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I want to kick DS out TODAY? Totally devastated by what he’s been saying about us.

580 replies

FeelingUtterlyBetrayed · 12/08/2021 16:01

Sorry this is really long but I feel so betrayed and devastated and furious!

This lunchtime as I was sitting on the sofa I noticed a phone on the other arm of it, assumed it was DH’s as he’s off today but noticed the screen was open on what looked like a long message rather than being black and locked. I thought was odd so picked it up out of curiosity.

It was actually DS’s (19) phone, they both have Samsung phones. His phone obviously had been set not to time out.

He had been in a convo with his best friend about moving out, as he’s going to University in September, which apparently he’s desperate to do as we are very abusive to him and exploiting him for money (this was his friend saying this!).

His friend was advising him that he should contact the Uni to ask what help there is for students estranged from abusive parents and said ‘they even hit you man, that’s a crime, you could call the police on them’.

We also never support him and make him feel like shit about himself apparently.

We had have major issues with DS for many years due to extreme laziness and screen addiction. He is also very arrogant and argumentative, knows everything and is always right and other the last few years has become very aggressive and shouty when asked to do anything/called out on his behaviour, even with his younger brother.

We used to get constant calls from school about him not doing homework (even about falling asleep in class) and during his GCSE’s about him not completing coursework. He did much worse than expected but managed to get enough to do his A levels which he wanted to do. I actually tried to dissuade him from doing them as I knew it would be a nightmare to keep him focused after the stress of his GCSE’s but he insisted he wanted to do them and promised he would work hard.

We found out mid way through the course that he was flunking them and his tutor didn’t think it worth him continuing as he was constantly on his phone in class and not doing the work. So a whole year wasted.

Then he decided he wanted to do a BTEC about something he was passionate about so we supported him in that but again I constantly had to get him up in the morning, he was slow to finish his work and wasn’t handing stuff in on time. I had calls just before he was due to finish with concerns he was forecast for a Pass when he needed a Merit to get into Uni and that he hadn’t bothered to attend his English GCSE resit as he’d overslept! Lots of stress at home about this and constantly being on his back about doing the work. Still there were many times he didn’t even bother to go in and I’m amazed he got the Merit!

He also lost his part time job, which was a condition of him doing his BTEC for us as there was extra course fees and materials needed and I told him he had to pay them himself as it was his choice to do the course and be at college for an extra year. He lost that job within 6 months as he couldn’t get up to go to it and wasted all the cash on online gaming anyway!

When I say couldn’t get up, this was an evening job so he started at around 6pm! As he’d be up all night gaming, he’d stumble into college and then go to bed as soon as he got home in the afternoon! On weekends he’d stay up all night and sleep all day. I’d have to go to get up him and drive him there but gave up in the end as he was just taking the piss!

He hasn’t been able to get another job since last March despite me telling him from last year that if he wanted to go to Uni, he needed to get a part time job to save for the accommodation as we have no spare cash to subsidise him (and I didn’t want to with his track record).

There have been lots of arguments and we’ve lost our tempers and struggled with him to try to confiscate his phone (which we still pay for) or get his headphones off his head as he’s woken us up during the night shouting and swearing while gaming. Many times he has woken DH up at 3/4am and DH has a job where he can’t go into work tired!

Since he finished college, he literally sleeps all day and stays up all night. I have offered to pay for gym membership for him (have paid in the past but he ended up not going), given him cash to go out with his mates, tried to get him up and encourage him to do something but he will often sneak back to bed. I’ve looked up jobs for him to apply for for the summer, driven him to interviews, had to drag him out of bed to get ready. He’s even missed interviews by being asleep.

We’ve taken the WiFi but he just plays downloaded games.

I admit DH and I have both lost our shit and poured water over him to get him up and we have had tussles. His mates have also heard us shouting at him to shut up while he’s been online gaming with them as he’s so loud and also to get off the game for dinner or to do a chore he’s been asked to do. He often leaves his dinner on the side for hours after we’ve cooked for him and the other night we got him down to eat it but he left it on the table untouched and went back to bed! We come down in the morning to dirty glasses and plates left lying about. He rarely showers or brushes his teeth. He does nothing around the house.

We are at our wits end but had no choice but to support him to go to Uni as what else is he going to do? He can’t even get a part time job in a cafe!

As he can’t afford the accommodation, he will be living at home and commuting so we have said we want half of his first maintenance loan as we have been continuously paying out for him since he lost his part time job.

I recently paid over £200 for contact lenses which he can’t be bothered to put in, despite saying he wanted them. He has also lost two bikes over the last year by not bothering to chain them up. One was his Dad’s and he had to buy a new one, so we’ve said he can pay us back for that. He also got into an accident due to not looking where he was going and we had to pay for the damage to the car so he owes us for that. I gave him £100 a few weeks ago to buy clothes. So including all the £20 here and there, it’s probably over £1000 he’s had off us which I want back from his first maintenance loan and I think is reasonable. He’ll get around £2800.

He will only have train fare to Uni to pay so will have plenty for going out but apparently we are ‘exploiting’ him for money!

We are not well off as I have had to be a SAHM due to his brother being disabled so we have really struggled financially but always made sure he had everything he needed but apparently he’s embarrassed at us as we are ‘poor’ and all his mates parents are paying for their Uni accommodation and paid for their cars etc!

We have tried so hard to support him while coping with his brother and 2 other DC whilst he has been making himself out to be a victim to his mates and behaving disgracefully at home.

I have told him to pack his stuff and ask his mate if he can crash with him and I wash my hands of him. He’s in bed asleep right now!

I just cannot believe he actually thinks we are abusive to him Angry. I can’t stop crying.

OP posts:
alltheemptyfields · 13/08/2021 17:13

too much projection...

Water on somebody's head when they refuse to get up is not "violence" or "abuse". You can try to create drama as much as you like, you just sound silly.

Next you'll tell us a noisy alarm clock is "abuse" too? Noise can in theory qualify as torture actually, but normal people are able to put things in context.

SudokuZebra · 13/08/2021 18:02

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

thedancingbear · 13/08/2021 18:18

@SudokuZebra

Tbh the water, ( unpleasant though that was), and s almost a side issue to the other controlling behaviour:
  • reading his text messages
-Telling him, at 17, he could only continue in education if he had a part time job, -demanding his student loan off of him, -"confiscating" a 19 year olds phone
Yyy. This is coercive control territory.

It doesn't matter, here, that it is mother and son. The position is different if you're dealing with a child but as soon as (s)he turns 18, the exact same moral and legal rules apply.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

HypocriteHunter · 13/08/2021 18:29

Noise can in theory qualify as torture actually, but normal people are able to put things in context.

Not just in theory.

This poor young prince has supposedly been keeping the household awake and disturbing them by shouting out at all hours.

Noise can be torture. Sleep deprivation most certainly is.

Neither side has behaved perfectly here. But he has been a participant in the household discord, not just a poor little victim.

alltheemptyfields · 13/08/2021 18:31

yes, imposing a part-time job on a 17 or 19 year old, that's abusive..Hmm

and so is confiscating the phone you are paying for...

I'd love to know how some people "parent" if they let their kids run wild without any consequences or minimum expectations.

Lavenderpillow · 13/08/2021 18:32

I suspect that if your son was happier this behaviour wouldn’t be happening. He seems to have lost all of his get up and go and doesn’t seem like a very happy person.

Throwing water over someone isn’t very nice at all.
Having a ‘tussle’ isn’t ok either.
I suspect your son is upset with his upbringing hence the behaviour.
He clearly feels wronged as he talks to his friend about his relationship with you- whether you agree with it or not.

IncessantNameChanger · 13/08/2021 18:55

@alltheemptyfields

There's a lot of projecting on this thread.

It takes some work to not only excuse the behaviour of the teen, but turn the blame around. And not one thought for the other kids who have to suffer because of their sibling behaviour, but I am sure someone will manage to blame them too! For existing maybe?

People really need to stop with the "domestic abuse" nonsense when someone tries to parent. Not only it's ridiculous, but it makes a mockery of genuine abuse.

If that man ends up living with a woman by the end of the year, at 19 it's not an outrageous concept, the comments will be very different when he repeats his behaviour with her..

I think the last paragraph about sums it up. How do we not raise these incapable men if we let them become incapable of adulting?

There has to be a balance somewhere between laying in bed doing nothing all day every day and letting them reap what they sew.

I practically found my 17 year old a part time job today. He really isnt keen on going. So the next time he wants more than just over the bear minimum to get into college, buy lunch and his gym membership should I give him a extra tenner a week or let him figure it out for himself that if he wants meals out with mates and trainers etc i wont to paying for it all past turning 18? That he cant have new trainers and meals and driving lessons and new clothes if he never earns anything?

They need to start to learn to be independent. How do they learn? That you can exist if you do sod all to help yourself but to have a reasonable quality of life you need to put effort in.

ufucoffee · 13/08/2021 19:16

At 19 you can take his phone off him if you're paying for it. If you can't get it off him cancel the contract.

Throwing water over him isn't abuse.

Reading his messages isn't abuse. You pay for the phone.

He's 19. He's an adult behaving like a 12 year old. Stop cooking for him. Stop washing his clothes. I wouldn't take his grant from him but that should be it. Get out and stand on your own feet. The family have suffered enough.

However. I would say that his excessive gaming has been enabled. How was he able to stay up so late at night. Why wasn't whatever he was playing on removed from the house. Why did he still have his phone when he kept using it in class. Good luck OP.

leonpride · 13/08/2021 19:26

*abusive? Did you bother reading the OP?

This thread seemed to have attracted some very weird teenagers

No OP, you have not been abusive, if nothing else you have been far too supportive towards someone behaving like a spoil little brat.

It's his own life and his future he is ruining. If life wasn't so easy for him, he would have to move his lazy arse a bit more.*

Ridiculous @alltheemptyfields
I don't get to pour water over my partner when he's lazy around the house. Why is an adult child different?

And a spoilt brat? He may be a pain but OP is hardly covering herself in glory. Taking your adult child's money is also not ok. If you want to charge rent or contribution fine, but you don't get to dip your fingers into his money just because.

Halfwreckedbykids · 13/08/2021 19:29

Panickingpavlova
I 1000000% agree.
There isn't a magic switch at 18 where its kick em out or be tough.
I hope I don't have to be tough at any age because I want them in my life and I love them.
Something cracked along they way and family counselling might help.
When you feel like hugging your kids the LEAST is when they need it the MOST

Kanaloa · 13/08/2021 19:31

Reading his private messages is abuse. It doesn’t matter if you pay for the phone or not. Much like if you bought him a diary it would still be very wrong to sit and read it every night.

It’s an invasion of his privacy and it’s poor behaviour. I’m astounded so many are happy to defend the op’s actions really.

ThatFlamingCandle · 13/08/2021 19:35

@alltheemptyfields

All the ones claiming "abuse"...

Nothing stops a young man to move out, get a job and find some flat share. At 19, you don't need your parents, you don't need to have someone paying for your video games and you lazying around all day.

At 19, you earn enough to live alone. He's not 15 or 16...

Respectfully, you have no idea if that's the case. The only way I could leave home and subsequently become estranged from my family was with my maintenance loan (not able to work and study at once).

It's hard to live by yourself depending on where you are. Lots of people have help from family. He is a nightmare, fine, but OP's behaviour isn't pleasant either- bearing in mind we're hearing a softer version of events from OP.

SudokuZebra · 13/08/2021 19:43

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Iusedtobecarmen · 13/08/2021 20:08

FFS all morons comparing a teenage sons relationship with his mother the same as that as OP and partner.
'You wouldn't look at partners phone'
'You wouldn't chuck water on partner
No cos presumably they don't treat you like shit that's why
Yeah let's give the poor kid some more hugs whilst hes running the joint.

alltheemptyfields · 13/08/2021 20:22

thinking about it, if we had a flight booked for the holiday of a life time, and DH couldn't be arsed to get up, I would consider pouring a glass of water on his head Grin

Guess I am abusive 🤷

Plumtree391 · 13/08/2021 20:24

It's not a question of giving the op's son more hugs but it really does sound as though he is clinically depressed. I hate giving labels but what she describes are typical symptoms.

He is nineteen, it isn't right to read his messages or 'discipline' him and as for him moving out, which it sounds as though he intends to do if he can, it takes money to do that.

I do sympathise with the op, I am the mother too. I hope she and her husband find a peaceful way of dealing with their son's problems and behaviour but they really should not be pouring water on him to get him out of bed.

Perhaps just live their lives and let him live his, saying,"Hi", if they meet in the kitchen but letting him get on with it for now, may be the best remedy.

Anon778833 · 13/08/2021 20:27

If you went up to a stranger and poured water over them, what would you expect to happen? It’s a very aggressive thing to do.

Sheesh the level of emotional intelligence on MN is at an all time low.

It’s not ok to be an aggressive bully just because your child, adult or otherwise is not behaving the way you want them to. Or indeed the way they should.

alltheemptyfields · 13/08/2021 20:31

Is it just me, or this thread feels like it's full of sulky and immature teenagers bitterly defending their right to behave appallingly without any consequences, and still offended when their parents act like .. parents.

It's always telling when insults start flying around.

Kanaloa · 13/08/2021 20:52

@alltheemptyfields

It’s just you.

buzzy06 · 13/08/2021 20:53

@Iusedtobecarmen

FFS all morons comparing a teenage sons relationship with his mother the same as that as OP and partner. 'You wouldn't look at partners phone' 'You wouldn't chuck water on partner No cos presumably they don't treat you like shit that's why Yeah let's give the poor kid some more hugs whilst hes running the joint.

If your partner trust you like shit it's ok to be abusive and controlling back, yeah?
Genuinely, what's the difference? Anyone can justify being nasty by saying they deserved it.

No wonder he's miserable and depressed living with OP. If somebody chucked water on you, read your phone and demanded money would you be happy and willing to do what they tel you? He's difficult, don't blame him.

Also, you're very naive if you believe what OP is saying. She's obviously not going to admit to everything. This is only her side of the story.

alltheemptyfields · 13/08/2021 20:56

[quote Kanaloa]@alltheemptyfields

It’s just you.[/quote]
actually, if you read the thread, it's not. But you knew that Smile

Anon778833 · 13/08/2021 20:58

@alltheemptyfields

Is it just me, or this thread feels like it's full of sulky and immature teenagers bitterly defending their right to behave appallingly without any consequences, and still offended when their parents act like .. parents.

It's always telling when insults start flying around.

Look, the kid is 19 and it rather looks as if he hasn't been given the right consequences. And maybe the parents have fallen into a toxic way of dealing with things.

I think I'm allowed this opinion since I have teenagers and they most certainly haven't turned out this way. And I wouldn't dream of hitting them under any circumstances.

blubbebubba · 13/08/2021 21:00

@alltheemptyfields

Is it just me, or this thread feels like it's full of sulky and immature teenagers bitterly defending their right to behave appallingly without any consequences, and still offended when their parents act like .. parents.

It's always telling when insults start flying around.

Is it me or is this thread full of unhinged parents trying to justify their behaviour towards their adult kids, that they'd scream assault/abuse at if somebody did it to them?
Panickingpavlova · 13/08/2021 21:02

I'd say it's full of people trying to get the op to read the behaviour her son is showing and trying to get her to understand what it's saying.
This may save someone's life, save her relationships with him and have a good long lasting outcome.

Then we have the people who knee jerk at his behaviour and want to pour petrol on the situation, showing little understanding of the son at all and this will lead to a poor outcome and probably a bad long term out come.

alltheemptyfields · 13/08/2021 21:05

blubbebubba

when you willingly confuse parenting with "abuse" and "assault", there's absolutely not point discussing with you.

I have read on some other thread that it starts from birth: changing a nappy without asking permission from the baby first was "assault" (you honestly cannot make that one up)
and saying "no" to a child was abusive and would damage them for life.

Honestly, there's no discussion possible with some people.