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Original poster

Labour friend awful about tories

290 replies

tabicae · 05/11/2020 18:08

NC as probably outing. I have a very close friend who is there for me though everything really and I am for them. We have always avoided politics and have had very different backgrounds. Given what’s been going on recently I’m politics, it’s been hard to avoid the topic.

Whilst I personally have no massive political leaning and can see both sides without coming down massively on either one, she knows that I was brought up in a Tory household and although I have never disclosed who I would vote for, she knows I am on the fence about things and like some Tory polices and some labour. A lot of my childhood was based around things she seems to strongly dislike and is open about...private schools, inheritance, private health, second homes etc.

Anyway..getting to the point. She has become VERY vocal about these things. Slagging off private education and people who went to them (always careful to say ‘there are exceptions’). Being critical of second homes yet happily staying in my parents second homes free of charge for a holiday. And it goes on like that.

She has recently become quite vulgar about tories, calling them and Boris c*nts, etc. I know I feel defensive about this as my dad is a very generous, caring man and he voted for Boris. It feels quite personal.

I’ve noticed that it seems ok on social media and in conversation to being vulgar about tories/anyone who aligns themselves with any Tory policies, yet it is unacceptable to ever do the same if you are a Tory talking about a labour supporter. In fact I am yet to hear a Tory speak so awfully about someone who votes for another party. I feel like her comments are getting in between our friendship and whilst I always knew we differed on this topic it has never ever been an issue between us.

I’m not sure what to say really...maybe she’s always had this view of me and my family and is only now vocalising it? Would you address it?

OP posts:
NameChange84 · 05/11/2020 20:01

Why do I admire people like Mandela? Because he wasn't walking around going 'fuck white people,' he spoke eloquently and passionately and changed the world far more for doing so.

And this. Beautifully put...the aggression is completely uncalled for, dignity and eloquence are completely underrated in our “ME ME ME!!! I TALK THE LOUDEST. HOW INTELLIGENT AND SPECIAL AM I? LOOK I SWEAR AND CAN TALK ANYONE DOWN!” world.

jojomolo · 05/11/2020 20:04

It's self indulgent posturing.

If Labour want to get back into power, they need to persuade some people who have voted Tory to vote Labour instead. They also need to convince some people who have given up voting entirely.

Ranting on about how people who vote Tory have no souls etc is clearly not the act of anyone seriously committed to the project of a parlimentary majority for the left.

chickenyhead · 05/11/2020 20:04

OP stuff who voted what etc it's a big red herring.

She is attacking various fundamentals of your life experience and through doing so she is attacking you.

I think that you either need to tell her that her vitriol is alienating you. If she is your friend, she will rein it in.

Or, you need to distance from her.

However you grew up, whatever your experience, you are you and you have value beyond political nuance.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

Politics
vinoandbrie · 05/11/2020 20:04

I would ditch her, I really couldn’t be doing with that behaviour.

Original poster
tabicae · 05/11/2020 20:05

The poster who asked why I didn’t vote Tory... I don’t earn enough to have the benefits of Tory policies and I think there needs to be more kindness towards people starting out/uni fees etc.

I’m well aware my view could change as my circumstances change and if it does I won’t be calling labour voters cunts.

OP posts:
justicedanceson · 05/11/2020 20:08

I think it’s hard to imagine a government who has done a worse job in living memory, so perhaps I can forgive your friend a bit of ranting to who she thinks is a safe person.
It’s likely she foresaw the disaster of no deal and Boris’ incompetence and seeming indifference to many struggling before COVID struck. So it may be incomprehensible to her how a lovely, kind person could vote conservative knowing he would be in charge?
Honestly, just ask her not to swear and/or change the subject. But her strength of feeling will be high and she may find it hard to “agree to disagree” when the stakes are so high.

Original poster
tabicae · 05/11/2020 20:11

It’s all well and good saying my family voted Tory because they are generous with themselves only...this is simply not true. My family do a lot for charity, behind closed doors, would do almost anything for those around them and back when they had very little money they did all they could do send us to a private school, to their own financial detriment - they gave up a lot to manage. They are not hypocrites, they have lived in very little. What I’m trying to say is that politics is a huge grey area entwined with circumstance and life experience and background at the core. None of this makes someone a cunt. Calling Boris a cunt from Eton is so utterly disgusting and narrow minded and cruel to those students who currently attend that school, surely that is obvious?

I’m going off tangent here but I’m genuinely astonished at the crass, short sighted comments. If you want to discuss politics, rather than the issue in my OP, start a new thread. And perhaps begin your campaign with something other than insults.

OP posts:
Lightsontbut · 05/11/2020 20:12

I think you must be able to see that private education is elitist and therefore to many people problematic. I think you must also be able to see that child poverty has risen under the Tory government and education has suffered numerous cuts etc. etc. So whether or not you agree with your friend's conclusions, surely you can see why she draws them?

So is your issue just that she used the c word to describe Tories? Or is it that she thinks people who vote Tory are uncaring and selfish? If the former, I'd perhaps just ask her not use the c word as you find it offensive. If the latter, if you're able to, I'd share some alternative views with her. If you have any, I'd genuinely be interested as it's always baffled me how anyone can vote for a party which does so little to protect the vulnerable and still look themselves in the eye. Some Tory voters are of course, just psychopaths. But not all so if you can genuinely marry up your dad being 'caring' with voting for a party which seems not to be, perhaps discuss that with your friend. And if she can't discuss it calmly, agree not to talk politics

The comment about not hearing Tory voters speak awfully about others is a bit ridiculous. I'm sure you are aware that it does happen even if you're not heard it yourself.

Original poster
tabicae · 05/11/2020 20:12

If nothing else this thread has made my friend seem rather tame compared to some of those posts!!

OP posts:
Lightsontbut · 05/11/2020 20:13

@tabicae

The poster who asked why I didn’t vote Tory... I don’t earn enough to have the benefits of Tory policies and I think there needs to be more kindness towards people starting out/uni fees etc.

I’m well aware my view could change as my circumstances change and if it does I won’t be calling labour voters cunts.

This seems to be saying that you will vote for whichever party bring the most financial benefit to yourself. That is not generous or caring and if you've been brought up to think that is, something has gone wrong.
MarshaBradyo · 05/11/2020 20:14

I couldn’t be bothered with this either. Too much, too aggressive and juvenile.

Original poster
tabicae · 05/11/2020 20:15

lights that is about the reasons I voted? Not my family?

OP posts:
Original poster
tabicae · 05/11/2020 20:17

And lights I assume everything you do is for the benefit of others and with compassion for everyone else? Voting to protect money you have earned - a key reason people vote Tory - is not something to be embarrassed about. It doesn’t mean someone isn’t caring or compassionate towards others.

OP posts:
Lightsontbut · 05/11/2020 20:17

@tabicae

lights that is about the reasons I voted? Not my family?
Yes, choosing who to vote for just based on what benefits your most is not 'caring'.

Donating to charity, or other deeds does not make up for this kind of self-focused voting.

Lightsontbut · 05/11/2020 20:18

Sorry, mean to add that if you were taught to just focus on your own needs when thinking about how society should be run (as this could suggest) then this is just further ammo for your friend re: selfish Tory attitudes.

Original poster
tabicae · 05/11/2020 20:19

lights I didn’t vote Tory, as I said above.

OP posts:
PersonaNonGarter · 05/11/2020 20:19

Forget party politics for a moment. Whatever happened to "If you can't say anything nice, then don't say anything at all."?

This is really true about relationships in person. Lots of the people on this thread truly believe that they themselves are lovely people while simultaneously calling Tories cunts. They aren’t, but when you are dealing with people convinced of their righteousness like that you sometimes need to just avoid.

Original poster
tabicae · 05/11/2020 20:20

And you’ve avoided my question...are we to assume you do everything for the greater good of others rather than you and your family?

OP posts:
Original poster
tabicae · 05/11/2020 20:20

personal that really sums up the thread unfortunately.

OP posts:
Ohalrightthen · 05/11/2020 20:21

@tabicae

lights that is about the reasons I voted? Not my family?
You were raised by your family though, no? So if your reasons for voting are purely based on your own interests, isn't that selfishness and lack of care for others a reflection on your upbringing?
Lightsontbut · 05/11/2020 20:21

@tabicae

And lights I assume everything you do is for the benefit of others and with compassion for everyone else? Voting to protect money you have earned - a key reason people vote Tory - is not something to be embarrassed about. It doesn’t mean someone isn’t caring or compassionate towards others.
Not everything but I don't make my choices about voting based on what protects my assets in any way. We can agree to disagree but I think voting to protect the money you earned absolutely is something to be embarrassed about. Others will be disadvantaged to protect your advantage. It 100% is uncaring and uncompassionate.

I think maybe you and your friends just have very different values and it's hard for you to hear that she thinks this kind of attitude is wrong.

Original poster
tabicae · 05/11/2020 20:22

ohal I realise I am speaking for myself here but I would expect everyone who knows me well would tell you I am very kind and caring. Maybe they are deluded.

OP posts:
chickenyhead · 05/11/2020 20:23

The existence of private schools is not the issue. Rather it is the fact that all schools aren't providing an equivalent education.

This is not the point of the OP, is it?

Marcelduchamp · 05/11/2020 20:23

Well she's right though. So you can address it but I'd imagine she feels strongly about her views (rightly so the tories are awful) so won't change

Lightsontbut · 05/11/2020 20:24

@tabicae

And you’ve avoided my question...are we to assume you do everything for the greater good of others rather than you and your family?
Not everything, but things which have fundamental and wide-reaching consequences - yes.

For example, I work for the NHS. I do a role which could attract more in private work but I support the NHS entirely and so have chosen to continue there. It's not all about the money for me. For me it's about personal integrity. Obviously that's easier to say if the basics are taken care of so I'm not naive to blindly applying this to everyone but once you have enough, genuinely enough, then you are in a position to make choices and to think about how what you do impacts on others. If you want to.