Rubbish holiday

[LorelaiVictoriaGilmore]

I don’t know why I am posting really - just stuck in bed and feeling so miserable. Dh and I were worked so hard last year and our relationship has really suffered through the pandemic. I booked three weeks in the UK with our two children just so we could be somewhere else and reset a bit. And it’s awful. During the first week, I had some work stuff to wrap up and DH had to job interviews. Kids decided about a week into the holiday to start going to sleep at 10pm. We are now at the end of week two. Dh and I are exhausted. I have a stomach bug or food poisoning and I am stuck in bed. Dh got rejected from one job but the other one really wants him - he just had to get through a psychometric test. He tried to do it this evening while I was sick in bed. Naturally the kids played up and he got locked out of the test. He is now stomping around and shouting. The toddler is in bed with me. I would just go home (dh wants to) but it’s ds’s birthday on Wednesday and everything is organised here not at home - so we really can’t. I can’t believe the holiday has gone so wrong. We’ve had some nice-ish times but we are both so tired and have to go back to 50-60 hour working weeks. I feel like it might break us. 😢

Holidays with small kids are a lot of work - and no break with nursery or a nanny etc. And when things go wrong like the get ill it's really disappointing because you still look forward to holidays like you did pre-kids!

Can you and your DH take 'holiday' when the children are at school / in childcare? That's what me and my partner do - just enjoy the day, go for lunch / watch a film / go to a gallery. Seriously even being in the house feels great when not supervising a toddler and a baby!

Also i think it's great you love your job but I couldn't handle the stress of it. Even though you say you've only done approx maybe 2 hours work I guarantee you are still checking emails / following transactions etc. It's just too hard to switch off! And then if you do manage it for a couple of days the anxiety creeps back that you've missed an important email...

I think you should do a couple only night/ weekend away and have your nanny watch the kids. Or have them at your parents with your nanny helping out.
I wouldn’t give up your job, not many people actually like their job but you do.
Hang in there, kids will get older and it will get easier on that front but work on your relationship with your DH.

It’s a lot easier to hear from other women! But yes, I do wonder if a man would get the same advice. But even if they wouldn’t, maybe they should?!

I'm not sure if it's about men vs women but just that both of you can't have such demanding jobs and a happy, relaxed life. If you are the higher earner, perhaps you should be the one who 'goes for it' and DH takes a step back. It shouldn't HAVE to be you at all. I wish people would discuss this before they got married or into 'permanent' relationships.

And I am sure what gets your back up in conversations with DH is that he assumes it should be you who takes a step back. That would get my back up too.

Sounds like you need a holiday where you get a break from the kids. Take a nanny with you or go somewhere with lots of kids entertainment. Sometimes it’s just better to cut your losses and go home. I hope it gets better. No wonder you are exhausted. You have a lot on your hands.

I think you all have two much on your plate. Time to rethink taking on even more. Why a puppy in the mix????

Too much

@MerryMarigold Part of the problem is that we did discuss it before we got married. I hate my job at the time and dh wanted to go for partnership. But then a switched firms, hated maternity leave and started to love my job. Conversely, dh never made a partnership run, got what seemed to be a great opportunity to move in-house but absolutely loathes his job now. We have both changed a lot since we discussed all this 7-10 years ago!

@Benjispruce5 I have explained the puppy - honestly, she has been the best thing this year!

OP, But yes, I do wonder if a man would get the same advice. But even if they wouldn’t, maybe they should?! Yes, I do take that point. We all work too hard. I do think there is a big disparity though in attitudes to men working too much and women (mothers really) doing so.

I spent 6 weeks at my parents’ house last summer, working for some but not all of it. It was great for me but dh HATED it! We had no choice as our nanny suddenly quit but it actually worked out pretty well for me and the kids. That's interesting. What did he hate? Could you possibly partially replicate that holiday but in a way that would suit him too?

I totally agree with pp that holidays are (or tend to be) hard and very pressurised to be perfect. That's why I think a long break is better, so if things go wrong they don't dominate the time.

I’m a humble public sector worker and remember the horror I felt when 1st going on holiday with a toddler and realising holidays were now just an expensive session of babysitting abroad. It does get better, somewhere from 5 years old onwards until you hit the teen years and they’re not interested in holidaying with their parents.

Conversely, dh never made a partnership run, got what seemed to be a great opportunity to move in-house but absolutely loathes his job now.
Why doesn't he step back then?

We have both changed a lot since we discussed all this 7-10 years ago!
Well yes, that will always happen but what doesn't change is a commitment to what is best for each other / family/ your relationship. As a woman, you shouldn't be the one who has to take the burden of those considerations. It should be both of you.

@IntermittentParps

I wonder how many men posting this (not that I think men would, which is kind of the point) would get told how unrealistic their lawyer jobs were, how miserable their kids were going to be etc?

There's nothing wrong at all with loving your job and it's not just 'selfish'. It's important for kids to see parents motivated, working, happy with work etc.

This is going against the grain, but I wonder if an even LONGER holiday would be better? Think of it as 'summering' somewhere rather than going on holiday. Then if you have the odd period where you have to work/someone is ill/sleep is disrupted/weather is rubbish etc, it's just a small blip in a long summer rather than ruining a precious week or en days or whatever.

Also, why is your DH 'stomping around and shouting'? Tell him to buck up his ideas.

I agree with you and posted earlier that op should keep going.

My one question is over the school set up which seems to add stress with the pick up and shushing thing.

Plus low holiday spend which could be higher instead of private fees or on top of.

There’s some stuff that would make life better.

@MerryMarigold Agree - I think our big problem is total confusion about what we each want and a fear that what we each want isn’t compatible…

Hand hold here! I worked for a City law firm for nearly 20 years. Unfortunately I had an accident last year which meant I had to give up my job. As soon as I was out of the firm, no-one there has bothered contacting me since, there is nobody who cannot be replaced in this sort of working environment! All those late nights, missing my children’s bedtimes, interrupted holidays and for what??? Yes the money was great, but the job made me miserable and when I look back, I regret all those wasted hours at work instead of with my family. The more you give, the more they take!! My advice is, if it’s not making you happy and disrupting family life, then either find another less pressured job or don’t climb the greasy pole. Do not do this to yourself! You have a wonderful family and a life ahead. Work to live, don’t live to work! Good luck and all the best. I very much hope you feel better soon x

It’s not the 1.5hrsx2 that is the problem. It’s not being able to switch off and ignore what’s happening at work - you don’t get a mental break when you’re on standby.

OP, I work with a lot of lawyers. The profession is changing. If you want to, you should be able to find a firm that lets you switch off properly. I get that M&A is a bit mental but surely someone else could have signed off the bit that you did? What would they do if you got hit by a bus? I work in a very similar area and had to suddenly take time off when my mum became terminally ill. Other people helped with my clients and it wasn’t an issue. You’re not as indispensable as you think you are, no one is!

Also, stop getting paid for 4 days and working 5+, that’s ridiculous. With 25% more pay you could afford a different holiday if you wanted.

Good luck! Sorry your holiday has been tough.

3 weeks is too long for a relaxing holiday. Maybe OK for a full on holiday like florida where you are always busy. I'm done after a week in the Caribbean and so are the kids. Next time book something much shorter.

Hi op, take the nanny with you on holiday. Also always plan something that’s just you and yr husband. You both have to make time for each other. Learn to delegate some of yr tasks too-perhaps that’s a job goal more than counsel, looking to build a support network.

Hi Op,

Am I right you’re in self-catering?

If at home you have nanny, cleaner, Deliveroo etc you can’t go to a self catering holiday and expect to relax (unless domesticity is your way to unwind?!).

You also have to accept that holidays with your children are childcare in a different setting - and without your support system at home.

I would recommend either a hotel geared to children with activities, crèche, babysitting. You don’t even have to use the childcare but at least you aren’t cooking and cleaning up.

Or, if your DH prefers seclusion then “self-catering” place which comes with the option of food being cooked for you and cleaners coming in. It doesn’t have to be chef cooked dinners every night there are places that stock the fridge with lasagnes etc for you.

Is August usually quieter on the work front? Could you do your holidays then?

I think you need to up your budget for family holidays too.

It sounds like you need to do a general household budget in tandem with a review of how much you are both working.

If your husband was happier in his job would he be more supportive of your job?

You also mentioned that your MIL was a SAHM. Would your husband secretly or not so secretly prefer that you were one too? I think you need to have a big sit down and discuss everything in terms of budget, career aspirations, practicality, family harmony. I think it’s better to have it out with him and discuss why he thinks that / why you don’t want that / review the previous discussion you had that him sniping at you day to day.

There might be ways to work smarter not longer for example “I need 1 hour on Saturday morning / on holiday mornings and half an hour in the evening to check and respond to urgent emails please could you have the children then or can we arrange for someone to have the children then so that I can focus on that? Then I can be fully present for the rest of the day.”

Also, if you are concerned about finances then separating and running two households isn’t going to help.

I think you and DH need an “offsite” without the children and have a big reconnect and review how everything is going and how you can reach your family goals. It’s very hard when you’re in the thick of family life to make strategic decisions .

Thanks, @LorelaiVictoriaGilmore - I love the books! Sadly AmeliaPeabody was taken when I was last choosing a user name.

There are four things to think about here:
-your career
-his career
-the children's wellbeing
-your relationship.

No-one else can tell you what the right balance is for your household to get enough time to protect all those things. Some couples thrive with a lot of space, others need more time together. Some children are happy building good relationships with a lot of adults, others are happier with fewer significant relationships. Almost all careers can survive a few years where you take your foot off the pedal a bit to prioritise other things before you step back up when the children are older (and in your case I think it's probably your DH rather than you who should think about doing that, but that's not on the basis of full information), but you have to be very lucky to get back in again if you give up altogether. (I know it's not impossible, before someone comes on and says they spent 20 years as a SAHM and then walked back into a job with a 6-figure salary, but it's rare).

The small children years are awful. You're exhausted, they're very needy, you feel all the time that you're failing at everything. I had someone else taking the bulk of the domestic load and felt a complete failure because toddler DD pushed me away when I came home from work. And as many other people have said already, holidays when they're that small are not actually holidays, unless you have childcare on tap. I found with one that they started to become fun again when DD was about 5 or 6: I suspect with more than one the youngest needs to be a bit older than that for it to be fun.

So I think it's important not to take any big decisions because you're knackered and miserable now. You'd be knackered and miserable whether you'd shot for partnership, stayed home or anything in the middle. So keep going, and reevaluate once your youngest is in school.

Just to pick up on the camping idea, we hit on this when we rented a fairly expensive gite in France that turned out to have a "garden" round the corner, down some steep stone steps, holidaying with a very lively active toddler. Out for a walk one day , we stumbled upon the local campsite for a cheap and friendly lunch - other kids on tap, safe and enclosed, playground, kids club, swimming pool..and we saw the future! If you don't fancy camping, rent a "mobile home" or upgrade to holiday club (think club Med / Mark Warner)
Or, we have had great value out of hooking up with other families with similar age kids to rent a bigger property and occupy the kids, sharing the cooking, opting in or out of activities etc while parents take turns to have time off...
Renting a sole cottage is just more of home life etc without the "escape" of work!

@CatherineAragon

Sounds like you need a holiday where you get a break from the kids. Take a nanny with you or go somewhere with lots of kids entertainment. Sometimes it’s just better to cut your losses and go home. I hope it gets better. No wonder you are exhausted. You have a lot on your hands.

😭😭😢

This sounds incredibly hard. I think you're trying to do too much. You sound exhausted and overwhelmed, and I worry for the future of your marriage and your mental health if you continue to like this. You need to make some changes, and I agree that you shouldn't have to give up everything you've worked to achieve. DH sounds as if he's less career orientated? What sort of job is he looking for? If he's prepared to take a step back and do something that enables him to take on the bulk of the childcare and 'mental load', things would be much more manageable for you.

Could you consider switching to state school? The money you save on school fees could make a huge difference to your quality of life - taking a Nanny on holiday for instance! You could always look again at private schooling when they reach secondary.

I'm so sorry you've not enjoyed your time away. Holidays with young children are hard work, you have my sympathies!

I'm so sorry Lorella. Maybe booking three weeks away in one go was a bit much, two might have been better.

Surely your husband can log in to the psychometric test and start again.

You say you've had some good times and one child has a birthday tomorrow.

I hope all goes well for the rest of your stay.

@LorelaiVictoriaGilmore, you're on a bit of a hiding to nothing here. If people don't do the job that you do they can't understand it.

I started as a corporate lawyer, doing the all-nighters and was burned out by 5 years PQE. So I moved to commercial law, which was an improvement. I then moved in-house, which isn't the easy life that some people think, but it certainly gives more control over my hours because I am the client.

Could you think about moving sideways - a change of specialism maybe?

And I always used to get ill on holidays a few years ago. I worked out that I was working at breakneck speed all year and then when I took a break, my body just gave up. It's no life, but the salary is a pair of handcuffs to an extent.

Good luck!