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I said it would happen, it happened, now what?

309 replies

Blahblahnobodylistens · 22/10/2021 10:30

I wasn't really sure where to put this as it could cover a few areas but I'm need to ask for advice regarding 10 year old and school. This is quite lengthy as there is a bit of history which is important.

But of backstory...ds goes to a small school, each class is 2 years in one with approx 28 students per class. He is in year 5 and has had many issues with another student who is now in year 6. Last year was not an issue because they were in separate classes and all the restrictions meant they rarely crossed paths however, the year before was absolutely horrendous with tears most days due to behaviour from the other child. This behaviour included making up stories that ds had hit them and hurt them. ds was taken into the HM office on more than one occasion due to this but ds always maintained his innocence and became very upset each time. This came to an abrupt end when this child threw themselves on the floor screaming as they lined up in the playground at the start of the day, stating ds had punched her in the face. Thankfully several parents and another teacher saw what had happened and as ds was being marched to the HM office they came to his rescue and told them it was fabricated. They would also goad ds, whispering awful things to him about how he was ugly, fat (definitely not as he competes in a sport that he is regional champ in), everyone hates him etc etc and following him despite ds begging them to leave him alone and trying to walk away. That year I lost countless hours talking to his teachers, begging them to monitor the situation before he loses his shit and reacts in the way I guess she's hoping he will so he gets into serious trouble. Just to add, all of these things were always done away from the teachers, out of earshot and slyly. When this school year started, I requested a meeting with his new teacher so she was aware of the history, only because ds had huge anxiety about being back in a class with this child. She never replied, has ignored me via several channels of communication 😒

2 weeks ago this child started all old behaviours again and followed ds around the playground venting awful stuff. Ds did exactly what we have been instilling in him to do, ask her to leave him alone and go tell a teacher what is happening. He did this...and was told to stop telling tales. The 2 children ended up having a big row in the playground because they just would not leave him alone, they had a scuffle and ds got into trouble. I was so pissed off that ds had done everything we had been reinforcing him was the right thing to do yet was the one to get into trouble because he was effectively failed. I went in the next morning and had a very long chat with the TA (as the teacher wasn't available) and made it very clear that his treatment was actually very unfair when he was the one that was being goaded and was basically told to fuck off when he tried to put an end to it.

Anyway, onto yesterday...I get hauled into the classroom at the end of the day. Ds has kicked another student very hard. I was absolutely mortified and upset, I have never ever known ds to hurt anyone, but wanted to know if it was the student he's had all of the issues with..turns out it was. I asked how it had come to him losing his shit that badly and was told she wasn't sure. So I asked ds to explain and, sure enough, it was the usual story. The teacher had left the room, student makes a beeline for ds and starts mocking him because he was asking another student if she was OK as she looked upset (that's a whole other story) and apparently boys can't talk to girls as it makes them pathetic. Ds asked her to leave him alone and walked away at which point the student follows him around the class mocking him. He says that he begged the student to leave him alone and kept walking around the room to get away but they carried on and he lost his shit and kicked them.

Now I don't condone what my ds has done, far from it, but I'm pretty pissed off that it has gone this far when I have repeatedly spoken to the school warning them that there is only so much ds will take before he loses his temper unless they act on our conversations and stop the other students behaviour. And now they have labelled ds as a child who requires anger management! I actually think he's managed his anger pretty bloody well over the past 3 years despite the relentless lies and sly mocking.

So my question is, how do I move forward with this? I warned the teachers, even as recently as 2 weeks ago, that he is being pushed beyond my limits of anger coaching. I warned them that there is only so much he can take and that teachers have so far been unhelpful when he has asked for help and told them what is happening. He's done everything right so far but now he's undone all of that by kicking this student. How do I deal with this without making it look like I'm one of those parents that doesn't believe her PFB can do any wrong?? He has done wrong, he is very remorseful and even the teacher said he didn't stop apologising all day, but surely some blame should be taken off his shoulders? Yesterday they were angling all of the blame on ds and wanting to make referrals for anger management and counselling, blaming his reaction on the fact he's been upset as his grampy, my dad, died of covid in February. This has been going on since way before my dad passed and I actually resent them making attempts to blame that, rather than admitting they fucked up and misread the message I was trying to convey. But that's just me projecting I guess 😕

OP posts:
AnotherCrazyBirdLady · 22/10/2021 12:11

[quote Blahblahnobodylistens]@AnotherCrazyBirdLady the annoying thing is, I think they've already started going down that road 😕 his teacher said yesterday about anger management[/quote]
I would be asking the school what examples they can give you of your DS's 'anger' which are not connected to the other pupil - I'll bet there are none when they are not involved.

Nocutenamesleft · 22/10/2021 12:12

Like everyone said. My school was a tiny village school. I couldn’t move them. People are right. They’ve got a bad name.

Fluffycloudland77 · 22/10/2021 12:12

I’d move him too, his education could suffer because of a kid with what sounds like a very unpleasant personality.

hellgirl · 22/10/2021 12:13

Please get all correspondence in writing - you need a paper trail.

Conversations are no good - you need evidence in writing.

Good luck xx

Blahblahnobodylistens · 22/10/2021 12:15

@Nocutenamesleft

Is this a private school?
No it's a mat school (I think that's what it's called?)
OP posts:
unknownstory · 22/10/2021 12:17

Stinking complaint to governors & move schools

Carboncheque · 22/10/2021 12:19

Get a calendar and work back through every single incident you can remember. Write them down. Date them if possible and if you’re not 100% sure of the date try to place them by month or eg before Easter holiday. Get details from your DS of everything this child said - every insult, every comment. Find any written communication with the school where this child was mentioned. Try to remember every false accusation where your DS was called to the office. Detail the time that the child was witnessed throwing themselves to the ground when your DS hadn’t touched her and the response - that your DS was automatically being taken to the HM office until witnesses intervened. You need to present a factual timeline of events. Who said what, your DS’ denials, the girls following and insulting him, your repeated attempts to talk to the school. Make sure you document him reporting to an adult, as he was told to do, and being fobbed off. You can include your DS’ emotional responses to each incident as fact - DS was very upset, DS was sad, DS cried at home.

Your DS seems to have been labelled as having an ‘anger problem’ when in fact it sounds like he has been being bullied for years - the following him around, saying very hurtful things to him (include examples). Ask for the school bullying policy. Ask the head if the school think your DS needs grief counselling and is therefore emotionally vulnerable, the emotional abuse this girl subjected him to was dismissed. Ask what action was taken to stop this girl following him around and saying very hurtful things to him. Ask if the fact that the child is a girl and the bullying was verbal (and false accusations) has influenced their handling of an older student repeatedly targeting a younger one over a prolonged period of time. Ask why, if the child was seen faking being hit by several impartial witnesses, the previous accusations against your DS are being treated as fact. Ask what measures have been taken to keep this older child who has been bullying your DS away from him. Ask why, if the school believe these accusations against your DS, measures weren’t taken to keep your DS away from this child. Ask why your repeated reports seem to have resulted in no action. Ask why, when your DS did as he was told and reported her bullying to an adult, he was dismissed. Ask what measures the school are going to take to protect your DS from this child’s bullying.

Nanny0gg · 22/10/2021 12:19

@Hen2018

Why hasn’t your son changed schools?
Because, maybe there is no other school. Or, why the hell should he?

When oh when, will the perpetrators be properly dealt with?

Am I bitter - oh yes. One of my DGC is going through this (again) as their bullies have found them again at secondary. And yes, moving schools gave a few years of respite. But here we are again Sad

ditalini · 22/10/2021 12:20

This is horrendous op and really, really poor of the school.

And yes, the easiest thing is to move your ds but that's just another punishment (he will see it as a punishment to have to start from scratch with friendship groups at that stage of primary) for him to take for something that isn't his fault.

The school are also massively failing the girl who clearly has something going on to persist with this sort of behaviour.

Quite frankly, the time they caught her in the blatent lie in the playground should have had her card well and truly marked when it came to accusations against your ds.

Lazy, lazy behaviour by the school and complete failure in their duty of care to both children but so common when it comes to "hidden" bullying (which is rarely hidden at all if you put in the least effort).

SirVixofVixHall · 22/10/2021 12:20

I am confused as you use both “her” and “they” but it seems it is only one child ? Or is it two children ?

AuntyMabelandPippin · 22/10/2021 12:22

You know, now that he's snapped, she might leave him alone. I really hope so.

As PP have said, ask for the bullying policy, and write everything down, every single time she approaches him, every time she goads him. I'm hope you get some answers.

Practicebeingpatient · 22/10/2021 12:22

@Hen2018

Why hasn’t your son changed schools?
The OP says in the OP that this is a small school with just 28 students in a combined Y5/Y6 class so we know it's a school in an area with not many children so almost certainly rural. She also says it's a 6 mile journey to school so I think we deduce that any other school will be even further away. How far is she supposed to travel to keep her son away from this child?

And even if there was a better school next door, should her son really have to leave his school and friends to escape the little girl? Surely it would make more sense for the school to tell her to leave him alone?

HSHorror · 22/10/2021 12:24

I think this verbal bullying happens a lot at primary.
My dc was in reception and kid would say 'you arent coming to my party' or i dont play with girls. But obviously if kids reacted to that they were in trouble but nothing told to child to stop them saying stuff. As time has gone on the kids are now all very verbally nasty 'teasing' to each other.

Op i would make school focus on that he was doing fine last year. So maybe they need to focus on keeping the kids apart.
It doesn't really make sense though that the mum seems to think it's your dc if the school told you she has issues/problems

Viviennemary · 22/10/2021 12:25

I would consider moving schools whdn you have exhausted all other options. I agree with asking for their anti bullying policy znd shat they are doing to stop the bullying of your DS by this other child. What this child is doing is a form of bullying getting your DS into troublr and making up tales. Each time this child approaches your Ds or makes up a tale you want it recorded.

Notaroadrunner · 22/10/2021 12:25

@Blahblahnobodylistens don't consent to anything until you have spoken to the head. Tell the teacher you are awaiting a call from HM and you will get back to them re counselling. Fuck that trying to blame your Ds because of his bereavement. The teacher probably wants you to agree so they can tell the brats parents that they are dealing with your Ds. I'd be fuming. Channel your anger now and even if you don't get a call today, use the break to document all calls, emails etc that you recall making to the school about this issue. Then you will have it ready for when you speak to the HM.

Lorw · 22/10/2021 12:30

Oh OP 🙁 as someone who was bullied horrifically her whole school life I feel so sorry for your son, it impacted me so much I was suicidal at your sons age and even now as an adult it still does.

You need to go higher up and kick up a right fuss and don’t back down till something is done about this child, go to ofstead if you have to. You sound like a great mum.

Couldhavebeenme3 · 22/10/2021 12:30

I was told that this behaviour from the other child is not aimed at ds and there are ongoing issues towards other children,and is on their radar.

This sticks out for me op. Whilst they won't be able to give you any details about the other child, they should absolutely be able to tell you what steps are in place to protect the other children. They have admitted, albeit in a roundabout way, that they are aware that she is a risk to others, however they are failing to protect the rest of the class from her behaviours. You have told them repeatedly that your son is being targeted, but so far they have discounted/excluded him from the list of 'other children' they are concerned she IS targeting.

The school have a duty of care for all of the children, you need to ensure that they have admitted there are safeguarding concerns, and despite repeated contact from you, they are failing to safeguard your son.

If this isn't dealt with effectively now, it will absolutely escalate in secondary school.

RandomMess · 22/10/2021 12:31

Keep everything in writing from now on, makes notes in all meetings and type them up and email to school.

Ask the school for the evidence on DS anger or poor behaviour towards other pupils at any time since he was at the school.

Ask why the other pupil has been allowed to regularly and continually harass him even after it was witnessed that she has fabricated incidences.

When you are told she has issues - "That's not my concern, my child has been targeted repeatedly and you have failed in your duty of care towards him"

Nocutenamesleft · 22/10/2021 12:33

@Blahblahnobodylistens

In that case. If it’s not a private school. Write every single thing in a letter. Every time it happens. Even tiny things. Send it to the school every time. Even if it’s daily.

Because if it’s written down. OFSTED HAVE TO LEGALLY dispute it and the school have to show that they’ve dealt with the problem

If it’s not in writing they DONT have to do this

So write everything!

Summersnake · 22/10/2021 12:35

You should of moved him schools when he had all the problems in year 3.
Clearly the school is crap with dealing with these issues
Now where ever you move him to ,he’s labelled as a naughty boy with anger issues .
As parent you need to know when to give up and move on ..you are not going to get the desired result you want from this school.
She’s in year 6 ,so she leaves the school next September
Can he cope till then
I’d say no he cant ,he will turn in to the child they are making him out to be ,because you have not moved him out of a shit situation.
We can all only take so much
And your son reached his limit in year 3
I fail to understand why you left him in such a situation

Blahblahnobodylistens · 22/10/2021 12:38

@SirVixofVixHall

I am confused as you use both “her” and “they” but it seems it is only one child ? Or is it two children ?
In my op I was trying very hard not to include the gender of the other child however I slipped up a couple of times and there is still, a million years into this website, no option to edit your posts!
OP posts:
Chuckinitdown · 22/10/2021 12:39

@Carboncheque

Get a calendar and work back through every single incident you can remember. Write them down. Date them if possible and if you’re not 100% sure of the date try to place them by month or eg before Easter holiday. Get details from your DS of everything this child said - every insult, every comment. Find any written communication with the school where this child was mentioned. Try to remember every false accusation where your DS was called to the office. Detail the time that the child was witnessed throwing themselves to the ground when your DS hadn’t touched her and the response - that your DS was automatically being taken to the HM office until witnesses intervened. You need to present a factual timeline of events. Who said what, your DS’ denials, the girls following and insulting him, your repeated attempts to talk to the school. Make sure you document him reporting to an adult, as he was told to do, and being fobbed off. You can include your DS’ emotional responses to each incident as fact - DS was very upset, DS was sad, DS cried at home.

Your DS seems to have been labelled as having an ‘anger problem’ when in fact it sounds like he has been being bullied for years - the following him around, saying very hurtful things to him (include examples). Ask for the school bullying policy. Ask the head if the school think your DS needs grief counselling and is therefore emotionally vulnerable, the emotional abuse this girl subjected him to was dismissed. Ask what action was taken to stop this girl following him around and saying very hurtful things to him. Ask if the fact that the child is a girl and the bullying was verbal (and false accusations) has influenced their handling of an older student repeatedly targeting a younger one over a prolonged period of time. Ask why, if the child was seen faking being hit by several impartial witnesses, the previous accusations against your DS are being treated as fact. Ask what measures have been taken to keep this older child who has been bullying your DS away from him. Ask why, if the school believe these accusations against your DS, measures weren’t taken to keep your DS away from this child. Ask why your repeated reports seem to have resulted in no action. Ask why, when your DS did as he was told and reported her bullying to an adult, he was dismissed. Ask what measures the school are going to take to protect your DS from this child’s bullying.

Shocking. Everything this poster says. You need it in writing, a formal complaint. I think the school ought to have their Complaiints Policy on the website. Go nuclear but do it following procedures.
Blahblahnobodylistens · 22/10/2021 12:44

@Summersnake

You should of moved him schools when he had all the problems in year 3. Clearly the school is crap with dealing with these issues Now where ever you move him to ,he’s labelled as a naughty boy with anger issues . As parent you need to know when to give up and move on ..you are not going to get the desired result you want from this school. She’s in year 6 ,so she leaves the school next September Can he cope till then I’d say no he cant ,he will turn in to the child they are making him out to be ,because you have not moved him out of a shit situation. We can all only take so much And your son reached his limit in year 3 I fail to understand why you left him in such a situation
Because I believed, perhaps naively, that I had raised concerns enough times that this wouldn't happen. I still don't understand why it is ds who should suffer and be made to move away from everyone he knows because he has been targeted? Is that not victim blaming? And they can continue their behaviour so the next child has to leave? And the next? Where would it end? I have not "left him in this situation this long", I have been contacting the school, I have not ignored it.
OP posts:
spudjulia · 22/10/2021 12:48

Are you saying the class were left unsupervised? There was no member of staff supervising at all? That in itself is unacceptable.

As amazing as TAs are in general, this is not the person you need to be talking to at this stage. The policies on anti-bullying and complaints procedure should be on the school website (by law iirc) and you need to download them now, read them, and highlight anything relevant where the school are not delivering what they promise. Other documents might be useful, have a look through so you can arm yourself.

The complaints policy will likely say something about trying to address concerns informally first, and I would write a letter/email to the headteacher to explain that you have tried to address your concerns with them informally (and note each time you did this, including unanswered emails to teacher, discussions with teacher and TA, any time you've been in contact with school about this), and that this will be your last attempt to address your concerns informally, before you raise a formal complaint as per their complaints policy.

You need to be very specific about what your complaint/concern is and it may help if you have an idea of specific things that the school could do to address them. Itemise them. For example - 1) that your child is being left unsupervised during teaching time and at lunchtimes long enough for a situation between 2 children with history to escalate to physical attack. 2) that when your child follows the correct procedure to tell a teacher, he is being ignored. 3) your child is being taunted and name-called repeatedly by a child and there appears to be no action from school to prevent this. And ask for each point to be addressed.

Some solutions you might offer

  1. your child is never left unsupervised by a member of staff with this other child,
  2. a named member of staff who your child can go to, who knows this 3 year history, to tell about any future incidents immediately, and this named person will be listening and able to act. Etc

Its unacceptable that at this point, even after suggesting it's an anger management issue, your child is being left unsupervised - regardless of whether it's true or not.

Carboncheque · 22/10/2021 12:48

Also, I would be really proud of your DS for staying calm for as long as he has. Words can hurt as much if not more than physical blows and the school left him with no protection from this child. He even tried to tell an adult as requested. He has been pushed and pushed until he snapped.

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