Breastfeeding isn't easy for all mothers...?

[faithfulbird20]

What do you think? I honestly find it the most hardest thing in the world...finding the right tops, cloths, you're feeding one side the other side decides to leak a waterfall, baby doesn't want to latch properly, mild tongue tie, sometimes it's easy, sometimes it's hard and annoying, breast milk has leaked on baby's clothes, baby needs changing. Breastfeeding in front of other people, family etc...

@Wondermule

James telling everyone who disagrees with you that they have internalised issues 😂 that old chestnut is used every time someone can’t think of a proper response. It’s classic ‘attack the person’, and can be used against anyone and anything. So try again 😂

No. I'm saying YOU have issues. Because

1. You keep making stuff up
2. You are taking it extremely personally that some women are proud of their breastfeeding journeys. On this thread alone you have mocked, belittled sneered at and laughed at women saying they found their own feeding journeys something to be proud of. But you can't say why.

Let's face it, you're a psychologist's wet dream

Another classic retort! What have I made up exactly? Care to be specific?

Well for a start you misquoted me entirely on the same line about five times, different things each time

And because I hold the opinion that the benefits of bf are overstated (not non existent), and therefore mums who can’t do it shouldn’t worry, posters have tried to tear me to shreds

Have they?! Who?

I will continue to point out that the benefits of bf are negligible because they are

And THAT is why people think you have an agenda.

Why would you do that to women who have overcome struggles in breastfeeding? Playing down the benefits - which is your aim? Why would you actually put them off feeding rather than providing support.

And I'm sure if I came along and said "I'll go on threads and tell everyone the dangers of formula because there are dangers" you'd shit yourself into a frenzy

Might wanna pass the message on to James then

Thanks for your consideration but I don't care how people feed their babies either. I do care when people try and ride roughshod over the feelings of someone else's experience

I tried to breastfeed all four of my children, but each time was told to stop as my milk was so poor quality. Apparently I make skimmed milk rather than full fat, was given loads of support to try and increase quality of milk but nothing worked.

@JamesMiddletonsMarshmallows

I will continue to point out that the benefits of bf are negligible because they are

And THAT is why people think you have an agenda.

Why would you do that to women who have overcome struggles in breastfeeding? Playing down the benefits - which is your aim? Why would you actually put them off feeding rather than providing support.

And I'm sure if I came along and said "I'll go on threads and tell everyone the dangers of formula because there are dangers" you'd shit yourself into a frenzy

Because it’s a fact! I’m not ‘playing down’ anything. What, do you think we should lie and say the benefits are huge? Why would you do that to women who couldn’t overcome their bf struggles? And make them think they’ve seriously compromised their child’s health?

There are dangers to formula, but mainly when it comes to making the bottle up safely rather than the actual substance. You’re the one shitting yourself into a frenzy over fact and making out it’s my ‘opinion’

@JamesMiddletonsMarshmallows

Might wanna pass the message on to James then

Thanks for your consideration but I don't care how people feed their babies either. I do care when people try and ride roughshod over the feelings of someone else's experience

You told me lots of people cared about how you fed your baby. When I said they probably didn’t ‘care’ as such and were being polite/accommodating, you got really angry and said in that case I can’t have anyone supportive in my life so which is it? Do we care about how other people feed their babies or don’t we? Or is it only you that others should care about?

let's face it, you're a psychologist's wet dream

I like this phrase and I shall use it.

'A newborn baby has no concept of what a boob is'.

Oh, but they have! @Wondermule. I know the conversation has moved on somewhat, but just wanted to interject with this one. You're right of course that newborns have the instinct to suckle whatever is put in their mouth, but they ARE also programmed to recognise a breast. They are born programmed with the preference of looking at faces and also to be able to seek and find a breast. Hence the lovely dartboard appearance of a nipple and areola. This is where the concept of biological nurturing comes from. Babies are encouraged to use their natural newborn reflexes to find the breast, with no help other than being placed on their mother's stomach. Fascinating!

@Somethingsnappy

'A newborn baby has no concept of what a boob is'.

Oh, but they have! @Wondermule. I know the conversation has moved on somewhat, but just wanted to interject with this one. You're right of course that newborns have the instinct to suckle whatever is put in their mouth, but they ARE also programmed to recognise a breast. They are born programmed with the preference of looking at faces and also to be able to seek and find a breast. Hence the lovely dartboard appearance of a nipple and areola. This is where the concept of biological nurturing comes from. Babies are encouraged to use their natural newborn reflexes to find the breast, with no help other than being placed on their mother's stomach. Fascinating!

Oooh that’s interesting. Why is it they will immediately accept a bottle then? And not push it away to look for boob?

Because it’s a fact! I’m not ‘playing down’ anything. What, do you think we should lie and say the benefits are huge?

Collectively the benefits are huge. Not just nutritionally, but convenience, cost (or lack of), reduction in likelihood of getting breast cancer, less likely to get an ear infection, etc. Those are not insignificant factors - but you want to actively tell women that there's hardly any benefits? Why? What's your deal?

You told me lots of people cared about how you fed your baby. When I said they probably didn’t ‘care’ as such and were being polite/accommodating, you got really angry and said in that case I can’t have anyone supportive in my life so which is it? Do we care about how other people feed their babies or don’t we? Or is it only you that others should care about?

I'll ignore your obtuse tone and say - I don't care WHAT choice they make but I WILL be supportive and caring when they make that choice.

Why is it they will immediately accept a bottle then? And not push it away to look for boob?

Some babies actually do.

But if you were looking for a breast to get milk, and something was shoved in your mouth that poured milk in I imagine you'd be satisfied. Also have a wee think about why bottle are shaped the way they are

DS1 first 2 weeks were no fun. He was jaundiced and tongue tied. Up to 6 weeks were hard. Then it was way easier than making up bottles properly (no perfect prep or using boiled water to do it quick).

@JamesMiddletonsMarshmallows

Because it’s a fact! I’m not ‘playing down’ anything. What, do you think we should lie and say the benefits are huge?

Collectively the benefits are huge. Not just nutritionally, but convenience, cost (or lack of), reduction in likelihood of getting breast cancer, less likely to get an ear infection, etc. Those are not insignificant factors - but you want to actively tell women that there's hardly any benefits? Why? What's your deal?

I do agree re the environment point, but lots of bf women buy a pump, bottles & a steriliser etc as well as bfing clothes, nipple creams, disposable breast pads etc so there is some environmental impact. Many won’t of course.

Cost is a great point, and one which I suggested should be reiterated in one of my previous posts.

Breast cancer - yes but again a very small impact, around 4% for each whole year spent breastfeeding (I think). Obviously better than nothing but again a small benefit, and nothing to panic ff mums over.

As for bloody ear infections we were all EBF as kids and suffer really badly with them, as well as a multitude of immune system problems, eczema etc. My fully formula fed DP has not a single health condition and has seen the GP about twice in his life 😳

When did I ever say there were ‘hardly any benefits’? And you accuse me of making stuff up 🙄 I said the benefits are there, but on an individual level they’re negligible. There is no one thing bfing protects against entirely, or even close.

@JamesMiddletonsMarshmallows

You told me lots of people cared about how you fed your baby. When I said they probably didn’t ‘care’ as such and were being polite/accommodating, you got really angry and said in that case I can’t have anyone supportive in my life so which is it? Do we care about how other people feed their babies or don’t we? Or is it only you that others should care about?

I'll ignore your obtuse tone and say - I don't care WHAT choice they make but I WILL be supportive and caring when they make that choice.

I just don’t find ‘and I don’t care who my comment upsets’ to be supportive or caring though...

How long are you at it op?

I had 8 weeks of total hell with DC1, then it was bliss ..... apart from I demand fed and that was socially awkward. When DC2 came I thought "I have this sorted" but no it was the exact same. I gave up bf within 36 hours (blisters, pain and baby not satisfied) and pumped. Pumping made me feel better about myself but it is so much work.

@Wondermule. Because it's designed to look and feel just like a nipple of course. A little disingenuous, don't you think?

[quote Somethingsnappy]@Wondermule. Because it's designed to look and feel just like a nipple of course. A little disingenuous, don't you think?[/quote]
I don’t think they look like nipples at all, unless your nipples are the size of clothes pegs.

DC1 was a brilliant feeder so it came as a surprise to me when I had DC2 who was terrible . If I had had him first I would have felt that I was doing something wrong and worried constantly. As it was we struggled on. In those days one started weaning at 4 months or three if they were failing to thrive. That bus what happened, he was on solids at 12 weeks and we managed to keep going with the breast until 7 months by which time he was adept with beakers and eating a normal diet with his sibling.DC3 was a bit more demanding than DC1 , ie feeding more frequently and for longer than DC1 , liked comfort sucking etc but was a good breast feeder and kept going for years. I really wish there was less mythology around perfect parenting ,

@Wondermule, they kind of are, just immediately after baby has latched off. It's horrifying...

[quote Somethingsnappy]@Wondermule, they kind of are, just immediately after baby has latched off. It's horrifying... [/quote]
Eek! One of mine went wonky for a while after stopping bfing but thankfully it’s okay now.

@Wondermule, whaaat? It just pointed off in another direction? What was baby doing with it??

[quote Somethingsnappy]@Wondermule, whaaat? It just pointed off in another direction? What was baby doing with it??[/quote]
Yep i think she was positioned too far towards my armpit so she would pull it that way 😳 it did look really weird 😂😂