Strictly same sex couple (Nicola Adams) Not really a homophobe, it's just the mechanics that don't work....

[RumTruffles]

.....NOT MY WORDS. This was a conversation I overheard on Saturday night.

DW and I popped out for dinner for a child free evening. Was having a lovely time, before I unintentionally, but unavoidably tune in to a conversation at the next table.

A couple of brothers (I presume) had taken their mother out for dinner and the subject of Strictly and Nicola Adams came up. I tried hard to ignore, as I could tell this wasn't going to be something I wanted to hear.

One of the brothers, who was incredibly loud, stated that he "doesn't necessarily have an issue with the whole same sex thing but it's just the mechanics that don't work in a show like Strictly". Just the mechanics?! The mum went further and scoffed "Bah! Well the BBC have gone too far! I won't be watching Strictly again. They've lost me". Good riddance as far as I'm concerned. She then went much further and said one of the most disgusting things I'd ever heard "I mean, I was surprised they gave her a medal at the Olympics. It was obvious she was a lesbian even back then", to which all 3 of them mumbled in agreement.

I was about to say something, when the loud brother caught my eye and saw I was seething and he very abruptly steered the topic of conversation to something else.

Wise

I could feel my blood boiling. Do people really think like this?! Still?

I understand I am possibly throwing myself into the lions den somewhat, with the "controversial" strictly debate as I've seen this being discussed on here before a couple of years ago, but honestly, in 2020 are people still thinking that it looks "wrong" to see a couple of the same sex dancing?

The mother of course went to a totally different level of bigoted and is clearly just a horrible person, but it reminded me how this attitude still exists and it's f@#%ing depressing!

That's it really. Please tell me I'm not the only one who finds this attitude depressing as hell!

But I'm sure she could have a male dance partner, if she chose to. You are the only person I've seen suggesting that she can't have one

But she's not having a male partner

Also, I refer you to my previous question to you @Janevaljane

Why does it make sense to only dance with a partner of the opposite sex? That seems to be what you are suggesting

Tonnes (Julian Clary, Russell Grant, Scott Mills off the top of my head) and no.

But she's not having a male partner

But that doesn't mean she can't have one.

I'm just not sure why because she's a lesbian she has to have a female partner. Susan Calman didn't. It seems a bit tokenistic to me. Especially as they clearly can't handle having a male celeb with a male partner.

She doesn't have to have a female partner. It's a choice. Why are you so against choice?

They have had two men dancing together on strictly. Just not one of the celebrities.

She could have done — Susan Calman specifically wanted Kevin.

One reason I can think of to dance with the opposite sex (but it isn't a deal breaker by any means) is that women have a longer leg:torso ratio than men. So if you're 5'5" and wear 2.5" heels, your pelvis will fit nicely with your 5'10" partners'. For same-sex couples to line up your pelvises you have to be a more similar height, which gives a different look in hold to the typical taller lead/shorter follower look. It isn't really a big thing though.

I can totally see why someone would join MN just to ask this important question.

you are dancing with them, not dating them so why do you need same sex partnerships?

You are dancing with them,not dating them, so why would heterosexual people need opposite sex partnerships?!

I don't see why it matters given that it's dance, not sex.
Contestants are differentiated by sex, not sexual orientation

I totally agree with this. I don't understand why on earth her sexuality comes into it.

@Janevaljane

I'm just not sure why because she's a lesbian she has to have a female partner. Susan Calman didn't. It seems a bit tokenistic to me. Especially as they clearly can't handle having a male celeb with a male partner.

I think she asked for a female partner.

And perhaps the men wanted to dance with a woman? Anecdote alert, but one of the more camp male dancers I know says dancing is the only chance he gets to be the more masculine one in a couple!

It would have been interesting to have a girl/girl couple where both were straight. Or my suggestion of a same-sex week (not that we need more theme weeks).

I can't help thinking of Joyce Grenfell's Old Time Dancing song -

I wonder if your restaurant neighbours would have found that equally discusssssting?

There's not supposed to be any hints of sexual attraction in classical sequence, trust me.

Girl/girl couples tend to do extremely in it.

I can always ignore this type of comment as it's pretty ridiculous - I mean the waiter could be gay, the woman's GP, her son - just anybody.

@PolkadotsAndMoonbeams yes to the "mucking about" at socials. I remember my husband and 3 of his groomsmen dancing the man-man-man-man rumba at a competition that was (for once) running ahead of schedule. 2 of the 4 are gay. All 4 danced with women normally (my husband with me). Great entertainment. But not actual competitors.

Also moonbeam, thanks for posting champions of tomorrow vid, proper brought back my childhood, ahhh champs! Though I never did sequence!

I also danced in many girl-girl partnerships growing up, I almost always danced lead as I was tall for my age. I was only about 14 when i got my first boy (and man was that a big deal, it was such a big thing to get a boy partner after dancing girl girl). As someone upthread said, there are sometimes girl girl partnerships that dance equally - like mirrors of each other (especially in Latin) some of them are so in sync with each other the absolutely put mixed couples to shame!

@Spam88 I would love to get rid of the lifts too. Pointless and usually not well executed. But I'm a strictly snob haha.

On a different note, I wonder if Nicolas asked not to be partnered with a man for reasons other than her sexuality, perhaps she's had a bad experience being up close and personal with a man? Maybe she would feel uncomfortable dancing with a man the way some women would feel uncomfortable dancing with a woman, or a man with a man. But she still wanted to have a go?

Though I am 90% sure it's a gimmick sadly! Hope I'm wrong!

Well they sound like unpleasant and ignorant people.

But it's not illegal to be unpleasant or have unpleasant views.

You really don't have to go around 'calling out' people's views you dislike. It's pretty pointless anyway - do you think any 'calling out' ever changed anyone's views?

You come across as wanting to control the world's opinions. Which is pretty unpleasant itself.

do you think any 'calling out' ever changed anyone's views?

Yes.

You come across as wanting to control the world's opinions. Which is pretty unpleasant itself.

So I'm controlling and unpleasant because I am deeply offended by their disgusting views? Ok... 🙄

But by ignoring the comment and dismissing them as bigots - isn’t this one of the reasons trump got voted in? Because no leftie could contemplate such views. However is their point of view that unusual really?

For what it’s worth my view is - on strictly contestants can choose to dance with who they like. And it’s the ability to have a choice that is important.

But op you must get it? It can’t really be that surprising. Lots of people prefer to see hetro pairings in dance. It looks familiar and it reflects their experience of male/female relationships.

You have a right to be offended, they have a right to their views.

I'm surprised by some of the attitudes on this thread; I had thought the world had moved on a bit, but apparently not.

Good on Nicola for aiding visibility and challenging narrow expectations.

Why shouldn't she take the male role? Lesbians (I am one of them) come in all shapes, sizes, persuasions, and yes, some of them are quite happy defining as more masculine, and their partners appreciate them being more masculine too.

And dancing is related to sex, isn't it? I would imagine its present-day form is an evolved and stylised version of a primitive courtship ritual - there is a flavour of sexuality to it. In which case why shouldn't she dance with a member of the sex that she is attracted to? I imagine it will be far more natural to her and likely to enable her to dance to her best abilities compared to dancing with a man.

@suggestionsplease1, I agree.

No, dance partners don't have to be sexually attracted to one another to dance well, but most dances do have sexuality running through them. The Rumba, the Argentine Tango to name two. They're both incredibly passionate and sexual in nature.

I don't believe that all gay dancers should therefore only be partnered with people of the same sex, but by moving in this direction - I.e, Strictly having it's first same sex pairing, it gives out a positive message that it is normal and it can be just as pleasing to watch as a mixed sex couple.

I actually do understand that it may initially look "odd" to some, but I like to think that that's only because it's not really been mainstream viewing before and surely the only way to combat that is to start normalising it by being more inclusive.

This is, to me, what they call progress.

I assumed she wanted to do Strictly without having to wear the ridiculous dresses and heels which seems reasonable to me. Yes, she might be at a disadvantage when it comes to the mechanics of dancing but that’s her choice and she’s not gaining any unfair advantage so the competition is still fair.

I watched her box (on tv) and think she‘s great. Good luck to her.

I think Susan Calman specifically asked for a male partner (Kevin) and Nicola said the opposite , that she’d only do Strictly if she had a female partner. As for being the ‘man’ that’s how I always see her dressed in pictures, in a suit etc. As a PP said she probably prefers that to skimpy dresses and heels. I would hate to wear some of the dresses they’re given. I would’ve thought she’d have been given Janette though as she’s presumably the lightest and tiniest of the female professionals. Janette Is always paired with the tiniest man, presumably to give him a chance of lifting her.
I liked the Dancing on Ice pairing of Matt with the singer H, but they tried H lifting Matt and he couldn’t do it at all so it had to be Matt lifting H. But presumably was tougher than lifting his normal female partners.

Actually the suggestion of not wanting to be in such close quarters with a man is understandable. It would stop me doing strictly (not that they've asked yet!).

And actually, I can understand Nicola wanting to dance the men's part. That makes much more sense to me than 'same sex dance partners because you're gay'.