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Original poster

Woman thrown out of Sainsbury's for not wearing a mask.

564 replies

Viviennemary · 18/01/2021 10:01

When asked why she wasn't wearing one she told the police they were not allowed to challenge her or ask about her disability. (wrong apparently). She said she'd be taking them to court. Police have criticised ministers for giving conflicting advice. I think it's time this was cleared up. It's far too vague. So seems like people do need some proof of the reasons they can't wear a mask.

OP posts:
LangClegsInSpace · 18/01/2021 21:45

Italy introduced mandatory mask legislation on 4th May. Can you explain what difference you think this has made?

Woman thrown out of Sainsbury's for not wearing a mask.
JamieLeeCurtains · 18/01/2021 21:57

@LangClegsInSpace

Italy introduced mandatory mask legislation on 4th May. Can you explain what difference you think this has made?
So you think masks are unnecessary.

But that's not the law, is it?

You can't have it both ways.

DeeCeeCherry · 18/01/2021 22:04

You want mask exempt to be held to same standard as blue badge, write your MP and ask Parliament to write a new law

I've already emailed my MP and hope others do. The rights of those who don't want to wear a mask do not trump the rights of those who choose to do so for safety in accordance with pandemic/law is the gist of it.

PlanDeRaccordement · 18/01/2021 22:41

@DeeCeeCherry

You want mask exempt to be held to same standard as blue badge, write your MP and ask Parliament to write a new law

I've already emailed my MP and hope others do. The rights of those who don't want to wear a mask do not trump the rights of those who choose to do so for safety in accordance with pandemic/law is the gist of it.

It is not rights of those who don’t want to wear a mask, it is rights of those who cannot wear a mask”. I hope you were accurate in your email to your MP. Because I wouldn’t want your email to be deleted due to overt disability discrimination by implying that disabilities that prevent mask wearing do not exist...
LangClegsInSpace · 19/01/2021 00:22

So you think masks are unnecessary.

But that's not the law, is it?

You can't have it both ways.

This is a straw man. Perhaps I should just leave you to argue amongst yourself Grin

I think masks probably make a small amount of difference and given the shitshow we find ourselves in, it's worth everyone wearing one if they are able to.

I don't believe masks make enough difference to justify all the nastiness and discrimination against people who are unable to wear one.

I am concerned that so many people have become so fixated on masks as the thing that will save us that they have lost track of where the bulk of the risk lies and which measures make the most difference.

I am concerned that the constant, rage-filled fixation on masks is fuelling the fire of the covid-deniers / anti-mask people / conspiracy theorists. These are a mixture of attention seekers and paranoid people. All this does is make the paranoid people more paranoid and gives the attention seekers more attention.

For these reasons I think it would have been much better if we had had a really decent public health campaign around face coverings instead of reaching straight for legislation. This might have been possible back in late spring/summer but it's not now because pretty much everywhere else has made them mandatory.

Given that masks have been made mandatory and there's no easy way back from that now, I'm quite happy with the law as it is, including the exemptions.

When posters come on and say 'In my country there are no exemptions' I can never work out what it is they are so proud of because there's never any evidence that it made any difference. It just makes me think their country has shat on disabled people for no good reason.

Madamfrog · 19/01/2021 00:35

@langclegsinspace

"When posters come on and say 'In my country there are no exemptions' I can never work out what it is they are so proud of"

I don't think anyone is mentioning it as something to be proud of. Someone upthread asked if it was the same abroad as in UK and some of us who live abroad (or are not British) said no, because by and large it isn't the same at all. We just don't have this.
You are free to consider that our various countries have "shat on disabled people", I am free to consider you are wrong. Right now your death-rate from covid is 3x what it is where I live, maybe there is a link.

Lockdownshmockdown · 19/01/2021 00:40

@LangClegsInSpace

Excellent, well-balanced post Smile

LangClegsInSpace · 19/01/2021 01:00

No, loads of people do say it as if it's something to be proud of. It's been going on for months, it crops up on pretty much every mask thread.

I'm well aware that the UK is doing terribly and has been throughout this pandemic. That has little to do with masks and everything to do with our failure to invest in our health service, social care, and in proper public health measures like test and trace and support for people isolating, and with our tendency to do completely everything about a fortnight too late. We were already doing worst back in spring, before any european countries had mask laws.

MercyBooth · 19/01/2021 02:24

People who are exempt from wearing masks are now being treated the same way that the gay community were being treated in the 1980s during the AIDS epidemic.

MercyBooth · 19/01/2021 02:25

And there is this strange thing at play where marginalised groups dont seem to recognise other marginalised groups.

MercyBooth · 19/01/2021 02:29

@DeeCeeCherry Why do you think ableism isnt on a par with racism?

MercyBooth · 19/01/2021 02:30

Two programmes coming up on BBC2 ................Silenced The Hidden Story of Disabled Britain. And Targeted The Truth About Disability Hate Crime.
Could be a chance for people to share their experiences of mask exemption hatred on the Twitter hashtags.

Tavannach · 19/01/2021 06:00

@Sceptre86

Flowers
DeeCeeCherry · 19/01/2021 06:47

It is not rights of those who don’t want to wear a mask, it is rights of those who cannot wear a mask”.
I hope you were accurate in your email to your MP. Because I wouldn’t want your email to be deleted due to overt disability discrimination by implying that disabilities that prevent mask wearing do not exist...

Presumably you won't mind if proof of exemption is required eventually then, will you? After all it's your health at stake as well as others you breathe over.

After all, Covid rates are sky high in UK

trulydelicious · 19/01/2021 08:46

@MercyBooth

People who are exempt from wearing masks are now being treated the same way that the gay community were being treated in the 1980s during the AIDS epidemic

Wrong. It's not those who are exempt. It's those who can wear masks but wont'

Tiramisuzie · 19/01/2021 09:03

I hate wearing a mask. I am claustrophobic and I can't breathe in one. I literally rip it off my face the second I am out the shop. I have to wear one at work for 8-9 hours and I have to go outside to get fresh air as I hyperventilate in it. However, many of you do not have a valid reason for not wearing a mask and you put others at risk. If you have to wear a mask for whatever reason then you should utilise click n collect and your contacts to get your shopping for you.

I don't see why someone's right to wear a mask is more important than my safety when I am at my job, working as a key worker to support the rest of you working from home. Also, you are putting yourself at risk by not wearing one, so why would you want to be hanging out in shops unless you absolutely have to.

MintyMabel · 19/01/2021 09:18

There's no rule to say you have to prove your disability. Some people have PTSD due to rape or violence - why should they have to share that with a stranger?

That's a choice to make. Either be prepared to share your reasons for exemption or don't go.

DD has a very visible disability, she doesn't get to hide it. But even with that, you'd be shocked at how many times we need to share some really personal information in order to have a reasonable adjustment made for her. We make an assessment of whether we think it is worth it or not, if it isn't we don't go. That's just life. We could stand and stamp our feet and whine about our 'uman rights, but life is too short for that shit.

MintyMabel · 19/01/2021 09:20

Right now your death-rate from covid is 3x what it is where I live, maybe there is a link.
But not because some disabled people can't wear masks.

Ihatefish · 19/01/2021 09:33

@LangClegsInSpace

So you think masks are unnecessary.

But that's not the law, is it?

You can't have it both ways.

This is a straw man. Perhaps I should just leave you to argue amongst yourself Grin

I think masks probably make a small amount of difference and given the shitshow we find ourselves in, it's worth everyone wearing one if they are able to.

I don't believe masks make enough difference to justify all the nastiness and discrimination against people who are unable to wear one.

I am concerned that so many people have become so fixated on masks as the thing that will save us that they have lost track of where the bulk of the risk lies and which measures make the most difference.

I am concerned that the constant, rage-filled fixation on masks is fuelling the fire of the covid-deniers / anti-mask people / conspiracy theorists. These are a mixture of attention seekers and paranoid people. All this does is make the paranoid people more paranoid and gives the attention seekers more attention.

For these reasons I think it would have been much better if we had had a really decent public health campaign around face coverings instead of reaching straight for legislation. This might have been possible back in late spring/summer but it's not now because pretty much everywhere else has made them mandatory.

Given that masks have been made mandatory and there's no easy way back from that now, I'm quite happy with the law as it is, including the exemptions.

When posters come on and say 'In my country there are no exemptions' I can never work out what it is they are so proud of because there's never any evidence that it made any difference. It just makes me think their country has shat on disabled people for no good reason.

Excellent post. All I see is hatred for disabled people, many of whom face a battle to get through every day under normal circumstances, countries with largely dire histories of dealing with mental health proud of having no mask exceptions without adequately explaining the ostracisation and pain this has probably caused many as they are forced out of society. What these people are saying is our society is great because we have less visible disabled people. Our country has never had people dying on camp beds in gyms.

I’m heartbroken at the feelings that people have repeatedly shown to people with mental health issues. Personally I’m in a place where I can wear a mask -just and often with extreme distress. But realise this makes me lucky in not having to face bullies in real life. But people’s attitudes to mask wearing and by extension mental health (let’s just lock them all up) has probably set me back several years.

You can see why people predisposed to such things are focusing on conspiracy theories. It’s been played out over and over again in history. In times of change people focus on something. Create divides, the more people can vilify others the more right they feel. It’s so so sad.

DumplingsAndStew · 19/01/2021 09:41

It's admirable that there are some on here who want to defend disability rights, at all costs, but consider that the reason we HAVE TO fight so damn hard is BECAUSE OF women like this. Yet here you are, fighting for her 'right' to behave as she wishes, with no thought or awareness of how it affects others.

This woman is an obvious and known conspiracy theorist, anti-vaxxer, anti-masks, 'MMR-causes-autism' type, and here you are defending her 'rights' when all evidence points towards her being a liar and a troublemaker.

In your attempts to help disabled people and their rights, they're being shat all over.

Ihatefish · 19/01/2021 09:49

@DumplingsAndStew

It's admirable that there are some on here who want to defend disability rights, at all costs, but consider that the reason we HAVE TO fight so damn hard is BECAUSE OF women like this. Yet here you are, fighting for her 'right' to behave as she wishes, with no thought or awareness of how it affects others.

This woman is an obvious and known conspiracy theorist, anti-vaxxer, anti-masks, 'MMR-causes-autism' type, and here you are defending her 'rights' when all evidence points towards her being a liar and a troublemaker.

In your attempts to help disabled people and their rights, they're being shat all over.

Well I’m not defending someone that acts like this but time and time again on this thread people are showing a total lack of empathy towards with disabilities basically saying they’re not fit to mix with society. These people need taking to task and stopping. History shows that such attitudes, if allowed to prevail always lead to serious consequences.
SerendipityJane · 19/01/2021 10:17

[quote Ihatefish]@SerendipityJane pity they’re not doing so well on suicide rates over the past decade. Maybe some countries are more willing to sacrifice people with mental health problems.[/quote]
Why on earth would they bother ?

This is a government that has made it crystal clear that it is not the responsibility of government to protect it's citizens - that's our job.

The figures speak for themselves, I think. Really sixth form debating over masks and whatnot is pretty trivial in the face of the UKs death rate.

Haffiana · 19/01/2021 10:41

Well I’m not defending someone that acts like this but time and time again on this thread people are showing a total lack of empathy towards with disabilities basically saying they’re not fit to mix with society.

No-one has said that. You are turning this into something that it isn't for your own agenda. Why?

bobbojobbo · 19/01/2021 10:43

But not because some disabled people can't wear masks

No, because arsewits are pretending to have disabilites in order to not wear a mask.
Seriously, keep up!

user1497207191 · 19/01/2021 10:43

[quote trulydelicious]@Ihatefish

So all that can happen is someone goes to dr says I have x cos I feel like x dr writes them a note - same result as ordering a lanyard off Amazon

Yes, but it will act as a deterrent. Those who just want to take the piss are unlikely to go to all this trouble, they will just wear a mask[/quote]
Exactly. Even something quick and simple like GP receptionists being authorised to provide a letter when asked, without checking medical history, just checking that they're a registered patient. It would act as a deterrent to the awkward idiots who simply don't want to wear a mask - lots of them simply wouldn't bother going to get the letter. Anything that helps reduce mask non compliance would be a good thing.