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I said it would happen, it happened, now what?

309 replies

Blahblahnobodylistens · 22/10/2021 10:30

I wasn't really sure where to put this as it could cover a few areas but I'm need to ask for advice regarding 10 year old and school. This is quite lengthy as there is a bit of history which is important.

But of backstory...ds goes to a small school, each class is 2 years in one with approx 28 students per class. He is in year 5 and has had many issues with another student who is now in year 6. Last year was not an issue because they were in separate classes and all the restrictions meant they rarely crossed paths however, the year before was absolutely horrendous with tears most days due to behaviour from the other child. This behaviour included making up stories that ds had hit them and hurt them. ds was taken into the HM office on more than one occasion due to this but ds always maintained his innocence and became very upset each time. This came to an abrupt end when this child threw themselves on the floor screaming as they lined up in the playground at the start of the day, stating ds had punched her in the face. Thankfully several parents and another teacher saw what had happened and as ds was being marched to the HM office they came to his rescue and told them it was fabricated. They would also goad ds, whispering awful things to him about how he was ugly, fat (definitely not as he competes in a sport that he is regional champ in), everyone hates him etc etc and following him despite ds begging them to leave him alone and trying to walk away. That year I lost countless hours talking to his teachers, begging them to monitor the situation before he loses his shit and reacts in the way I guess she's hoping he will so he gets into serious trouble. Just to add, all of these things were always done away from the teachers, out of earshot and slyly. When this school year started, I requested a meeting with his new teacher so she was aware of the history, only because ds had huge anxiety about being back in a class with this child. She never replied, has ignored me via several channels of communication 😒

2 weeks ago this child started all old behaviours again and followed ds around the playground venting awful stuff. Ds did exactly what we have been instilling in him to do, ask her to leave him alone and go tell a teacher what is happening. He did this...and was told to stop telling tales. The 2 children ended up having a big row in the playground because they just would not leave him alone, they had a scuffle and ds got into trouble. I was so pissed off that ds had done everything we had been reinforcing him was the right thing to do yet was the one to get into trouble because he was effectively failed. I went in the next morning and had a very long chat with the TA (as the teacher wasn't available) and made it very clear that his treatment was actually very unfair when he was the one that was being goaded and was basically told to fuck off when he tried to put an end to it.

Anyway, onto yesterday...I get hauled into the classroom at the end of the day. Ds has kicked another student very hard. I was absolutely mortified and upset, I have never ever known ds to hurt anyone, but wanted to know if it was the student he's had all of the issues with..turns out it was. I asked how it had come to him losing his shit that badly and was told she wasn't sure. So I asked ds to explain and, sure enough, it was the usual story. The teacher had left the room, student makes a beeline for ds and starts mocking him because he was asking another student if she was OK as she looked upset (that's a whole other story) and apparently boys can't talk to girls as it makes them pathetic. Ds asked her to leave him alone and walked away at which point the student follows him around the class mocking him. He says that he begged the student to leave him alone and kept walking around the room to get away but they carried on and he lost his shit and kicked them.

Now I don't condone what my ds has done, far from it, but I'm pretty pissed off that it has gone this far when I have repeatedly spoken to the school warning them that there is only so much ds will take before he loses his temper unless they act on our conversations and stop the other students behaviour. And now they have labelled ds as a child who requires anger management! I actually think he's managed his anger pretty bloody well over the past 3 years despite the relentless lies and sly mocking.

So my question is, how do I move forward with this? I warned the teachers, even as recently as 2 weeks ago, that he is being pushed beyond my limits of anger coaching. I warned them that there is only so much he can take and that teachers have so far been unhelpful when he has asked for help and told them what is happening. He's done everything right so far but now he's undone all of that by kicking this student. How do I deal with this without making it look like I'm one of those parents that doesn't believe her PFB can do any wrong?? He has done wrong, he is very remorseful and even the teacher said he didn't stop apologising all day, but surely some blame should be taken off his shoulders? Yesterday they were angling all of the blame on ds and wanting to make referrals for anger management and counselling, blaming his reaction on the fact he's been upset as his grampy, my dad, died of covid in February. This has been going on since way before my dad passed and I actually resent them making attempts to blame that, rather than admitting they fucked up and misread the message I was trying to convey. But that's just me projecting I guess 😕

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Thecurtainsofdestiny · 22/10/2021 11:13

We had this, although DS was older. He was goaded and goaded by a group of boys. There was a reluctance from the school to deal with it and blame was put on him eg they'd take his chair away as he was sitting down, he'd get into trouble for creating a disturbance by falling.

We documented everything. In detail. Recorded every event, made sure the school knew about it. Eventually the school suggested our DS move class. I refused - it should be the bully who moves!

The school arranged mediation with our DS and the main instigator. The boy's parents kept him off school that day. After a lot of communication from us it did stop.

We accepted the offer of counselling though and it did help in the sense that DS realised it was not his fault.

CiderJolly · 22/10/2021 11:19

If this has been going on for 3 years and showing no signs of stopping, I would be going straight to the girl’s parents. I don’t care if that’s against school advice.

Babyghirl · 22/10/2021 11:21

@Blahblahnobodylistens
Don't beat yourself up about this, you never let it get this far the school did, you done your best to bring it to the attention of the school and they never listened to you.

If it was your son doing it to the girl prop alot more would of been done to resolve it.

Your son has had this for 3 years how did you expect him to react, my moto is if you can dish it you can take it. Take out the fact she was a girl and he was a boy he was pushed to his limits god love him and had enough of the bullying so was standing up for himself.

I can't stand bully's and I'm sorry but if the school was doing nothing to protect your son he had to protect himself and rightly so. A bully should be served with there own dish or they will never back off.

I'm surprised your son never broke before now, so he held his cool for 3 whole years before breaking that you need to be proud of, but please don't punish him for doing something the school failed to do and that was to protect himself.

Blahblahnobodylistens · 22/10/2021 11:26

The more I reflect on the conversation yesterday, the more annoyed I'm becoming. I overheard the child's mum talking to the teacher as we were waiting for them to come out of class, she said "I know he has issues" (obviously I didn't know they were talking about ds at the time and that was pretty much the only full sentence I heard as they were talking quietly and I don't make a habit of listening to private conversations). What are these "issues"? And who the hell has told her my ds has "issues"? Ugh I'm getting so cross, yesterday I just rolled over and was very apogetic and accepted what was said but today I realise that, actually, this isn't all ds fault.

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NellyDElephant · 22/10/2021 11:28

Ofsted take a very dim view of schools who do nothing about ongoing systematic bullying - fyi!
When is the next inspection?

Make sure your written complaint is accurate, detailed and factual - addressing everything that has happened thus far, and every time you have been ‘ignored’ by school staff, and get this to the Chair of Governors asap.

Blahblahnobodylistens · 22/10/2021 11:31

@Babyghirl I haven't punished him. We had the most indepth talk on the way home yesterday (we have a 6 mile journey to school so get time) and he knows he did wrong by kicking her. The fact is, he has never hurt anyone before, so I know he was pushed to his limits and beyond. It's only really 2 years because last year they weren't in the same class and the school bubble system meant they never really crossed paths

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DahliaMacNamara · 22/10/2021 11:31

While you're waiting for the head to get back to you, the school should at the very least publish its behaviour policy and complaints procedure on their website. These are both statutory, and the behaviour policy may include a link to the anti-bullying policy. Read up on those to see what you should be able to expect from the school, and quote it back at them if necessary.

deplorabelle · 22/10/2021 11:33

As others have said, document as much as you can, put a complaint in and look for another school. If you can possibly have your DS at home, take him out with stress to give him a break from the environment. If the head says it's unauthorised absence so much the better.

I was a governor and this still happened to my child Final straw was when DS got blamed for having his head smashed against a library bookcase because apparently "he did say something very sarcastic" (according to the teacher who was not there and had clearly believed the other child's account despite my child being the only one injured).

I had to resign as a governor because I couldn't change anything or do a good job sitting in meetings thinking they are all cunts for upholding the bullying of my child.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 22/10/2021 11:36

This other student only started 3 years ago and immediately started this shit ... I was told that this behaviour from the other child is not aimed at ds and there are ongoing issues towards other children,and is on their radar

Do you happen to know if the child was transferred from another school, where there'd also been problems?

Because this sounds to me like a pupil with severe issues which they're trying to manage "so they can keep them in school", and where that happens it's sometimes the case that nobody else gets a look-in because they're too busy chasing the target of inclusion - and also because the office would rather it be someone else's problem than put proper provision in place

FreshFancyFrogglette · 22/10/2021 11:36

What would be helpful is a meeting with all of you, together. Rather than you hearing ds's version, and siding with him, and the other dc's parent hearing her version, and siding with her.. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle, and a well chaired meeting between the 4 of you, with teachers present, would soon highlight what's actually going on here.
You are right that it's not OK, or normal, but something is a bit off with your dc's account, as it doesn't really make sense. why she would go after him, unless there is some family history or something? Sounds messy. Surprised the school aren't more eager to get it sorted, as it's really disruptive for everyone. Could understand if this was a 4 form entry primary, but it sounds like a small school, why are they too busy to respond all the time :s

Blahblahnobodylistens · 22/10/2021 11:36

Thank you @DahliaMacNamara I'll look on the website in a minute. I'm not really expecting him to get back to me today as he's teaching in the class that has had 3 confirmed positives by PCR and 3 positive lateral flows this week (this is the first time any covid has hit the school since it started so they've not done too bad) so isn't allowed into the main school (it's an old victorian school with some classrooms separated from the main building) so doubt I'd get anything until after half term

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Blahblahnobodylistens · 22/10/2021 11:38

And I've literally just been messaged by his teacher asking permission to make a referral for grief counselling. I don't think that's a bad idea so will consent, but I don't want his grief being cited as the reason that he should be blamed for this when it's been flagged so many times before my dad passed.

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LaBobkin · 22/10/2021 11:41

My DS has faced similar problems with another child in his class this year. I agree with PP - have a good read of the school's bullying and safeguarding policies, and provide examples of variance from this. Keep insisting, and make yourself a nuisance - we have only got some (very limited) response after this. And yes, escalate if needed.

All that being said, it seems to be the policy in primary to dismiss bulling as 'friendship issues' or 2 kids who don't get along. The early conversations I had with our school were very much focussed on how to teach my DS to be resilient / positive rather than concrete steps on how they were going to address the bullying. I agreed that this was important, but some of the suggestions were laughable (e.g. if DS told him the bully had said he was a fat pig, I should ask DS if he had a nice dinner). So do ensure that it's being talked about / logged as bullying.

Blahblahnobodylistens · 22/10/2021 11:43

@FreshFancyFrogglette

What would be helpful is a meeting with all of you, together. Rather than you hearing ds's version, and siding with him, and the other dc's parent hearing her version, and siding with her.. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle, and a well chaired meeting between the 4 of you, with teachers present, would soon highlight what's actually going on here. You are right that it's not OK, or normal, but something is a bit off with your dc's account, as it doesn't really make sense. why she would go after him, unless there is some family history or something? Sounds messy. Surprised the school aren't more eager to get it sorted, as it's really disruptive for everyone. Could understand if this was a 4 form entry primary, but it sounds like a small school, why are they too busy to respond all the time :s
I have absolutely no reason to disbelieve ds and his account of things never waivers no matter when he tells it, or how much time has passed since the incident. Both his teachers and TA's from both classes have said that ds is always truthful, yesterday the teacher was not in the class when the incident happened and he went straight to her and immediately told her what he had done before she even noticed the student was crying.
OP posts:
Blahblahnobodylistens · 22/10/2021 11:47

@Puzzledandpissedoff

This other student only started 3 years ago and immediately started this shit ... I was told that this behaviour from the other child is not aimed at ds and there are ongoing issues towards other children,and is on their radar

Do you happen to know if the child was transferred from another school, where there'd also been problems?

Because this sounds to me like a pupil with severe issues which they're trying to manage "so they can keep them in school", and where that happens it's sometimes the case that nobody else gets a look-in because they're too busy chasing the target of inclusion - and also because the office would rather it be someone else's problem than put proper provision in place

I don't know the history of the family in all honesty. A private rental was advertised near to the school , they moved in and that's all I know. I don't know where they moved from or anything, I tend to keep myself to myself or talk to people I have known for many years so haven't asked.
OP posts:
berlinbabylon · 22/10/2021 11:51

@CiderJolly

If this has been going on for 3 years and showing no signs of stopping, I would be going straight to the girl’s parents. I don’t care if that’s against school advice.
And how do you think that would help? The parents are not in school, the school staff are. It's up to the school staff to sort out.
mumsiedarlingrevolta · 22/10/2021 11:54

@Blahblahnobodylistens
Please be careful the grief counselling is not somehow going to be used to imply your DS has anger problems and place the blame for all of this on him!!!!
I'd be very wary of "school" grief counselling especially as you over heard the other mother saying she know he has issues so there may be some lapses in confidentiality.
If he needs any help I would completely separate it from the school-I know you want to look cooperative but my spidey senses are up on this one!!
Suddenly helpful after ignoring you for several years...

CSJobseeker · 22/10/2021 12:00

@Blahblahnobodylistens

I do get that *@Hen2018* but, in my mind, it almost feels that that would punish my ds. He hasn't done anything wrong (well, apart from yesterday) yet he's the one that has to move? How is that fair?
Sadly life isn't fair. it would be great if it was, but that's not the world we live in.

I would also move him if possible. This has the potential for a massive impact on his mental health, and I'd want to minimise that.

I'd also raise complaints and make sure the governors know exactly why you're moving, but you can't wait around for due process when your child is being affected like this.

Blahblahnobodylistens · 22/10/2021 12:00

@mumsiedarlingrevolta I wholeheartedly agree. I think I mentioned earlier that the more I think about his teacher blaming the death of my dad as part of the reason ds lost his shit, the more annoyed I'm getting because that to me says that they blame him completely for things coming to this.

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AnotherCrazyBirdLady · 22/10/2021 12:02

[quote mumsiedarlingrevolta]@Blahblahnobodylistens
Please be careful the grief counselling is not somehow going to be used to imply your DS has anger problems and place the blame for all of this on him!!!!
I'd be very wary of "school" grief counselling especially as you over heard the other mother saying she know he has issues so there may be some lapses in confidentiality.
If he needs any help I would completely separate it from the school-I know you want to look cooperative but my spidey senses are up on this one!!
Suddenly helpful after ignoring you for several years...[/quote]
Yes, this.
We had similar with our DS, and the school were very quick to lay the blame on 'outside' events, whilst completely ignoring the glaringly obvious bullying that was going on.

jollygreenpea · 22/10/2021 12:04

@Sportsnight

It sounds horrendous, and your son needs support from the school, and they need to take this bullying behaviour from the other pupil very seriously and deal with it. But, unfortunately it does sound like your son’s temper is also a problem, and you will need to deal with that too. Violence in response to goading is not an appropriate response, and he needs to learn to walk away from provocation. He/ she pushed me to it will not be a defence if he carries that behaviour into adulthood. If the school aren’t supporting him at all in this, both with preventing the bullying and handling his reactiveness, moving might be your only option.
He has had to put up with this for 3 years, how long could anyone last before they got to breaking point.

He has repeatedly walked away for 3 years with no let up

I don't think he has a temper at all, he's shown a lot more restraint than I would have.

Op don't let the school get a way with this, it's their fault it got to this point get every level of education involved, head teacher, governors, council, ofsted

Blahblahnobodylistens · 22/10/2021 12:05

@AnotherCrazyBirdLady the annoying thing is, I think they've already started going down that road 😕 his teacher said yesterday about anger management

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Nocutenamesleft · 22/10/2021 12:10

Oh man

We had a similar story. Very similar

My child was bullied from reception year. Up till tear 3 By the same person. I spent hours. Hours and hours and weeks and months and eventually years.

I went back end forth. Nothing was done to my standard. My child became so inverted. So anxious. Self hating. The stress was unreal

One day I decided. Enough was enough. That was it and I wasn’t going to put up with it any longer.

I took both my children out of school and started to hone educate and it’s been the best thing I’ve ever done in my entire life

Both of my children are now happy. Outgoing. Confident children. Their learning came on so much.

I would recommend that anyone take the leap. It’s such a privilege to teach your child.

Nocutenamesleft · 22/10/2021 12:11

Is this a private school?