact I suggested it up thread. But so many posters just saying- get her the bloody towel. Get her what she needs to fit in. I was never allowed ‘stuff’ as a kid and am still dealing with the fall out now.
Bonkers. We all need to use less.
Kid has a perfectly good towel. If she had no towel then fair enough but she has a decent towel.
That should be enough until it’s Christmas.
It’s just not about the towel though. It’s about not buying into the whole culture of got to have xy and z if you don’t want your kid to be scarred for life.
I wondered where those parents were as I never seem to meet any in real life but I see they are all alive and well on this thread

Also, living overseas and attending an international school, it’s a HUGE culture shock coming back to the UK and attending a local school.

@Derbee can you expand? Just interested as we currently live abroad and my kids go to an international school but we are moving back in the next few years.

Most adults still try and fit in and that is not a bad thing. At work, I wear clothes that fit into what is acceptable. I don't try and be different and push any dress codes to the absolute edge. If I go to a wedding I fit in with what I wear, or a funeral. Fitting in is fine when appropriate.
Save the not fitting in lessons for things that matter. And standing up to them requires self-esteem and confidence.

Yep same here. Even though they have the latest trainers that I begrudge paying stupid prices for and quite a lot of tech and nice holidays/days out.
Apparently we are poor because we don't have two cars.... I'm the only driver in our family and I have a car!

I'd buy her the towel for Christmas to be fair.

@MyAnacondaMight

So much of this thread resonates with me. I never had a swimming towel, lunchbox, branded school jumper, or sleeping bag for sleepovers. It didn’t reach me a lesson in frugality or in valuing things that last. Instead, it damaged my self esteem and made me feel unworthy of nice things - which I’m still fixing as an adult. I have a giant Mickey Mouse beach towel (still cool!), an expensive lunchbox collection, a sweatshirt that reminds me of the school one I coveted (complete with the soft fleecey inside), and a sleeping bag - just in case I ever want to go camping (I don’t). I’m not materialistic generally - just about those key items that I never had as a child.

It’s OK to not buy those little things that matter to children, if you can’t afford it. But if you can, then the only lesson you’re giving is that you don’t care about what’s important to them.

There’s a middle ground. You indulge some of it, refuse some of it and allow them to use their own money on some if it. That’s parenting.

Fitting in really is over rated, it really has shades of being easily led/ gullible/spineless.

Fitting in at school is often just about wanting a quiet life.

I couldn’t care less about fitting in now, I’m a vegan and care more about the planet than having stuff. At school though, I wanted enough stuff to not be noticed.

Well, I agree it's not about the towel.

I don't think there's anyone on this thread saying the OP should get her DD everything she wants, at all. I genuinely don't get where you're getting that from. But people are saying that a small amount of compromising and allowing a child to choose something you, the parent, don't personally particularly like, is probably quite good.

If you're bothered about consumerism, defer the decision until next time she needs something, then let her choose?

I do get that it sounds as if the OP's DD gets a certain amount of choice, btw - but I don't think that was initially all that clear on this thread.

I'm an adult. I have my own mind. I wear what I want, say what I want. I'm not particularly a fashion follower and have my own values. If I have friends that didn't agree with me well they can just piss off that's fine by me. If I worked somewhere and didn't like the ethos, then I could just move jobs.

However as a child you go to school,the same school for year after year. You are stuck with the same load of kids whether they are nice or not. If you're labelled the 'weird' one for having the wrong bag, towel, coat it's not character forming. It's not a lesson in being individual. It's year after year of being isolated.

I think you should stop trying to 'convince' her. This is perfectly normal behaviour/commentary for her age and stage. Empathise. It's hard at school when everyone makes a fuss of something you don't have or you feel left out cos you don't have something. No need to rush out and buy everything she asks for. If it's birthday or Xmas, add these things to her list. If it's not, empathise, and let her have a moan in her own home.

No one learns empathy for others or gratefulness from a lecture. She'll get there in her own time.

@Silverswirl I probably buy less stuff than most people I know. I still buy things my kids actually want. I don't insist my desire for a particular look is better than theirs. I bought stuff in the Disney Store, not lots, a lunchbox I think and maybe a few other bits. Sure they were overpriced, but they loved it. For myself I would just buy something cheap from ASDA.

My DC had phones when they started going places by themselves, so age 9/10. Buy her the towel.

@freshcarnation

I'm an adult. I have my own mind. I wear what I want, say what I want. I'm not particularly a fashion follower and have my own values. If I have friends that didn't agree with me well they can just piss off that's fine by me. If I worked somewhere and didn't like the ethos, then I could just move jobs.

However as a child you go to school,the same school for year after year. You are stuck with the same load of kids whether they are nice or not. If you're labelled the 'weird' one for having the wrong bag, towel, coat it's not character forming. It's not a lesson in being individual. It's year after year of being isolated.

Yes this. I really do think lots of adults forget what being a child is like.

Silverswirl
I don't think anyone is saying just buy lots and lots of stuff to fit in. They're just saying that navigating the pre teen and teen years can be hard and it's not unreasonable for parents to make some effort to help their DC instead of expecting an 11 year old to have the same financial and emotional maturity as an adult.

There has to be some give and take to educate.

@RuleWithAWoodenFoot

Yeah but OP, you place value on things too - the 'John Lewis' towel (why do we need to know that), the 'living abroad' thing making you somehow better to other people.

Buy her a Dryrobe or something for swimming - is better quality than John Lewis and won't be immediately discarded as babyish when she's at secondary.

She will be ridiculed by her peers if you bought her a dry robe.

@julieca

Most adults still try and fit in and that is not a bad thing. At work, I wear clothes that fit into what is acceptable. I don't try and be different and push any dress codes to the absolute edge. If I go to a wedding I fit in with what I wear, or a funeral. Fitting in is fine when appropriate. Save the not fitting in lessons for things that matter. And standing up to them requires self-esteem and confidence.

YY, this.

Fitting in is also about things like teaching your child how to be friendly and nice to people - it's the intangible things as well as the material ones.

I think the people like me on this thread, who were reminiscing about our parents' brown bread or whatever, are remembering not so much the horror of that specific choice of food, but the accompanying parental attitude. It's awfully easy to defend your own good choices to your kids in such a way that you come across as doing down someone else's. And that does not set a child up well to be liked by their peers, because children hear this stuff. No one wants to be the child whose mother is loudly announcing that Disney is tat, when half the class have Disney stuff.

She will be ridiculed by her peers if you bought her a dry robe.

My kids have them and are not ridiculed. If anyone did ridicule them they'd think that was a sign of some massive insecurity on the part of the ridiculee and would probably not want to have someone that silly as a friend. Ridiculing is bullying. Some kids are strong enough to see bullies for what they are and not be impacted by their ridiculousness.

You do realise this won't stop at the Disney towel and phone, don't you OP?
DS went to a very mixed comprehension and regularly spouted stuff like 'I need an iPhone, everyone else at school has one'. He had a perfectly decent android phone which was sufficient, especially as his first (2nd hand) phone got broken when he was pushed. We then progressed to ' can I have a car for my 17th, everyone else is getting one'. Yes there were a few who had cars bought for them, including one who had a brand new Fiat 500 soft top with personalised number plates, but it was definitely not the norm for most people.
You need to stick to your values and budget and just explain to your DD why she shouldn't just want the same as everyone else. No doubt if you buy her a Disney towel, the others will all get some new 'must have' towel for Christmas and she still won't have the latest!

@freshcarnation

I'm an adult. I have my own mind. I wear what I want, say what I want. I'm not particularly a fashion follower and have my own values. If I have friends that didn't agree with me well they can just piss off that's fine by me. If I worked somewhere and didn't like the ethos, then I could just move jobs.

However as a child you go to school,the same school for year after year. You are stuck with the same load of kids whether they are nice or not. If you're labelled the 'weird' one for having the wrong bag, towel, coat it's not character forming. It's not a lesson in being individual. It's year after year of being isolated.

100% agree.

And even one or two token items would make all the difference in the world. Most kids, if you look closer, have the "right" bag but knock off shoes, the "right" pencil case but lookalike pens etc.

For me it was a rucksack. The normal rucksack could have been filled with knock offs, and I'd have still been quiet and academic, but the wrong rucksack was so very long I might as well have been carrying around a big target.

@LolaSmiles

Silverswirl I don't think anyone is saying just buy lots and lots of stuff to fit in. They're just saying that navigating the pre teen and teen years can be hard and it's not unreasonable for parents to make some effort to help their DC instead of expecting an 11 year old to have the same financial and emotional maturity as an adult.

There has to be some give and take to educate.

Yes I agree to an extent. I have 3 pre teens myself. If they need something new, the get to choose it however, I won’t indulge crazy priced brands unless it’s a main Christmas or birthday present. DD friend has a ted baker school bag for example costing £120. DD wanted one. It’s a nope. Would rather try to educate on why it’s insane to line the pockets of a rich designer with your hard earned money when you can get the same quality for a third of the price. This comes from not buying everything for them. DD can earn money from me if she wishes and buy the bag. However it would take a hell of a lot of chores and work to get that much. When she actually has saved, she realised that she could get a cheaper bag she liked and still have lots of money left for other things she liked and needed.

[quote julieca]@TatianaBis Instead being consumerist by buying a John Lewis towel is fine?[/quote]
It’s just a bogstandard homeware supplier.

My son was a bit like this. I'd buy him it for birthday or Christmas, or get him to pay half if it was an 'unnecessary' item.

OP, I think I understand where you are coming from and I used to feel the same when my dd was about the same age as yours. However, it's important that your daughter doesn't feel singled out amongst her friends and feels she fits in. Therefore, I would give a bit on fashion items and let her have them if it's something you can afford (what's fashionable is often cheaper anyway if you are used to buying quality things) I used to want to buy my dd designer fashion things which were to my taste- but had to concede she just wanted to shop at H&M and New Look like her friends.

Try to take the focus away from her privilege and maybe explain that it's not about money or things like that eg. you won't let her have a TV in her room because you want her to be with the family and don't agree with TVs in rooms. Explain it is a parenting choice, not about money. For example my dd wanted to watch 15 rated films when she was 10 because her friends did- I explained that just because they did it, it didn't make it right and I wanted to be a good parent to her- she seemed to accept this more readily than a blanket no.

When I was growing up we didn't have a lot of the things our neighbours had, even though we were all extremely very similar in terms of affluence (I realise now, back then my brother and I were teased for being "poor"). My parents were also not keen on flashy clothes or buying things for the sake of it. As an adult I understand all this and I embody those values myself. I am appreciative of what we were able to have instead (university education - paid for where I am from). BUT it was very hard as a child and I don't have good memories at all. I certainly don't feel as though my parents made any effort to understand what it might be like for us or were listening to what we told them. This has impacted our relationship and my feelings about them, even though I am grateful for what they did do for us and for the values they imparted. Like others have said, try to understand where she is coming from and find a way to address it that is still in tune with your values.