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Original poster

Students thrown off course for throwing a party.

563 replies

Cotbedy · 07/03/2021 11:37

Basically, a load of students held a party of around 16/17 people. They got reported, they all got a £400 fine, apart from the host who got a £10,000 fine.

Then their Uni kicked them all off their courses for bringing the Uni into disrepute.

I think this is probably a fair and reasonable punishment, but DP thinks the Uni have gone too far and they're being unfair.

I'm curious to hear others' thoughts on the matter! Fair or unreasonable?

OP posts:
Totopoly · 08/03/2021 10:26

@PandemicAtTheDisco

It reminds me a bit of the mums refusing to tell their child off or punish them in any way saying 'aww, but they're only babies' - when their toddlers or preschool age child has dragged another child along by it's hair or knocked them over and stolen the toy they were playing with.
Is it bollocks like that.

The students were fined. That's the penalty for breaking the rules.

If they were bleating about being fined, I would have no sympathy. I don't agree with the rules, but it's clear that this is the penalty for breaking them, and if you take the risk, you have to take the penalty on the chin.

Being chucked out of university (not "uni") is a completely arbitrary second punishment.

If you want a crap parenting comparison: what the university has done is the equivalent of a parent "disciplining" a child by saying: "You're losing all your screen time this month ... and I'm cancelling your birthday party, just for good measure."

NameChangedForThisFeb21 · 08/03/2021 10:30

It’s 100% fair.

I have family who are lecturers and haven’t received their vaccine yet. They go back to face to face teaching at university this week. Why should their lives be put at risk by adults who broke the law? Why should a large scale outbreak be allowed to happen because of a party and jeopardise learning and health? They know the rules and they chose to break them. There are consequences. Tough shit.

NameChangedForThisFeb21 · 08/03/2021 10:31

I’ll add this is a university where half a dozen staff members have already died of Covid. The youngest being 36 Sad. So needless to say a party isn’t going to be looked on kindly!

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

Higher education
Chewingle · 08/03/2021 10:32

* If you want a crap parenting comparison: what the university has done is the equivalent of a parent "disciplining" a child by saying: "You're losing all your screen time this month ... and I'm cancelling your birthday party, just for good measure."*

More like your losing all your screen time forever and then grab their phone and smash it in front of them and lob their x box across the room and go ahead with the birthday party but don’t let them come!

Chewingle · 08/03/2021 10:33

@NameChangedForThisFeb21

I’ll add this is a university where half a dozen staff members have already died of Covid. The youngest being 36 Sad. So needless to say a party isn’t going to be looked on kindly!
What university is that?
changi · 08/03/2021 10:35

If you want a crap parenting comparison: what the university has done is the equivalent of a parent "disciplining" a child by saying: "You're losing all your screen time this month ... and I'm cancelling your birthday party, just for good measure."

More like... "You're losing all your screen time this month ... and because you ignored me the first time and did it again, I'm cancelling your birthday party"*

GCAcademic · 08/03/2021 10:36

Being chucked out of university (not "uni") is a completely arbitrary second punishment.

If you want a crap parenting comparison: what the university has done is the equivalent of a parent "disciplining" a child by saying: "You're losing all your screen time this month ... and I'm cancelling your birthday party, just for good measure."

No, it wasn't a second punishment. It was a punishment for a repeat offence. To continue your crap parenting analogy, you are in favour of continuing to issue a punishment on each occasion that clearly has no deterrent for your child.

GreenlandTheMovie · 08/03/2021 10:36

@GCAcademic

Just out of interest, do people think that repeat offences should simply be tolerated ad infinitum? A party every night of the week followed by a wag of the finger? What about the students who live in the halls who are not happy about living with people who break the law and potentially endanger them? Not all students are fit and healthy 18 year olds, and even if they are, I know a few who are now suffering from long Covid.
The law deals with repeat offenders quite satisfactorily. It's criminal law and doubles the penalty for increased offence.

Why students are seen as such a target in this country I don't know. People seem to hate those trying to obtain an education in a way that they don't even hold professional politicians to.

It snacks too much of an advise of power to me. Someone, probably an overpaid Chancellor looking for the next free PR opportunity, is drunk on their power to ruin a young person's life before it even gets properly started.

GCAcademic · 08/03/2021 10:42

I see you have nothing to say about the students who have to live with this lawbreaking against their will, Greenland. Does the university not have a responsibility to them too?

Sandgrown1970 · 08/03/2021 10:42

It’s not Edge Hill that was mentioned upthread via the bbc link, as my nephew was on the same course as the girl that was fined. The students involved were suspended (from online learning Hmm) and most of the other students felt that was too lenient and not enough of a deterrent. I think there was support amongst students to have them expelled. I’ve been very impressed with how Edge Hill have run things otherwise, they’ve had very low numbers and opened an asymptomatic test centre (and now vaccine centre) very early on. DN was able to get his vaccine as he volunteers at the vaccine centre and was able to get a spare at the end of a day. They also carried on with safe face to face teaching as long as the government allowed, kept the library and other facilities over, provided free food parcels to those self isolating and other support. I can’t fault them. But I am a bit nervous about other students thinking they can get away with a party and still keep their place at university. 18 year olds are not babies.

DenisetheMenace · 08/03/2021 10:42

iwantmysay

The vice chancellor of Portsmouth Uni - Prof Graham Galbraith - earns £323000 pa.
He doesn't have to worry about a student loan. “

Sorry, don’t understand the correlation?
How does that justify the students’ conduct?

Sandgrown1970 · 08/03/2021 10:47

Also, while the football and celebrity analogies don’t work because of their unfair special treatment, there are professions currently where staff DO lose their jobs for breaking the rules. I know quite a few NHS and Care Home staff that were either dismissed or are currently under investigation for their conduct regarding not social distancing and a teacher who lost his job for being seen at a large gathering on social media. It’s not just students. If you put the health of others at risk through your own selfishness, you deserve everything coming at you, I’m afraid.

WhentheDealGoesDown · 08/03/2021 10:50

Hopefully the police that break the rules like those mentioned upthread will get sacked

wanderlnst · 08/03/2021 11:13

Don't have a big adult party at big adult uni if you can't cope with the very adult consequences.

WhentheDealGoesDown · 08/03/2021 11:27

Probably won't make much difference to their careers anyway as the only jobs, degree or not will be in warehouses or delivery.

iwantmysay · 08/03/2021 11:52

@WhentheDealGoesDown

Probably won't make much difference to their careers anyway as the only jobs, degree or not will be in warehouses or delivery.
UK has a huge skills shortage, health, science, engineering, construction, civil engineering, computing - a degree or a decent apprenticeship will be essential.

Expulsion will lead to the very jobs that you suggest, no chance to return to uni as student finance won't be available.

I wonder if those calling for them to expelled would be quite so keen if it were their kids who had been very stupid?
i suspect you'd be the first posting on here moaning about the amount of the fine.

WhentheDealGoesDown · 08/03/2021 12:16

I can't see that any have been expelled, 16 have been suspended, which is not the same

changi · 08/03/2021 13:24

Decisions to permanently exclude students aren't taken lightly. There is a strict process to follow and it takes time. They will also almost certainly have the right to appeal the decision.

Bythemillpond · 08/03/2021 14:03

GCAcademic

Where does it say it was a repeat offence?

It was reported as at least 3 separate incidents by 3 different sets of people

Bythemillpond · 08/03/2021 14:04

I only got half way down the page and found 3 incidents

RainingBatsAndFrogs · 08/03/2021 14:07

In my DC's Uni halls, 22 people share a kitchen / social space.

A £10k fine for a student when adult second homers have flocked to the coast over the last few weekends? And those campers in the Lakes who had to be rescued, during which a rescue team member has been paralysed got fined £200?

Obviouspretzel · 08/03/2021 15:24

@wanderlnst

Don't have a big adult party at big adult uni if you can't cope with the very adult consequences.
The adult consequences are the fine. The other consequences should be nothing to do with it.
SofiaMichelle · 08/03/2021 15:37

@Stirmecrazy

I am continually amazed how we talk about students being adults with responsibilities for their actions and yet we have spent the last year controlling all their actions , where they can live, what they can do , when they can leave campus when they can go...

Where have you been to not have realised the above applied to everyone in the UK?

No one was allowed to travel to second homes, etc, which is essentially what it would be if they were leaving campus to go to another home.

Frubecube · 08/03/2021 15:39

[quote SofiaMichelle]@Stirmecrazy

I am continually amazed how we talk about students being adults with responsibilities for their actions and yet we have spent the last year controlling all their actions , where they can live, what they can do , when they can leave campus when they can go...

Where have you been to not have realised the above applied to everyone in the UK?

No one was allowed to travel to second homes, etc, which is essentially what it would be if they were leaving campus to go to another home.[/quote]
One group of people were, they shouldn't have been charging really if they had the choice between stay stuck in halls you cannot leave, or stay home whilst you fritter thousands on accomodation. It's outrageous really.

ReceptacleForTheRespectable · 08/03/2021 15:40

If you choose to break the law on your university's premises and in a way that compromises your university's duty of care to its other students and employees, and you continue to do so after repeated warnings from your university, you risk being expelled. That's totally foreseeable, and it seems the students were warned repeatedly.

It's not arbitrary - it's pretty obvious why the university can't turn a blind eye to students who are putting their peers and ancillary staff at risk and just leave it to the police to sort out. The university owes a duty of care to the other people affected.

Similarly, if you break the law on your employer's premises, or in circumstances which compromises your employer's duty of care to its clients, you risk losing your job. There are care staff who have been disciplined for breaking Covid rules for precisely this reason.

The consequences of breaking the law often depend on the circumstances in which it is broken. Sometimes actions have multiple consequences - that's how life works.

E.g. If someone loses their licence for speeding and they happen to drive for a living, they'll lose their job. As an accountant, if I were to commit certain types of crime, I would not only face prosecution, but I'd lose my professional registration and job.