Manners - are there any you didn't know about until you were older?

[CheeseToastieLove]

Is there anything you didn't realise was bad manners until you were an adult. Things you weren't told when you were young? I didn't realise it was good manners to leave your alcohol at a party when you were leaving until I was in my late 20s. Always took my half full bottle home with me! Cringe. My friend was never taught it was bad manners to start eating before everyone's meals had arrived until she was in her 30s. She was always half finished before everyone had been served.

I didn't realise well in to my 30s that when you take a bottle to a party, you don't drink that bottle. Rather, it's a gift for the host and you drink theirs

Except in our case both bottles get drunk
Because that is what is usual in our circles.

In DH's family, they had small talk at a dinner party practice. Twice a month, they would have a more formal family dinner; they dressed up, had the good china and linens, and the children had to take turns being host/hostess who would sort of lead the conversation. Needless to say, they hated it, but it worked because they all have savoir faire in bucket loads.

That's it's rude to call someone a w*nker when you hold the door open for them and they don't say thank you ....

@SenecaFallsRedux

In DH's family, they had small talk at a dinner party practice. Twice a month, they would have a more formal family dinner; they dressed up, had the good china and linens, and the children had to take turns being host/hostess who would sort of lead the conversation. Needless to say, they hated it, but it worked because they all have savoir faire in bucket loads.

Oh, wow ... I can totally see how that would be useful, but still, gosh, that sounds a nightmare.

My brother is quite dyslexic and at some point my very desperate parents ended up sending him to a really off-the-wall prep school for a couple of years, because it had a reputation for being good with dyslexic children. We had all been in bog standard state schools before. I remember one of the school traditions was that each week a different group of boys ate at 'high table' with the headmaster and were taught to make small talk and acquire good table manners.

Utterly, utterly bonkers. I'm sure helpful in a certain sort of life, but bonkers.

There seems to be some confusion between "how do you do" and "how are you?"

"How do you do" is a statement, not a question as the first person is not asking how you are. The correct response is "how do you do". I know it sounds silly but that's the way it is.

"How are you?" is a question so the correct response is something along the lines of "I'm well, thank you. And you?"

@lms2017

That's it's rude to call someone a w*nker when you hold the door open for them and they don't say thank you ....

I say 'No, thank you' and I either get a glare or a mumbled thank you back. Manners cost nothing!

i completely agree , this also annoys me when i watch period dramas and hear it said , once on downton abbey ruined the whole escapism for me. I say to my lot ( not what pardon ) were a easy going family but i just find the what word so rude and abrupt .

@purplemom03

i completely agree , this also annoys me when i watch period dramas and hear it said , once on downton abbey ruined the whole escapism for me. I say to my lot ( not what pardon ) were a easy going family but i just find the what word so rude and abrupt .

While I’d be loathe to suggest Downton Abbey is in any way indebted to realism, aristocrats in the immediate post-WW1 era weren’t going to use such a non-U term. It would be as contextually off as Del Boy saying ‘how do you do’ to someone he met down at the market.

I understand the old-fashioned 'How do you do?' greeting to someone you've just met / a stranger, and the same in reply, but who and why would still use this today?
Is 'Hello' too informal for some?

As I commented in my earier post, 'How do you do' has morphed now into 'You alright?' answered with the same like an echo. Which to me is the other extreme - too lazy and a bit silly.
But what's wrong with a 'hello/hi' which seems a middle ground?

My grandmother gave me a lovely etiquette book when I was about 12. Maybe Emily Post, it was great. How to eat bacon, and lobster and deal with the pat of butter. How to address letters and exceptions.
Honestly it’s enjoyable light easy reading and practical as well. Highly recommend it.

I'm afraid I would shock a lot of Mumsnetters on here because I always say 'what', never 'pardon', as it's the way I was brought up. I'm not judging anyone else though as long as the tone of voice is polite.

Oh, and there is only one acceptable response to How are you? It's Fine thanks, how are you. definitely NOT: I'm really tired at the moment, work has been quite stressful, blah blah ... (SIL I'm thinking of you)

I know ‘what?’ is the correct thing to say, but it just sounds so blunt, and because a lot of people think it’s rude, I always feel like I’d rather not...

@BecauseMyRingBurnsSheila- I say, “Don’t mention it!”

I can't imagine why you'd hold a knife like a pen.....?

Gosh Tulip your poor sil. I think normally if you are asking family how they are its reasonable to be open and be interested...

Absolutely Talk about bad manners!

Because it's a pleasantry said at the beginning of a phone call. You reciprocate the sentiment, then you can move onto the business of the phone call, which may or may not include how hard you are having to work at the moment (aren't we all ...)

Here’s the worst case of bad manners (as in making someone feel uncomfortable) I ever heard of.

Friend of a dd, from a well off and generally very clever family, had a rather less academic friend of their dd to dinner. My dd was also present.

The father amused himself with a spelling test - getting the (teen) girls in turn to spell words he knew were considered difficult - knowing very well that the less academic one would find it difficult and very mortifying. And she did. Particularly when members of the clever family sniggered at her incorrect efforts.

My dd (who had no trouble with the spellings) was appalled at such deliberate, malicious ‘fun’ at someone else’s expense.

The white dress thing is not just on MN. Somebody wore a white dress to my wedding and to be honest I did feel offended at the time. Pre-reading MN days. I don't think I would feel offended now but I would be displeased I suppose for want of a better word.

Also even though some of these are arcane, please do take the time to teach your children the basics. I wasn't taught some of these and my first evening meal at uni, working out by observing others which glass and fork to use, was a fairly uncomfortable experience.

It is not about whether or not they would have been right to judge me. It is just that the many options were on the table and I would have been grateful to not have to think about it!

Has anyone mentioned BMW- bread, meal, wine?

Getting, my pal had a dad a little like that, trying to see how clever or otherwise we were. Awful man he made no other attempts at kindness.

It's also incredibly bad manners to put one's carpet above one's guests

I'd never dream of asking people, esp the elderly or infirm to take their shoes off!
Apparently it's very common and my own infirm df was asked to take his off once.

It's polite to put the guest first and make sure your carpet can withstand a clean shoe, and not live a life devoted to a carpet.

I really struggle with formal introductions. Because it makes me so nervous I have a mental block as to how to go about it. Similarly, which cutlery to use if there's shitloads.
I also find it extremely hard to read signs for hellos and goodbyes. I'm fine with a formal handshake, but get quite anxious in the lead up as to whether there'll be hugs, cheek kisses or air kisses.
I'm guessing that's something people learn, or are taught?

Sarah and quack, small talk is a huge bug bear of mine

It's essentially how we all get along isn't it, and make each feel comfortable. Yes, some people don't like it but it's easier to move onto bigger subjects when the smaller are easing you in

It's a skill, and an important one and one that my dh family don't do.
So it's either me talking and generating conversation by, small talk or silence.
When people don't mske small talk, esp in situations like this it feels like they don't care about your comfort, they are not interested in you and that they are rude.

@LunaNorth

Correcting someone at the table is far worse manners than putting your cutlery down in the ‘wrong’ position.

Isn’t the done thing to join in with the mistake so as not to make the transgressor feel uncomfortable?

That person was showing their lack of breeding, I fear.

THIS.

I read that Queen Victoria was hosting a dinner and a foreign guest drank from the finger bowl. Queen Victoria to avoid his feeling that he'd done something wrong, promptly did the same. Manners us about making your guests feel at home not to score points.

@fallfallfall

My grandmother gave me a lovely etiquette book when I was about 12. Maybe Emily Post, it was great. How to eat bacon, and lobster and deal with the pat of butter. How to address letters and exceptions. Honestly it’s enjoyable light easy reading and practical as well. Highly recommend it.

Oh what book is it? That sounds really interesting fallfallfall