Soft play situation - who is in the right?

[GlummyMcGlummerson]

Two mums meet at soft play with their 8yo girls - MumA & ChildA, and MumB & ChildB.

The slot is 2.5 hours, and after 2 hours ChildA comes to the adults crying because ChildB isn't playing with her anymore. ChildB approaches the table and MumA says "ChildA is upset because she says you won't play with her." ChildB responds "Yes I just want to play on my own for a bit". MumA says it's not nice to ditch your friend. MumB says that ChildB often gets tired of company and likes to do her own thing sometimes, and she's been taught to speak up if she ever feels like having alone time.

ChildA spends the rest of the session crying while ChildB goes to play on her own. ChildA says to her at the end that she isn't a good friend, which upsets ChildB.

Who was in the right, and should either mum have done anything differently?

@Onceuponatimethen

Op I’ve just read your other posts. See that like me you are a mum of a Child B child.

I have taught my child B type child that in this situation (shortlist play date and no one else for the other child to play with) if my child isn’t in the mood to play with Child A any more then it’s time to go home. If they want to do their own thing then that has to happen at home.

My child had definitely had friendships affected because they want to go off and do their own thing. I feel I’m doing them a favour by teaching them that time to oneself has to happen in a socially appropriate way.

I agree with this you see. My daughter who is 11 now has always been socially reserved and in the days of soft play and in the same scenario she would just come and sit quietly next to me if she’d had enough and needed to recharge her batteries...have a drink or something. Zone out for 10, while the other child(ren) would continue to batter about to their heart’s content. It was never an issue. That’s what most people, including children, do; find a polite escape or wrap it up.

Eg if I’m having coffee with a friend and want time to myself to read my phone or just chill with a hot drink, I go home.

I suspect child B would have been perfectly happy with that option, but it wasn't available to her as she couldn't go home on her own.

ie a break on her own from child A is what i meant

Also, one of my dc is more of a child A, and it is about teaching them to suck it up sometimes (in a nice way!) - basically I wouldn't want another mother persuading their child to play with mine in that situation as I don't think that would do my child A any favours at all, as they need to learn to build friendships and I wouldn't want them to be some kind of charity case. I would be talk to my dc afterwards about whether they'd want another play date with child B too, knowing that child B would get bored and wander off after a bit.

@pictish yes couldn’t agree more. I can relate as an adult as well. When I’ve had enough I’ve had enough and I find a way to sneak off in an acceptable way!

@lottiegarbanzo

I think both DC need to be encouraged to try to see things from others' points of view and to learn to behave with more consideration for others, even if it isn't exactly what they would prefer to do at that moment. Basic socialisation.

Agreed. Unfortunately I think both mothers need to learn this first by the sound of it.

@Onceuponatimethen
As a parent of child, who is more like child A, I do absolutely agree with your approach and thank you for teaching your dc to be empathetic to other children, who are dissimilar to them. So many parents out there unfortunately do not teach their children basic social rules. As I said upthread I never would have acted as this mum did. My dd has had a few friends like this and as she grows older, she is tending to stick with the children more like her, ie those, who never want the party to end. And in turn children more like yours seem to be sticking with children more like them. She is still friends with these children but tends not to hang out with them much.

Mum B is in the right. However they need to consider a shorter play date so that things end in a timely manner so they are considering the feelings of child A. The alternative is child A brings a friend who will play with her throughout the play date

@MoonJelly I agree - I think this is why as a mum I watch like a hawk and when we get to that stage we leave

If Child A spent the last half hour crying the she eay wasn't having fun and her family should have left. Did her mum honestly make her stay for another half hour? I would have given my younger kid 10 minutes more then gone home. And I wouldn't have been impressed with Child B's behaviour but I wouldn't have tried to make her keep playing.

Also it might be worth considering that child A is a bit too posessive and doesn’t allow child B to breathe or do activities independently

Thanks @Mummyoflittledragon - news to me. May come in handy.

If child B is allowed, and indeed encouraged, to state her feelings and say “I don’t want to play with you”, why isn’t it ok for child A to state her feelings and say “you’re not a good friend” ?

If B is actually saying she wants to play on her own, i.e. she doesn't want to play with anyone at all, it isn't a personal attack on A. However, what A said certainly was a personal attack and moreover one borne out of A's inability to occupy herself in a play area for half an hour and a rather entitled expectation that it is the function of the other child to keep her amused.

I have a child B.

In that situation I would have said to child A - B just needs a bit of space to herself sometimes, give her 5 or 10 minutes and she'll play with you again. And then I would have said to B - have 10 mins on your own if you need it and then play with A again.

A felt rejected, B (being only 8) didn't explain it very well, MumA took Umbridge, MumB could have been more explaining/placating to ChildA and made sure ChildB promised to play again in a bit.

A learning opportunity for all.

@MeridianB

Here’s the link. There’s a few of them around.... 360play.co.uk/

@MoonJelly but isn’t that what agreeing to meet up with a friend is? More or less a deal that you will be together for that time?

If the dd was 3 then of course too young to understand that, but at 7-10 I would expect that to be understood

@MoonJelly as I say I have a child B

@GlummyMcGlummerson

It is you who is painting a picture of a child who does as she pleases when she pleases with you on the sidelines encouraging it so I'm not really sure what your eyeroll was about there

I really don't paint that picture. I mentioned a couple of scenarios, please don't extrapolate.

The eye roll was because you began to compare this with other situations that were not anything like the situation today. I find Whatabouttery very dull.

I’m sorry but this is the picture that you are painting, You repeatedly state/suggest that you encourage your daughter to put her feelings/wants first/before anyone else and as she gets older this will turn her into a very selfish person who won’t/doesn’t consider other people at all. In ten years time, you will be back here complaining that she doesn’t consider you or your feelings and you are hurt by this. You need to start teaching your daughter that other peoples feelings matter too.

@TeenPlusTwenties I think that’s a really good way of handling it! Stealing that for my own use with my Child B

I’m also a fully paid up feminist and I think encouraging people to accept other people’s feelings matter isn’t in the least anti-feminist.

If that’s something traditionally women have been better at then we should be trumpeting that and telling the men to get with the kindness programme.

Have just read your updates. Interesting.

I'm raising a little girl in a patriarchal world where girls are socialised from practically the day they're born to be polite and compliant and not to ruffle feathers. I'm trying to counter that and raise a girl who will stick up for herself and own her bodily autonomy.

I understand and agree with you on this. But, in this instance, who was threatening her bodily autonomy? No-one. I would suggest that you are catastrophising - that you would have to be, to link that statement with this situation. Her patience was being tried a little. Those experiences are not in the same category.

Social skills are essential for the formation of friendships and alliances. They are at least as much for the benefit of the person exhibiting them as for the beneficiary of their good manners. In fact I would argue that good manners and social skills are the most valuable skill parents can give their children. They are a superpower.

Like all skills, once you have them, you can choose to use them selectively. If you don't have them, you lack that control and will blow in the wind of others' wants and your own uncontrolled emotions.

Thinking about it, I bet something was said BEFORE the two girls approached the table where the mums were. And you don’t know what that was but I will bet it wasn’t a placid kind “I just want to play on my own” as the op describes.

@strictlysocialdistancing. I agree with you... Child A is being portrayed as a needy nuisance with something wrong with her for assuming that her friend would want to play with her on a playdate. Thus, her concerns and emotions are being minimised while Child B's are being respected. It's quite an unbalanced situation. As a result, if I were Child A's mum, I would avoid playdates with Child B and Child B's mum where possible in future and look for better-suited playmates for my child.

Child B is being brought up as a taker not a giver - she can play with her friends so long as it suits her but abandon them when she's fed up with them even if it makes them feel awkward and unwanted.

@MessAllOver this is exactly what I have said to my child B- if you dump friends when you feel like it then don’t expect them to be there for you. I’ve told her that you don’t get to put people down and pick them up when it suits you and that if she wants to do that she has to accept she may not have those friends, which probably sounds harsh but it has motivated her to make a bit more effort not just to wander off

I think you’re right OP. I wish I wasn’t raised as such a people pleaser, many times I’ve gone along with things that make me unhappy just to keep the peace. I’m trying to change that but it’s hard when it’s been built into you from a young age.

There’s a fine line between being rude and sticking up for yourself and I see nothing wrong with what your DD did. Being rude would’ve been something like “I’m bored of playing with you now, go away and leave me alone” instead, she explained herself that she just needed time on her own.

If posters are saying thats rude then where does it endow the regards you pleasing others at the detriment of you your happiness l? Loads of time I’ve done a run of long shifts at work and when I’ve finally finished and just want to go home and lay on the sofa watching tv and eating all night, I’d get a call from a friend (child A type) saying they’re bored or they need company etc I’ve always said yes as I felt bad and rude for not going. However I’d be totally drained and depressed afterward and wouldn’t actually get to enjoy a peaceful night to myself which would’ve totally restored me. I wish I’d have just been straight with them.

People appreciate honesty too. I do have one friend who will sometimes tell me she just doesn’t feel like going out and socialising today so can we do it another day. I respect her honesty and I know that when we do meet, she actually wants to be there.

Well done OP for setting your daughter up with a strong head

@Tinty

Well if you are Mum A you will obviously wants us to say Child B was wrong and mean. If you are Mum B, you want us to say Child A was wrong and Chold B should be allowed to ditch her friend.

So i will say this, 2.5 hours is probably too long for a soft play session and both parents should have resolved the situation by leaving when the children started falling out.

Child A, needs to learn that if your friend does not want to play for a bit, then she should find other friends for a while or entertain herself and child B should learn that if you go somewhere with someone you should stay with them, and play and it’s not nice to upset your friend.

This

I'm raising a little girl in a patriarchal world where girls are socialised from practically the day they're born to be polite and compliant and not to ruffle feathers. I'm trying to counter that and raise a girl who will stick up for herself and own her bodily autonomy.
I didn't see this when I first posted. I think that you'd be doing your dd more favours to be teaching her normal social skills to be honest. I grew up as a little girl too and in the same world as you but I haven't been affected by patriarchy and being assertive does also require that you take account of how the other people feel, whereas the anti patriarchy mindset doesn't. I think that if you see things the way you do - which is your right - you will come up against awkward situations like this more and more - you may think it is worth it, I don't know. Teaching your dd normal social skills in a balanced way would do her more favours imho.