DH and his little girl - question

[FireflyLon]

So my DH asked me a question today and I really didn't know what the right answer is. We are expecting a little girl 🥰 and he asked me when he has to take her to a public toilet will he take her to the men's or women's. I said women but I was thinking I've actually never seen that. What are your thoughts?

@QuillBill

But I was also thinking when she's older let's say 4 or 5, does he still take her to the men's? I rather not

You rather not what?

Are you suggesting that there is something uncomfortable about your (yet to be born) four or five year old daughter going into the men's toilets so to combat this your husband should go into the women's toilets?

If this is not why you don't want her in the mens then why is it?

I'd assume it was because of the urinals, not very nice for a little girl.

@FatCatThinCat

Men go in the men's. Women go in the women's. Children go with their parent.

This.

I took my daughter to the men’s with me until she was about 8. Then she went in the women’s on her own. No way should I, the adult, be in the women’s.

[quote FireflyLon]@MadMadMadamMim I'm quite Liberal in my views. I've explained my views didn't expect this level of angry replies and to be completely honest very disappointed by all these replies. I understand different views and would appreciate if you could respect mine[/quote]
I think that the point where you lose the right to have people respect your opinion is when your opinion fails to respect their boundaries.

OP this is not going to be an issue during shared parental leave because your baby will be in nappies. My husband’s and my experience in and around London is that the baby change is usually a unisex disabled loo, a separate unisex facility or there is a changing table in both the ladies and the gents. It’s pretty rare now for baby change to be in the ladies only.

So the short answer is that you don’t have to think about it yet.

When your daughter gets older and uses the loo, I think it’s fair not try to avoid her going into the gents where there is a possibility of her seeing men with their willies out (though no issue with her seeing her father weeing at home). And by that I just mean men having a wee, not doing anything more sinister. It just doesn’t sit right. However if he could stick his head in, check no urinals in use and take her into a cubicle (again checking clear before exiting the cubicle) then all well and good. If the gents was busy with urinal users I’d suggest he use the disabled as long as he’s in and out quickly. (This is of course a controversial view, but since so many disabled toilets are also the baby change, disabled users are already sharing them with parents). And obviously if you are talking a single-person gender-specific toilet like you might find in a small restaurant, no issues there.

@LorenzoVonMatterhorn

My point is if we want men to be more involved in raising children why don't we make it easier for them? Our standards for fathers are on the floor compared to mothers. How do we make it any easier than it is already for men compared to women? Can they do nothing for themselves? Do they just have to take from women?

I think OP is talking about her DDs needs. There isn't an issue about taking a little boy into the ladies as all in cubicles but different for a little girl walking past men using the urinals. Do you want to punish a little girl to score a point against men?

@MadMadMadamMim

I respect all your views I just struggle to see an issue with a man entering a women's toilet with his daughter.

Really? I struggle to see why you would ever think it's appropriate.

I've never seen a man in the ladies with a child and I would make a huge fuss if one came in. It's utterly unacceptable.

Seriously? So if a man came into clean you would would make a huge fuss?

@LorenzoVonMatterhorn

The more important question, is why your dh is not using the four years he has until this becomes an issue to campaign for better family bathrooms in your town.

How will it be 4 years when she is pregnant now? Will he not be taking the baby out without mum within the next 4 years

He should be going to the men’s with her until your DD is able to use the women’s alone.

She's a girl and she belongs in the ladies. Just because she can't get there by herself doesn't mean she should be taken to the men's imo.

He’s a man so belongs in the men’s. When we go to restaurants now I let my child go into the women’s toilets alone as long as I can see the door, she would be terrified if she came out of a cubicle and found a man there unexpectedly because she knows it is a place for women and girls.

I just don't think you'll come across this problem very often. There's pretty much always a toilet cubicle with a baby change table and a toilet in it everywhere. The fact that it's usually a disabled toilet is an issue, but practically he would have to wherever the baby change is. When she's out if nappies she goes in a cubicle in the men's with him (as she'll be with her parent at all times I can't see how this is an issue?), but it's not long until she's old enough to go in the women's toilet and he stands outside the door. Although saying that, I still either use the toilet with the baby change or the women's toilet with my son who is 5 and I will continue doing so for at least a year or two more. My DH was letting my daughter go into the women's on her own when she was 6 or so, but that's because men just are more dangerous than women. There's no point trying to pretend that a young girl alone in the women's toilet faces an equivalent risk to a young boy alone in the men's. And no, there's zero reason why your DH needs to go into the women's toilet himself. And your comment about him self identifying as a woman was in very poor taste.

A lady came in with her grown up but clearly 'special needs' son. Obviously not a problem for her to bring him in. Well, I would not have thought so. it’s inappropriate for lots of reasons for him to be there and I don’t know anyone who would do this. It’s absolutely shot not being catered for and yes I’m sure I should campaign for enter facilities but sadly I just can’t stretch to it. I would imagine the woman had her period as that’s the really tricky week. Roll on menopause.

@Deathraystare

The situation is much more difficult for female carers of adult males. They basically are just not catered for

I thought of this when in Sainsbury's toilet. A lady came in with her grown up but clearly 'special needs' son. Obviously not a problem for her to bring him in. Well, I would not have thought so.

Yes that is difficult as well. These sort of reasons are why I support properly built unisex facilities.

Of course he goes into the men's loos. There isn't any query about this . If there is a family loo or changing facility then he can use that but otherwise the men's lavatories as he is an adult man. Btw if neither of them aren't disabled that isn't an option. When your daughter is old enough to go into the women's loo alone he can loiter outside for her. This is a non issue.

It really wouldn't bother me that much if a man came into the ladies with his daughters but it may bother other women, and thats what matters. Your grown adult husband can't just wander into the ladies because he has a female child. In most places there are baby change with toilets, or disabled toilets usually have a baby change in them so I can't see that it will become a problem often.
Wondering if this is actually a thread off the back of yesterday's little boy in female changing room thread.

@Muffinsandfruitcakes

Oh bless him. He really is planning ahead isn't he! 🙂 I've seen men in the ladies changing their baby daughters (at hospitals and restaurants). I had no issues with that at all. He is there to change his daughter just like there'll probably be men in the ladies doing maintenance. I don't think he should be taking her to a men's toilet unless it has a baby changing area. Ideally she should take her to a disabled toilet which has baby changing. She's a girl and she belongs in the ladies. Just because she can't get there by herself doesn't mean she should be taken to the men's imo. I am surely there'll be plenty who'll disagree with me though. He can always self-identify as a woman just for that instance ...

You may well have no issues, you cannot speak for every woman who may use that single sex space though.

If the mens isnt sanitary or safe enough then men better get that sorted.

@Deathraystare

The situation is much more difficult for female carers of adult males. They basically are just not catered for

I thought of this when in Sainsbury's toilet. A lady came in with her grown up but clearly 'special needs' son. Obviously not a problem for her to bring him in. Well, I would not have thought so.

How are they not catered for? That is exactly what the disabled facilties are for.

How will it be 4 years when she is pregnant now? Will he not be taking the baby out without mum within the next 4 years confused
She wont need to use a toilet for a few years. Surely that was obvious. Until then he can plan his days out and know where the baby changes are.

@Biancadelrioisback because I wouldn't want her seeing an adult males penis!!

@LifesNotEnidBlyton

Well obviously he shouldn't take her into the women's. As said it's a women's space.

But I don't agree with the people saying the disabled toilet is OK. It's no more OK for him to use a disabled space than a women's space if he isn't disabled.

He needs to use the mens or a unisex or family toilet when changing her or taking her into the toilet. He'll find out quiet soon where toilets he can use to change her are, and in an emergency he can take her to the car, but there shouldn't be many places that only a woman can change a baby.

But when you are caring for a child you take them into the space designated for you. So if you're an able bodied man then that's not the women's or the disabled.

What about when the disabled has a baby change in it? The fact is that taking little kids for a wee can be a faff and you’re grateful for more space, a low down sink for them to wash their hands. Sometimes you need to change underwear after an accident. When your child is a baby who need the changing table it’s fine to be in there. I can’t see that there is much difference using it with a young child who still needs a lot of space and supervision. Tbh in 5 years I have never once come out of a disabled loo to find anyone other than another parent waiting outside.

[quote Spunout]@Biancadelrioisback because I wouldn't want her seeing an adult males penis!![/quote]
Why is your partner planning on dangling his daughter over the top/side of urinals?

@5zeds

The situation is much more difficult for female carers of adult males. They basically are just not catered for

Probably for male carers of adult females as well.

Nightmare isn't it.

Some people are so desperate to be woke that they don't care what they lose in the process.

Women's spaces are for women. Your DH can't go in.

I remember a couple of occasions as a child where my dad would stand in the doorway of the men's and check if there was anyone in there before taking me and my sister in. If there were men using the urinals he would make us wait and go in after they had done. If it wasn't clean or we were desperate or whatever then he would knock on the ladies door and ask if anyone minded him coming in to help us use the loo or use the baby changing facilities. But he would always make his presence known and offer to leave if anyone was uncomfortable.

Sometimes it is inevitable that a father would have to go into the ladies. I remember my sister being poorly and dad had no choice but to come in and help her clean herself up (and go buy her some new clothes). Nobody cared they were only concerned for my sister!

This would be very offensive to some religious women. I get you don't have a problem but perhaps you could think about them and of women who are very nervous of any men and could be discomforted. There's a reason that public toilets have signs warning of male attendants or male cleaners present. It's too alert women don't want or are unable to use that facility.

Lots of women are afraid of men not because of how they've been brought up but because of rape, sexual assault and violence. They can't unlearn their triggers just because your DH is nice or shouting that he's a woman.

@Dobbyafreeelf I've seen male cleaners in toilets and I don't find that an issue at all, their job is to clean those toilets. But if so saw another man in the women's toilets I'd tell them to leave (or I'd probably tell a member of staff that there's a man in the women's toilet and ask them to remove them). There's no reason why a man, who is not at that time a cleaner employed the clean the toilets, needs to be in a women's toilet. Any man in their shouldn't be surprised if they get a lot of grief if they do go into one. The OP's attitude, that it's OK because her DH can hold his own, is disgraceful. What does she think he's going to do, start arguing the toss about being allowed in their with a women asking him to leave? If that happened I'd expect the manager to kick him off the premises. He doesn't have a right to be in there, even is he asserts himself. And he's not a transgender women so to use that argument is insulting to all women, transgender or not.

@Simonjt no, disabled toilets are for disabled people NOT their carers who should use the toilets appropriate to their sex. Many disabled people are capable of waiting while their carers use the appropriate facilities but if they aren’t it becomes extremely difficult if you are not the same sex to use a toilet outside the home.