Just realised how snobby & unfriendly the mums at dc's school are:(

[Jerseyshore12]

Bit of a background... My dc's are at a very good state school in an affluent area... Most parents at the school live in similar estates/houses however the level of snobbery is really making me miserable, I hate the school run... I try to be friendly, always smile, say hi, try to muster up conversation but they literally look at me like I'm something they walked on... I came home & cried this morning, I felt so belittled & worthless. If your face doesn't fit, you don't have a high flying career or not part of the PTA or another comittee you don't seem to get acknowledged... Thankfully we live in a lovely house & area, dc are super happy in the school, lots of friends & are flying with their schoolwork which really is the main thing... I guess I just need a few coping mechanisms to get me through the drop offs. Please be kind & if anyone has had any similar experiences please share.

Join the PTA & get involved

I went through this. I was a single mother of children at a posh prep school, ex was paying, I drove a crappy 2nd hand car and didn't wear gold sparkly shoes! I was only spoke to if there was no one else there. I also worked so I never was asked to the lunches that were had. Quite frankly I wouldn't have wanted to go anyway. I expect you have some lovely friends outside of the school anyway and I would stick to those, less of those minefields to step on. You will be fine tomorrow is another day.

I am shy and socially inept / phobic, and suffer resting bitch face. The chances of them judging you are pretty small really I would say - they're probably just all very stressed out from school run and getting through the day. School run is a bad time to judge anyone as most of us are stressed and exhausted by getting kids up, breakfasted, dressed and out the house.

Join the PTA and give them a chance.

@purpleboy

I'm with you bluntness. If I'm chatting in a group I see many mums who stand to the side and don't come to the group to chat, I quite often try to catch their eye to call them over, especially if they are new, but some of the time I don't, as really I feel adults should be capable of walking up to a group and saying hi. I don't see it as them being excluded, I see it as people for whatever reason deciding not to make an effort to join a group and it shouldn't be the responsibility of the group to call you over.

Am also with bluntness and purple especially this bit think looking at the abuse being hurled here at women who don’t include random others at the school,gates it seems there is a level or resentment and bitterness that these women seem to have friends and don’t include the various posters. It means apparently these women who have friends are “horrible, nasty, devoid of personality, snobby, cliquey, bitchy “ etc and worthy of abuse. and am bemused that this is the opinion spouted of those stating what kind, wonderful, accepting people they are!

I just think. Making your drop offs Just that you say hello if people are not responsive then that isn't really your issue..drop and pick up and if you think they might be "judging," you then do you really want them to like you.

I find all the talking outside the school gates really quite sad to be honest! I've always tried to avoid getting in with the mums as I can't be doing with having intense conversations about "little Johnny" scouts experience or "little Julie" swimming classes. I am not interested in other peoples children!! There is always the "alpha" mum who everyone gravitates to ( she usually has the biggest car and loudest voice!) And there all the little hangers on who are made up if she gives them a pta job to do!!! Please dont worry OP about fitting in with any of them, your children have friends it doesn't matter if you make friends at the same school. Just concentrate on getting your kids to school and by all means carry on saying hello but don't worry about what they think. At the end of year 6 they will no doubt move on anyways!

Aren't you the snob? So many judgy sneers about people you don't even know.

OP, I'm sorry this has made you cry.

You can take it from me that this isn't worth it (or maybe I'm just a thick-skinned old boot who doesn't care whether I stand alone or exchange a few pleasantries), but I know that's small comfort when you're feeling as low as you are.

So my contribution is nothing but a handhold, should you want one. Be good to yourself

I find all the talking outside the school gates really quite sad to be honest!
Honestly! 🙄

Just listen to music or a podcast, be in your own little world. You don’t need to be friends with these people.

Just to say I used to be very uneasy at the primary school gates, even though there were some perfectly nice mums among the multitude.

It always felt like an oddly competitive situation - mums with jobs hinting how important and busy their jobs were; mums without jobs going on about all the great things they did for the PTA/with their kids. Mums with many kids flaunting their reproductive success and mums with 1-2 kids flaunting everything else they were doing with their lives besides kids. Mums with working class jobs feeling looked at askance by women with degrees; constant tracking of all sorts of markers of class....

I think it's really a reflection of how much women get judged on their mothering, and on how they square it with the 'rest' of life. And of how easy it is for women to get sucked into this judginess. I always wishes we could just all high-five each other for having managed to produce children and get them to school, never mind in what car/boots/makeup.

I suspect a lot of the apparently snooty mums are feeling just as insecure as you. I'd try to focus on a couple of people you like the look of, and not sweat it. Hope it gets better.

I am sorry I think you might need to work on your self esteem. I get a sense you think people are thinking less of you because you are a SAHM. I am also guessing your children are young since you are still doing drop off and pick up. I am a SAHM - the thing is we have more freedom to chat but others do not. If anything, I have never experienced people being snobby towards me for being a SAHM - but there has been a lot of jealousy from mums who want to be SAHM mums but for whatever reason can't.
It's super important to that you look for friends outside of the school - boast your self confidence. If you want friends inside the school - look for people who need friends like new parents or mums who are smiling back at you.
From my experience (and I have teens now) most mums are just chatting to their friends and would not even realise you are feeling the way you do.

@BrimfulOfBaba

For me, how you make people feel is the most important measure of a person's worth. These mums are making you feel bad for what sounds like no reason at all and that reflects so poorly on them. Try your best to not take their snobbery to heart, you seem like a much kinder person by miles.

This in spades.

I find it upsetting that you're almost in tears over this. Don't think about it, they mean nothing. You need to find your inner strength and just go about your business. You seen to be taking this far too much to heart- and i mean that gently for your sake.

It always felt like an oddly competitive situation - mums with jobs hinting how important and busy their jobs were; mums without jobs going on about all the great things they did for the PTA/with their kids. Mums with many kids flaunting their reproductive success and mums with 1-2 kids flaunting everything else they were doing with their lives besides kids. Mums with working class jobs feeling looked at askance by women with degrees; constant tracking of all sorts of markers of class....
Suffering Christ...
Maybe they were just chatting in the way you do with people you don't actually know all that well?
If you managed to read all that into perfectly normal human interactions, I think the problem is with you.

Have you ever watched 'Motherland', op? All 3 series are on IPlayer, and I would thoroughly recommend it! You couldn't find a better treatise on playground politics anywhere! Play a game on the school run and try and compare the people you meet with the stereotypes on the show - alpha Mum, SAHM, househusband etc.
Just like in the show, the parents who seem to have it all. often don't. Some of them might even be feeling the same as you.

Sometimes it takes a long time to 'break into' pre-formed gangs. They might have known each other since mother and toddler groups, for example. Do persevere, if that's what you would like. Keep on saying hello and smiling. Join things like the PTA, if you can. Help out at school, sometimes, if you can. I'm sure you'll eventually connect with some nice people.

It's not you, it's the other women, who are all like little groupies,who all act the same, and for some reason, they think it's ok to ignore some others. I certainly would not get upset about a gaggle of women outside the school gates.

It's along time since I was taking my children to school, but I never wanted to really get involved in school gate chats, they can be quite tedious,with some women, who are more upfront with their opinions,and their tittle tattle stuff.

Have you ever watched Motherland? worth a viewing, lots of stuff about mum dynamics.

@Duckswaddle

Just listen to music or a podcast, be in your own little world. You don’t need to be friends with these people.

I think that’s the thing, she desperately wants to be, and not being part of the group is devastating her, to the stage she says she’s obsessing over what she wore or said and sitting crying,

I could be wrong as she’s not answered, but I’m suspecting the op doesn’t really have any close friends. Becayse when you do and you’re happy with your social life you tend not to look to augment it so desperately like this, you give less of a shit

So the answer would then be how does the op expand her world past her family and the school run, so she makes friends and has an active social life and these random women are no longer her focus.

To be fair OP, the way things are at the moment, I probably wouldn’t even see you smiling with my mask on and fogged up glasses, it’s enough not getting run over in the school car park or bashing into anyone with the buggy and violin when you can’t see a thing. But I will chat with other parents outside the class room door if I catch their eye (most people are socially shy until you know them I think). I know so many fewer parents than with my older child because of covid (and no class parties etc either).

Join the pta?

Id be very surprised if every parent looked down on you. I'd say its more a case if them being in established groups and not very welcoming. But really, this seems really important now, but honestly, it's not. Even if they never include you, its five minutes, twice a day, a tiny part of your life, that in the context of a life of parenting, is nothing. I don't think I ever said more than hello to anyone at school, but that was fine, I had friends, interests, and saw the school run as a chore, like going shopping, where I wouldn't expect other shoppers to chat. Would this approach, with minimising it and focusing on other areas of your life work for you?

OP, I mean this in a kind way, but could you come back and tell us a bit more about you/your life? It's not a normal reaction to be crying and examining your every move/outfit because you feel like they are being cruel. I will be honest, I have a resting bitch face! I don't look very approachable, but I am actually quite chatty. The last 15 months, all anyone has done is focus on getting through their day and not going mad with the COVID news. It's also not been a time for mixing and getting to know others.

I suspect there is more to this. You are a SAHM, your DH presumably out at work. I would guess the last year hasn't been easy for you, perhaps home-schooling and not much support/friendship?

There was a group of yummy mummies at my DS’s primary school. I felt very excluded and quite down about it. However I bonded with a couple of other ‘excluded’ Mums and we are still friends 20 years later.

there has been a lot of jealousy from mums who want to be SAHM mums but for whatever reason can't. have you been told by these other mums that they are jealous of you, or have you inferred this?

I’m not even sure it’s about not being very welcoming.

My daughter left school nearly five years ago and I can still picture the mums who stood on their own over the years, twiddling with their phones, who only said a quiet hello or smiled if you caught their eye.

As said, I just went and spoke to whomever I recognised if I was early. I wasn’t part of any clique, and I didn’t wish to make friends, Generally I’d go to the biggest group. I never really gave any thought at all to those standing on their own. I think I just assumed that’s what they wished to do, otherwise they’d join in like I did.

It certainly wouldn’t have occured to me to go over and bring them to the group. That would have felt intrusive and infantilising.Anyone who approached the groups would have been welcomed, included and everyone polite to.

Now I’m thinking maybe there were women like rhe op there, desperately wanting to join in, massively overthinking it and too scared to walk up and just join the conversation.