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Original poster

If you're a SAHM, do you feel judged? And if you're a working mum, do you judge a SAHM?

736 replies

ItalianRed · 03/04/2021 14:34

Hi,

So I've been out of work for 15 years, apart from a couple of part time jobs here and there. I have a teenager and so have the time, but for several reasons, I'm not currently working. Financially, I don't need to, but there are other reasons too.

I often see on social media, the debate about SAHMs once dc are in school and if it's lazy or even anti feminist to not go back to work.

A couple of my friends recently dug themselves a hole on separate occasions when talking about a school mum friend who didn't work. One said "what does she actually do all day? Her husband even does the cooking some nights!" And the other said "She must be so bored and feel like she doesn't have a real identity". They were both quick to clumsily back track and say they're not referring to me because I'm obviously different Hmm Why? Because I'm their friend? I'm still a woman who chooses not to work and who, shock horror, doesn't cook ever single family meal! 😲

In the past when I've heard similar comments, I'd say don't worry about it, you've not offended me etc, even if they had because I didn't want them to feel awkward or embarrassed, but this last time I just smiled and said nothing. One of them even said that this particular mum is perfectly nice, but she needs to keep her at "arms length", for no other reason that I could see other than she didn't work.

The more I thought about it, the more it pissed me off. They're really judgey, bitchy comments to make. It seems as though if you do choose to be a SAHM, then unless you're constantly scrubbing, cleaning, cooking, volunteering and on various committees, then you're looked down on.

Be interesting to hear your perspectives....

OP posts:
Jobsharenightmare · 05/04/2021 08:46

It's just hyperbole not serious. A SAHM to little ones or even teens, with lots going on in life is a very different kind of person to the examples PP have quoted in the 14 pages of people TV watching all day etc, presumably trying to differentiate between SAHM with an identity and interests of their own.

G5000 · 05/04/2021 08:46

why isn't "because I want to" a good enough justification (for either situation) it's certainly ok for men!

Hmm I might have to disagree. Sure men certainly don't have to justify working.
But can you imagine a post on MN: 'Our children are school age, I am working all hours and barely see the family. DH does not want to get a job, spends his days on hobbies, taking courses for personal fulfillment and talking to carrots'.

He'd be ripped to shreds and she would be told to get rid of the cocklodger.

JeanClaudeVanDammit · 05/04/2021 08:53

Just admit that people (you) think SAHMs are lazy and most people are jealous.

I don’t think they’re automatically lazy. Some absolutely are though.

I don’t think it’s as difficult as being a working parent (multiple pre-school children, disabilities etc aside) but that doesn’t mean I want to do it. Just because something is easier doesn’t necessarily make it more attractive as a way to live, so no jealousy here.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

Families
Waxonwaxoff0 · 05/04/2021 09:11

I work but I find it bizarre that people wouldn't want to ne friends with SAHMs because they "have nothing to talk about." Honestly, my job is the least interesting thing in my life, if my working friends wanted to talk about their jobs/volunteering non stop I wouldn't want to be friends with them. Thank goodness that although we all work, we have a range of other things to talk about too.

Waxonwaxoff0 · 05/04/2021 09:12

As for hobbies, I'd imagine that SAHP have more time to dedicate to them. As a single working parent I've got fuck all time for hobbies!

Waxonwaxoff0 · 05/04/2021 09:14

@G5000

why isn't "because I want to" a good enough justification (for either situation) it's certainly ok for men!

Hmm I might have to disagree. Sure men certainly don't have to justify working.
But can you imagine a post on MN: 'Our children are school age, I am working all hours and barely see the family. DH does not want to get a job, spends his days on hobbies, taking courses for personal fulfillment and talking to carrots'.

He'd be ripped to shreds and she would be told to get rid of the cocklodger.

I think it depends on the situation. If the working parent is entirely happy with the other parent not working then it doesn't matter. Being a SAHP is something that has to be agreed on by both parties.
Original poster
ItalianRed · 05/04/2021 09:30

@Waxonwaxoff0, exactly. My dp works hard, but not to make up for the fact that I don't. They're very ambitious and are lucky to be in a field that they love and is also lucky that that field is really lucrative.

If we were struggling financially at all or if I felt like something was missing, I would absolutely go back to work. Dp would be happy either way. If they didn't want me to work I'd be running for the hills!

OP posts:
Whiskeylover45 · 05/04/2021 09:41

Done both, felt more judged for not working by myself if I'm honest as I always have and it started to feel a bit uncomfortable that it was DH providing for us. There were reasons I took four years out, newborn, family illness ect but I wanted to go back. I work full time now with a four year old, husband part time and it works for us. But no I'd never judge either, you do you and they do them; and all that jazz.

CricketClub · 05/04/2021 09:53

I didn’t judge at the time but my God I was judged as a working mother.

My DC were dropped off at before school club and picked up from after school club each day. They had (shock horror) school dinners and I soon realised that baking wholesome packed lunches comprising of home-made freshly baked bread, home cooked evening meal were mandatory if you were a good mother.

I was not a team player because I couldn’t volunteer for anything and everything.

Looking back, years later, sorry to say, I am full of judgement.
Many of these perfect families have split up so maybe our way wasn’t so bad after all.

IdblowJonSnow · 05/04/2021 10:01

I became a stay at home parent a while ago. I was bullied at work and then resigned due to stress. I scrambled around for some part time jobs and then we had lockdown so was doing home school for some of that. I'm also retraining which takes 2.5 days a week.
On the day im not doing that I do an hour or two of housework and laundry, bits of shopping, go for a walk, meet a friend. Then the day is gone, it's not like picking up from school is a full day.

I've heard people make comments about others who don't work but havent had people make comments directly to me other than my in laws occasionally.

I've always worked other than maternity leaves and this has been a lovely break and I feel fortunate it's coincided w lockdown, although that was hard, would have been harder to juggle with work.

IdblowJonSnow · 05/04/2021 10:03

#Days not day.

IdblowJonSnow · 05/04/2021 10:05

And I would like to return to work this year sometime, although ideally I will never work full time again, kids or no kids! 3 or 4 days would be great. Meaningful part time jobs are very hard to come by, I do know that.

Waferbiscuit · 05/04/2021 11:17

I have worked FT for 25 years and have been a single parent for 7. I have def been judged for working.

I judge some SAHM because:

  1. They are making themselves utterly financially reliant on their partner, the govt or both. Read Leslie Bennett's The Feminine Mistake to see why this is such a risk.
  2. They are setting up a system of enabling men so grown men get someone to do their laundry and their life admin. Yuck and yuck. Continuing the cycle of male privilege. Why???
  3. By proxy those men get to have flexibility at work and stay late thus giving them an advantage over single parents like me and continuing the gender gap in the workforce. Thanks!
  4. Sahms often use the trope that their set up is beneficial for the kids but often it is most beneficial for them. For some having children and being a SAHM is a way to stay out of the workforce. There will always be a portion of people who don't like working and lack ambition in that area. Why not be honest? But how depressing in 2021 that if you don't want to work you can get a man to look after you. Urgh.
  5. Both my mom and stepmom never worked and by golly they can fit nothing into a day and think one appointment in one day is a busy day. They have a very skewed sense of productivity. They also live in a bit of a bubble having never had to deal with the pressure of work or other's expectations.
bjjgirl · 05/04/2021 11:37

I don't judge but I always have a thought of how dependant and vulnerable being a sahm would make a person, what happens if their partner died / left? What would it be like having to rely on another for money, how does that affect their power balance in their relationship etc

NRCS · 05/04/2021 11:47

If I'm honest I do see a bit of a pattern, now I am at that stage, of the SAHPs that "dedicated their lives to their children" hitting the buffer a bit once their kids reach secondary school age and don't need as .uch dedicated attention - out of the house all day, hobbies and friends after school, in their bedrooms doing he or being teenagers all evening. This unfortunately tends to coincide with getting older, peri menopause, menopause etc plus the husband's midlife crisis, out all weekend cycling/golfing, affairs with younger women etc.

I am glad that if/when that happens to me I will have worklife, friends, careers satisfaction and be financially independent and have work as a distraction, I have to be honest.

rainbowballs · 05/04/2021 11:47

@bjjgirl

I don't judge but I always have a thought of how dependant and vulnerable being a sahm would make a person, what happens if their partner died / left? What would it be like having to rely on another for money, how does that affect their power balance in their relationship etc
What would happen to two working parents if one died?

Am I wrong in thinking that most people have mortgages based on the two incomes?

Formulation123 · 05/04/2021 11:49

@IdblowJonSnow 100% agree I’ve dropped down to 2.5 days and I can’t see me ever working 5 days again. I will maybe up my hours to 4 days at some point once the kids are older but then I will be thinking about retirement / I will be older and actually not working 5 days is a luxury I’m very grateful to have as an option

NRCS · 05/04/2021 12:01

Most joint mortgages stipulate that you have to have the decreasing term life insurance policies tied in (or at least used to) so most people where both work, that insurance would pay off the remaining mortgage in the event of one person's death. They would also probably get some level of death in service benefit which would also usually be sufficient to pay off the mortgage. This is what happened when my father died in his fifties whilst still working - his death in service paid off the mortgage (he didn't have life insurance).

In my case, we both have life insurance and death in service benefits so the surviving partner would probably not even need to work much in the event of one death.

CricketClub · 05/04/2021 12:14

Both my mom and stepmom never worked and by golly they can fit nothing into a day and think one appointment in one day is a busy day. They have a very skewed sense of productivity. They also live in a bit of a bubble having never had to deal with the pressure of work or other's expectations.

This is very well put.

Pebbledashery · 05/04/2021 12:17

I try not to judge.. I'm a full time working single parent and I honestly couldn't be a SAHM... These 4 days at home with DD have really tested my patience 😂😂. I have the utomost respect for SAHMs who do everything.. Those who send them to nursery 5 days a week so they can just be ladies that lunch and expect their husbands to cook after a 12 hour day are questionable 🙄 being a stay at home or working mum is tough in equal measure. I miss out time with my little girl as I'm working my socks off to make a better life for both of us.

JassyRadlett · 05/04/2021 12:23

I’ve worked since my kids were tiny so I didn’t know many SAHMs until my eldest went to school.

I now have some great friends who are SAHMs.

There are other SAHMs I’ve met who are, frankly, rude and judgemental about mothers who work, particularly if it’s more than a couple of days a week. This group seems to have an agenda to shore up their own choice/situation by undermining those in a different situation. It’s weird.

JSL52 · 05/04/2021 13:52

Don't judge , just think it's odd when the kids are older. What do you do all day ? Hasn't your brain gone to mush ? I'd be bored to death.
What about money ? You read on here women having no access to money.
If you were on your own suddenly how would you manage ?

OnGoldenPond · 05/04/2021 14:04

Mothers are always criticised no matter what choices we make, we can't win.

Remember the old saying " a mother's place is in the wrong ". Too true.

Blyatiful · 05/04/2021 14:08

Mine went to an international school when they were small and I was the only working mother, apart from the teacher. I was largely ignored by the other mothers, despite my efforts to be friendly. I was asked why I had had children if I was just going to give them to “a series of Filipinas” to bring up (we briefly had a Filipina nanny). One mother who brought her child round for a play date said “mind if I have a look round?” And went all over the house including our bedroom, came down and expressed surprise that the house was clean. If this isn’t judging, I don’t know what is.

I also find that the Precious Moments Brigade (“Oh what if you’re not there for the first step/word/solid food/haircut?”) turn into the They Need You More When They Are Older club, justifying staying at home while their grunting teen/working 20something barely acknowledges their existence.

rainbowballs · 05/04/2021 14:16

@NRCS

Most joint mortgages stipulate that you have to have the decreasing term life insurance policies tied in (or at least used to) so most people where both work, that insurance would pay off the remaining mortgage in the event of one person's death. They would also probably get some level of death in service benefit which would also usually be sufficient to pay off the mortgage. This is what happened when my father died in his fifties whilst still working - his death in service paid off the mortgage (he didn't have life insurance).

In my case, we both have life insurance and death in service benefits so the surviving partner would probably not even need to work much in the event of one death.

Ok, so that's the same as if one person is working and the other not:

Life insurance and death in service payouts.

So SAHMs aren't massively more vulnerable at all.

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