DH and his little girl - question

[FireflyLon]

So my DH asked me a question today and I really didn't know what the right answer is. We are expecting a little girl 🥰 and he asked me when he has to take her to a public toilet will he take her to the men's or women's. I said women but I was thinking I've actually never seen that. What are your thoughts?

In cubicles. The cubicle is the private space. It’s completely illogical to exclude men with small daughters from women’s loos entirely.

Have you ever been in a public toilet? Not exactly “private” cubicles

I don’t know anyone who’s comfortable with men being on maternity wards 24/7, quite the opposite in fact.

@Blossomtoes

It's privacy for women when they are going through like miscarriage, heavy periods, or incontinence after birth. All these things sometimes need to be taken care of in public washrooms

In cubicles. The cubicle is the private space. It’s completely illogical to exclude men with small daughters from women’s loos entirely.

Jesus, we allow men on maternity wards 24/7, then lose our shit about this. There’s absolutely no logic.

Not always in cubicles. Things like stained or dirty clothing having to be rinsed in sinks, doesn't happen in a cubicle. Also cubicles aren't necessarily that private as they have gaps at the top and bottom. If they were totally private, enclosed cubicles, we wouldn't need men's and womens loos at all would we?

Men are allowed on maternity wards because there is no other option. It isn't as if dads could go to a different ward to see their wife and baby. And plenty of people object to men on maternity wards too.

So there is some logic. You may not agree but don't assert there's no logic just because you haven't had the wit to think it through from anyone else's perspective.

@RosieGuacamosie

Oh and a man who would “hold his own” or decide to identify as a woman to gain access to women only spaces is EXACTLY why we don’t want mixed sex facilities.

100%^^

Sounds like exactly the sort of man I would not like anywhere near me when I'm feeling vulnerable.

@RosieGuacamosie

In cubicles. The cubicle is the private space. It’s completely illogical to exclude men with small daughters from women’s loos entirely.

Have you ever been in a public toilet? Not exactly “private” cubicles

I don’t know anyone who’s comfortable with men being on maternity wards 24/7, quite the opposite in fact.

Yes, I have obviously been in a public loo. In an enclosed cubicle with a locked door. They’re all like it.

Every woman wants her partner on the maternity ward, how does that equate to nobody being comfortable with it?

@DietrichandDiMaggio

If you are uncomfortable with your daughter going into the men's then they should use the disabled.

No, they shouldn't. Why do people keep saying use the disabled toilet? Being a parent isn't a disability. Those toilets are provided because disabled people campaigned for them, so that people who can't physically access the general use toilets, or need support to go to the loo, or need to be able to get to a loo quickly have a toilet they can use.

Ideally she should take her to a disabled toilet which has baby changing.
Also, it is really lazy/shit that shops etc. make the disabled toilets double-up as changing facilities, because people changing babies take ages, so the people who need those toilets (sometimes urgently) can't get in.

this

In cubicles. The cubicle is the private space. It’s completely illogical to exclude men with small daughters from women’s loos entirely.

What about the women with pushchairs who need the toilet who are forced to sit with the door open while they pee/change tampons because they're not allowed to use the disabled toilet? Where are they supposed to go for privacy if men are allowed into the ladies'?

I have never ever seen a man in a women’s public toilet ( Except male staff who are cleaners and there is a warning notice ).

I’ve seen lots of dads standing outside women’s toilets waiting for their young daughters, perhaps shouting in “ Sophie remember to wash your hands”.

I’ve had dads ask me to see if their DD is ok . Once I had a dad ask me to help him because his Dd had an accident in the ladies. He asked me to let him know when all the other women had left and then I stood outside the door to let any other women coming in know that he was there.

He sorted out his DD in a couple of minutes and he was very grateful.

That’s how decent respectful men behave.

I once got caught in a downpour, stripped to my underwear in the women's room, and wrung my clothes out over the sink. I suppose I could have gone into a stall and wrung them over the toilet, and I would have if I'd had any reason to think a man might walk in. Of course, that would have mean a toilet was needlessly unavailable to others during that time. I really wouldn't have appreciated a man barging in because he thought having a female child somehow conferred honorary womanhood upon him.

I think some of the replies are over the top tbh. I'd expect a man to take his daughter to the men's toilet and expect a woman to take her son to the women's toilet.

However if I saw a man in the women's toilet it really isn't the end of the world. It's not like I ever leave the cubicle exposed so I don't see why it's such a huge huge problem in the replies

@SpinsForGin

He can always self-identify as a woman just for that instance

This isn't even funny.

Agreed, however, that it what the OP said he'd do!

What a funny joke! Not! Especially because people actually bloody do it!!!

@PurpleOkapi

No a child does NOT belong in the accessible cubicle unless there is a baby changing facility in there. Accessible toilets were hard won rights for people with disabilities. Ffs.

Is that really the expectation? They won the right to have toilets available that suit their needs. That doesn't mean no one else is ever allowed to use those toilets.

Exactly. Which is why so many places have one single accessible loo. No rule that a disabled person should have exclusive access. It’s easy to be broadly considerate, be careful not to eg race to the door ahead of a disabled person obviously heading the same way, but it’s madness to have facilities sitting unused on principle.

However if I saw a man in the women's toilet it really isn't the end of the world. It's not like I ever leave the cubicle exposed so I don't see why it's such a huge huge problem in the replies

Exactly this.

Why can’t you understand why a man can’t go into the women’s toilets, but you are uncomfortable about your daughter going into the men’s. Not sure why you’re discomfort doesn’t extend to other women using the toilets not expecting a man to be in there.

One reason for me personally is iA women that cover/wear a hijab often use the toilets to take their hijab off and readjust, they wouldn’t want a man in there just because other women don’t have a problem with it.

Just because other women ‘don’t have a problem with it’ (good for them?) doesn’t mean every woman feels the same and I guarantee most women would take issue to an adult male in the toilets, as is their right regardless of the woke brigade/right on females

The problems with men on maternity wards and the consequent invasion of women's privacy are well-documented. However, the NHS allows men because it doesn't have sufficient staff to provide safe care to postnatal women and their babies if fathers weren't allowed. Not sure what that has to do with men in women's toilets (which btw is one of the complaints mums have of men on the maternity ward...apparently, many can't be arsed to find the men's and so use the women's instead).

In most circumstances, I'd probably be OK with a man in the loos. But that is totally irrelevant. If women feel more vulnerable, due to specific circumstances, like they are going through a miscarriage or something else really personal, if they feel vulnerable due to previous experience or any other reason, or if they need access to single sex spaces for religious or cultural reasons, it doesn't matter how many women pop up and say "well I'd be fine with it". Would you now? Well, that makes it fine for everyone does it?

the woke brigade/right on females

I’m ancient and about as far from “woke” or “right on” as you can get. I simply don’t see the issue.

@Blossomtoes

the woke brigade/right on females

I’m ancient and about as far from “woke” or “right on” as you can get. I simply don’t see the issue.

Then you either haven't read enough, you have no imagination or not a lot of empathy. Just because you see it as No Big Deal, doesn't mean all women feel the same.

He’ll need to take take any child he has with him to the men’s. Once they are old enough they can use the ladies unaccompanied.

Generally there are baby change facilities in the unisex accessible loos. Lots of places near us have ‘family toilets’.

He should not use the ladies, even if accompanying a female child.

And to preemp; nor can I say that all women should feel uncomfortable with men in the loos. And I don't! But I do think the rights of women who do need access to single sex spaces need to be protected. If this means the op's oh has to do a bit more hunting for suitable places to change his dd or more campaigning to make men's loos better, then he needs to go and do that.

For years, women had to use dirty loo floors to change their babies until we got baby changes. Now they are in most public bathrooms. Op's oh needs to use that attitude of his to get this sorted so that he doesn't have to invade women's spaces.

Exactly. Which is why so many places have one single accessible loo. No rule that a disabled person should have exclusive access. It’s easy to be broadly considerate, be careful not to eg race to the door ahead of a disabled person obviously heading the same way, but it’s madness to have facilities sitting unused on principle.

Yeah, this is how I feel. If there's an empty standard stall, I'll use that before I'll use the accessible stall. But if all the others are full, I'm not waiting while the accessible stall sits empty. A disabled person can wait their turn just like everyone else has to when all the stalls are occupied. If someone has a good reason to be using that stall - which IMO includes being with a small child or needing a changing table that's stupidly located in that stall - then I think they have as much right to it as anyone else does.

@CamilleCottin

Parent and baby rooms are so much better. Seek those out op and use them.

As your your brave dh holding his own against women who don't want him listening in while they change their tampons and then shouting that he identifies as a woman . You must be awfully proud. What an absolute gentleman you have there.

Thanks for your hate comment. Yes I'm very proud of my husband and father to be. Very interesting that you answer in that way only because I have a different view.

Oh and he also buys me Tampons

Oh and he also buys me Tampons

Congrats on having a husband who's figured out how to navigate a supermarket. The fact that you hold that up as though it's a noteworthy accomplishment speaks for itself here. I, too, have such a husband. But because he's neither a pervert nor a selfish prick, he doesn't selectively identify as female because doing so makes it more convenient for him to supervise his own child.

Thanks for your hate comment. Yes I'm very proud of my husband and father to be. Very interesting that you answer in that way only because I have a different view.

It wasn't a hate comment, she was replying to your post where you said that your DH would hold his own against women if they asked him to leave a space that he's not supposed to be in.

Wow, he buys your tampons too?! Does he want a halo to go with his shiny gold medal?