Harry and Meghan are expecting their second child

[Standrewsschool]

Wishing them all the best

@ARoseDowntown

Great!

As what about the people without the ability to discern? I mean, if people choose to let themselves be/not be influenced, that’s fine. But what about those who don’t?

Like, for example, young people. Vulnerable people. People who have been through difficulties that leave them susceptible or ripe for influencing from a softly spoken couple who proclaim they speak from experience. Bored people who don’t understand or care about algorithms.

Is it ok for them to be influenced without them knowing it?

For every person that stands up to H&M (mainly MM) being bullied, I want to stand up for those vulnerable people who don’t even know that H&M are exploiting for personal gain...and exploiting those very vulnerabilities! It’s two sides of the same coin. Before anyone says anything, I’m NOT including the hateful racism, pointless and ridiculous predictions about what’s going on in MM’s womb or between his legs . I’m talking about the utter hypocrisy of two people preaching about giving back, about protecting the vulnerable, about safe spaces to speak, about empowering, about being linked not ranked etc when they’re both making money speaking about these things off of the very people they proclaim to serve by being the exact opposite themselves.

You break a leg, you go to the doctor, she fixes you, you pay the doctor for her services.

With H&M, you hear what it’s like to have a leg broken, how terrible it is, how there’s a community of people out there just like you and that you’re not alone, that you have a voice and should use it, when all the while they’re carried around in a palanquin, and are making money out of having you hear them say these things to you. They may give 10% of that money away to a charity, but the other 90% they use to buy a mansion in Montecito etc.

H&M are just an example of the point I’m making. Their model isn’t radically different from the RF’s, and the difference with the Obamas (for example) is that one might get one’s money’s worth from them. It’s all the same though. It’s not about service, because if it were they’d do it for free.

Totally agree with you.

[quote Mummy195]@ARoseDowntown
Your argument completely fell apart when you plucked 90% out of thin air. Where did you get this number? From LadyC ?

I suggest you look at a video made by the Head of WaterCharity, where he simplifies the charity's business strategy. How every penny from the donor goes directly to the affected, and how they sustain the charity workers. He also explains how he used his connections from being a raving, alcoholic, drug addicted clubber to even get the charity off the ground. Perhaps, with an open mind, you will see that there are many ways ppl can give back without taking 90% off, and that will not be your default go to. Frankly, I think assuming this about all the ppl who work hard to make a change is disgustingly insulting to the many who are not in charity for monetary gain - and believe it or not, there are plenty of ppl who are in it because they care.[/quote]
I picked 10% completely at random! I have no idea, and to be honest I’m not sure we ever truly will. Like the RF, I’m expecting their finances to be totally opaque.

As for the rest of your post, why have you extrapolated what I wrote to every person who does charitable work? You might, instead, have extrapolated that perhaps I - like many posters on this forum - am someone who “cares”. I ONLY do pro bono work now, at this stage of my life. I do literally no billable hours any more, and give my time away for free. I even pay my own expenses. So, yes. What you say is correct. “Disgustingly insulting” is extremely wide of the mark.

@ARoseDowntown
So you are happy with ppl going around saying that you are doing your pro bono work at a profit and getting out some random number ? Do you think the poor ppl you are trying to help would somehow benefit from staying away from you due to this reputation of you touted around?

As you said, you have no idea. So how about you stop spreading made up negative rumours, because they sound malicious.

This softly spoken couple might not say the right thing all the time, but they want to help in some way.. Unlike the celeb who is pushing products, pushing looks, pushing botox, pushing an unreachable lifestyle to their followers. They subtly persuade others to act on and to buy based on their recommendations all for money.

I’m afraid I have to disagree with this too, Roussette. Influencers who plug products have to be transparent about that with disclosures. There are laws around this. It’s no different from women selling cars: oh look, it’s Kim Kardashian selling nail varnish.

To me, what M&H are doing is so much worse. You can’t regulate feelings, pass laws against influencing them. But they are honing in on things like mental health and online bullying and making money out of what they’re doing. It’s awful.

Therapists do it, you could reply. But that’s honest and open: you give me an hour’s therapy, here’s £60. As the patient I’ve done my research and chosen you. Easy.

This is more insidious. It’s not so easy for some people not to turn away from the offer of “help”, especially when it appears to be free.

[quote Mummy195]@ARoseDowntown
So you are happy with ppl going around saying that you are doing your pro bono work at a profit and getting out some random number ? Do you think the poor ppl you are trying to help would somehow benefit from staying away from you due to this reputation of you touted around?

As you said, you have no idea. So how about you stop spreading made up negative rumours, because they sound malicious.[/quote]
Are you suggesting that Prince Harry and Meghan Markle, who made no secret of wanting to be financially independent of the public/taxpayer, and didn’t prevent details of their Netflix and Spotify deals becoming public (I have no idea how much, say, David Letterman has made out of Netflix) are making $0.00 out of their endeavours?

Really?

@ARoseDowntown

This softly spoken couple might not say the right thing all the time, but they want to help in some way.. Unlike the celeb who is pushing products, pushing looks, pushing botox, pushing an unreachable lifestyle to their followers. They subtly persuade others to act on and to buy based on their recommendations all for money.

I’m afraid I have to disagree with this too, Roussette. Influencers who plug products have to be transparent about that with disclosures. There are laws around this. It’s no different from women selling cars: oh look, it’s Kim Kardashian selling nail varnish.

To me, what M&H are doing is so much worse. You can’t regulate feelings, pass laws against influencing them. But they are honing in on things like mental health and online bullying and making money out of what they’re doing. It’s awful.

Therapists do it, you could reply. But that’s honest and open: you give me an hour’s therapy, here’s £60. As the patient I’ve done my research and chosen you. Easy.

This is more insidious. It’s not so easy for some people not to turn away from the offer of “help”, especially when it appears to be free.

I should add, I don’t for a second believe either of them are malicious about this. At worst, I think he’s too dim to see it and she is just doing what everyone else does (as though that’s an excuse). They’re hardly going about targeting people, rubbing their hands in glee. And I agree with something you said earlier, they probably do want to do good. In their own way I’m sure they think they are doing just that.

@Roussette

I read your posts Rose. I do think there is not much wrong with a softly spoken couple compared to far far worse out there with some influencers and celebs. This softly spoken couple might not say the right thing all the time, but they want to help in some way..

Softly spoken? Really?

Honestly the mind boggles.

Have you not read their press releases?

I'll defend their right to express themselves as they wish (even if I think it's often to their own detriment personally and that they need some serious PR intervention for their own best interests) but softly spoken they are anything but.

I've no issue with them forging a new life outside the RF.

I actually don't have a problem with them monetising those "former" connections. Even an estimate pre-Netflix worth of £35m isn't going to fund £2m of security costs p.a. for very long - that I agree are needed (royal or not, they are both "targets" and I don't think anyone would wish them ill).

What I do have an issue with is the way that their new endeavours are veiled as charitable/philanthropic when they are not.

Their foundation will make them lots of money whilst donating a small proportion to causes of their choosing.

The fact is their business plan is very much focused on amassing great wealth on the basis of the appearance of "non profit" and I don't think that's very laudable.

@ARoseDowntown
As I said in a previous poster, a Head of charity gives us the breakdown on how everyone who works for the charity is paid without taking anything from the recipients. So, if you pay £5 towards a certain homeless person/ shelter, that person/shelter gets £5. He then explains how everyone else who does the admin, raise funds etc. gets paid without taking a penny from from your £5. This is a well used model, done by a lot of charities. It does not mean that the Head or staff at Charity Water are getting zero. I do a lot of charity work myself, and while I am not paid, others have to be and I can tell you, we don't take a cent from donors.

If you scroll down to the video, he give you the full story of how he started the charity. Infact, I like this because it also debunks the nonsense that H&M have to be IT expects / former presidents/ Heads of fund management/ use royal connections etc. to start a big charity. Around 10 minutes, he gives a brief overview of how funds are distributed. Nothing dim about this.

www.charitywater.org/uk

Is that how every 501(c)(3) operation is run? (It’s not.) Is that even how all British charities are run? Was that the Kids Company model? Is that the BRC’s model?

By declaration, H&M want to be financially independent. They have to earn a living. I’m not saying they’re going to plunder the charitable arm of their venture to pay for private helicopter rides. I’m saying, they as a couple are using their image and name to earn money which they may give away in charitable donations; AND to be “financially independent”.

We hear an awful lot about the foundation, absolutely zip about the rest of it. Which is fine, I actually have no interest in their private finances. There may be laws requiring disclosure, but my interest doesn’t even stretch that far. It’s the pulling of wool over the public’s eyes, insulting their intelligence. All the preaching and lecturing and platforms and voices and empowering and compassion and community. At the very least, don’t say anything. Just get on with it. They only draw attention to the elephant in the room by constantly highlighting their goodness.

Considering the greed and other very shady behaviour of charities such as Oxfam (not the only one though) it's rather faux-naive to go on about H&M.

A bit like searching out ever more convoluted reasons to bash a pregnant mum who not so long ago had a miscarriage, but ignoring other RF members who benefit from the public purse having indulged in indecent behaviour.

Apparently there's an offshoot forum where it's full steam ahead Meghan bashing too.

Such hatred

@DeRigueurMortis you are quoting me as saying 'softly spoken'. It is 'Rose' who said that, not me. I am just repeating what she said. So could you just address that phrase with her please?!

So, you are saying what they are doing is not charitable or philanthropic... so the new roof they jumped to provide at the womens shelter in Texas after last week's storms is what then... charitable I would've said.

And the partnership with World Central Kitchen, they are supporting the build of four community centres in weather stricken places, first one in Dominica after the hurricane, a kitchen during national emergencies, a school and meeting centre in peaceful times.

At least they are doing something and I am averse to criticising anyone who wants to do good with their name or their money.

People wanted them free of the RF financially. They are earning a living. You can't have it all ways, they have to live.

Thanks for replying Rose I really don't agree that it is all totally transparent with influencers and celebrities. It isn't. They are given freebies to tout, surgical procedures are free... look at me now I've lost all this weight type thing. It isn't all declared. I've seen stuff time and time again in the media on this. And then you have those who buy into this aspiring for something they can't afford, can't look like, can't live a similar life.
M&H are not doing anything remotely as bad AFAIC.

I don’t really have a view on them as people. Like all of us they are just trying to do the right thing for their family . I do find the ‘California speak’ hard to take but that’s true of a lot of others in the public eye as well . And as a Charity professional I share many of RoseDowntons concerns about opacity, the sector really does have problems in this area and it does not help if high profile individuals exacerbate this even unintentionally . And I can’t bear whataboutery, of which there does seem to be a lot in the comments about this couple.

Most of all I just worry for them, clearly Harry is fragile and the sad truth is that the more he criticises the press and blames them for all his ills the more vicious they will become .

I see this morning he has given an interview to James Corden blaming the press for the fact that he has left and claiming that he hasn’t left which, bless him, the press will interpret as him having a dig at the Queen which will cause more upset. I just wish they would lie low for a bit and stop doing interviews because it is inevitable that the U.K. press will juxtaposition their sunny life and rides on buses with James Corden with grim lockdown here and Williams chats with NHS workers.

I have just watched Haz's afternoon with James Corden on You Tube and I have to say it is very entertaining and I thoroughly enjoyed it. I even laughed out loud a couple of times.

They don't have to stop anything just because the media will tear them down over anything. They said they will do public service work, why should they stop because of bullies.

@Sparklingbrook
I also enjoyed the interview. With H out of the blue, taking a toilet break, PP closing the laptop sounds typical and sweet of HMQE sending the waffle maker - according to the media she is constantly offended, you would think she does not speak to H. You can just tell he spends a lot of time playing with Archie.

imo its scraping the barrel when you have to start the faux concern about vulnerable people.
it really does show how low people will go to have a dig at them.

I doubt people in rl will think PW is wonderful for visiting some front life staff and then going back to his life of idleness Peaseblossom22.
did think it was good that queenie spoke out about the vaccine though.

For every person that stands up to H&M (mainly MM) being bullied, I want to stand up for those vulnerable people who don’t even know that H&M are exploiting for personal gain...and exploiting those very vulnerabilities!

Who is being exploited, just who ?
And how? They have not even asked for donations from the public!

[quote Mummy195]They don't have to stop anything just because the media will tear them down over anything. They said they will do public service work, why should they stop because of bullies.

@Sparklingbrook
I also enjoyed the interview. With H out of the blue, taking a toilet break, PP closing the laptop sounds typical and sweet of HMQE sending the waffle maker - according to the media she is constantly offended, you would think she does not speak to H. You can just tell he spends a lot of time playing with Archie.

[/quote] The tea trolley And when he poked his head out of the window. All the whining about them aside it was very entertaining. A series would be good. I wonder what Oprah thinks? I think JK asked everything!

As he said, he never ‘left’ the Royal family.
He seems quite battered by it all and he f’king hates the tabloids. I don’t blame him.

Well, I hope Oprah brings out receipts. Ppl tend to have a short memory and underplay what is being said about MM. Hope they talk through all the lies that were reported.

I think they are trying to hash this out now. Set the record straight, and then carry on with their lives - no point in coming back a couple of years later to dig all this up, so I see why they would do this now.

Most of all though, I want everyone named and shamed - but I have a feeling they won't go that far. I know I would.

In the JK thing, he seemed really relaxed. How very dare he.

Samcro with all due respect you know no more about PW than you do about PH . If you think we shouldn’t make assumptions about the private life of PH then the same should be true about PW .

And like it or not that is exactly what the press are doing , it’s not nice or fair and I don’t condone it but it is what will happen.

Loved the JC open air bus footage, I'd seen clips but not the whole thing. Harry came across as just normal and nice to me.
And very natural.

He was great on the James Corden show, he came across really well I thought very down to earth and likeable. He should do more stuff like that.

@PretendSpeedGun

He was great on the James Corden show, he came across really well I thought very down to earth and likeable. He should do more stuff like that.

I thought so too. It seems people don't like 'down to earth and likeable' for some reason though.