Help! My children are destroying my home!

[yesiamyesiamokaycallmeback]

I have 4 children ranging in age from 8 to 0. They have absolutely destroyed my home. They rip the wallpaper, pull on the wires for the sky box so they are hanging out, they climb on the doors and have broken three! Three!!!
The carpet stinks, there is pen all over the walls, furniture and carpet. Biro on the sofa. ruined.
They have even broken my wardrobe from climbing in it.
I'm finding it so so so so hard to motivate myself to clean up after them. I dont knoe how to get them to stop wrecking things. It mainly happens when I'm on the toilet (door open shouting 'stop' every single time) or when I'm breastfeeding the baby or putting her to bed for a nap.
I have wanted a new carpet for 2 years but whats the point when my toddler spills every drink on purpose? I want to redecorate the walls but again, what's the point?

I am at my wits end and so is their dad. It is so depressing spending a few hours cleaning on the weekend for the end result to be a dirty, grimy broken home with rips and drips and sticks and I dont know what to do!

Does anyone else's children do this? My mum struggled with us as children (she had 4 too, similar ages) but DH thinks our kids are really bad and apparently he and his siblings (3 with 5 year age gap between 1st and 2nd) never treated their house/ toys badly.

As not to drip feed, we are all squished into a 2 bed flat, it is quite large but obviously too small for us now. We were going to move earlier in the year but Covid threw a spanner or ten into the works and now it looks like we won't be moving for another year at least (more likely 2 or 3).

please no "why did you have children if you only have a flat" I know, but they're here and they are lovely. Just a bit boisterous.

Some practical things like - food & drink only at the table, toddler strapped into a booster seat, take him with you if you go to the toilet.
Older ones - any of those things (getting out pens when I’ve said no, climbing on doors, breaking things) would result in them losing screens. I’d take pocket money/birthday money off them to repair damage too!

Some sports like rugby and football are cheap - £80 a year for rugby round here & footie about £120 for the year.

How old the baby? Can you start to introduce a bottle so you're a bit more available to deal with the toddler? Or just carry on feeding while you're keeping toddler busy?

Agree also with splitting kids up so for example DH takes toddler out and you do something with the older ones like baking.

Can older ones go to GP for a few hours without you & DH to give you chance to tidy up/rest?

They just sound a bit bored and need more to do. I don't think (most) children are naughty for no reason.

@AnoDeLosMuertos I actually brought this up at both of their parents evenings. and their teachers were shocked as they are angels at school.
the 8yo is more difficult to settle and loves running around at school but they have their peers to follow dont they. and at our school if you get to red on the board 2x then the head talks to the parents. that is enough of a deterrent apparently.

I tried it at home, a similar chart on the wall with red and green paper and their photos cut out but it only worked for about 2 weeks before they lost interest.

I do let the elsest make breakfast and help out putting the dishes away which are big boy jobs and he does enjoy making cereal for everyone and shouting 'get to the table everyone!' like a grownup but it hasn't helped with the rest of the day

their dad does loads of baking when he's off work and if they have been good they can join in (he is very strict and won't care if one is crying while the other is mixing- I hate that) but again since covid he has been working more so its just me.

they dont do it for him. only me. I don't know why because he only uses the naughty spot

I know I felt horrible about the fake police but I don't know what else to do! I really don't

natural consequences work best for the older 2, but what is the natural consequences of climbing and breaking the doors? I don't know?

Our friends have 3 kids in a 1.5 bed flat in London and they survived lockdown without it being destroyed. She’s a nursery teacher so she a) kept them really well occupied b) kept them really well exercised c) kept them on a tight leash at home. Flat is tidy, not destroyed, and kids are polite, smart and happy. Delightful to take out. Not immune to the odd toddler tantrum but they are short lived and soon replaced by smiles.

The 8 year old sounds bored out of his mind. You notice a difference in behaviour at your parents but haven't put two and two together?

It's all well and good to say 'don't ask why we've had 4 kids in a two bed flat' but you KNOW it's a huge problem. Is your 8 year old sharing a room with the toddler? You can't really expect this to go on til he's 12?

And he's not even able to play sports. What do you expect him to do? He's got tonnes of energy and he's bored shitless.

I'd get rid of juice, for a start. Water is better for them, especially their teeth, and it is better for the carpet. Jumping on furniture and beds is something I didn't allow, simply because I couldn't afford to replace the furniture, and I didn't want my kids thinking it was OK to jump on other people's furniture when we visited. Your 6 and 8 year olds need more serious consequences for climbing on doors and wardrobes. They are old enough to know better. Tell them if they damage something that is not theirs, you will remove something that they value.... and do it. If they can't be trusted not to sneak pens out of the cupboard, then get something you can put a lock on, and lock away stuff like that. I may not be popular for saying something like this, but they do not sound either just boisterous or lovely. They sound like the sort of children I wouldn't want in my house. And I say that as someone who worked with children for 30 years.

The small space is a huge factor here. And I am presuming no garden (which saved me when mine were little). And the fact that there are 4 of them so young.

Here are some ideas:

• get some good contraception!
• have some clear rules and clear consequences for breaching these
• set some priorities with your OH - e.g. you can cope with a bit of mess, but any deliberately destructive acts are out of order
• order your small space very obsessionally! - so that things that will cause a mess are not in reach
• try very very hard not to shout at them - be clear and slow when telling them what is acceptable - I know it is hard, but children will be intrigued by the sort of response they can initiate and may try it again just for the fun of it.
• remove all things that might cause damage to the home (pens in particular) and allow use of these only when you or your DH are there to supervise.
• get your OH onside and have a clear agreed strategy for dealing with unacceptable behaviour that you stick rigidly to
• take every opportunity you can to reward good behaviour - maybe even a star system for each child with specified rewards
• allocate a day for each child, agreed with your OH so that he looks after the 3 for X hours and you spend time with just one of them - preferably somewhere other than in the flat

I am sure that some of the destructive behaviour results from them being cooped up in such a small place - it is what any lively young animals do when they are cooped up. You see them pacing around at the zoo. Have you looked into the possibility of accommodation with a garden? I used to chuck mine outside whatever the weather when they got a bit too much.

I honestly think you have set yourself a virtually impossible task here! - so forgive yourself when plans go awry.

Good luck!

People keep talking about treats, activities, etc. If the financial situation is that it's delayed what is clearly such a desperately needed move by two or three years then money must be really, really tight. I just don't think it's helpful to the OP to get responses that pretty much say 'have you thought about being richer and having more resources?'

Sushigo has outlined it. Basically it is a visual reward system to build up better behaviour and positive associations. Things like going to bed quietly after a story, sitting at table for a meal, tidying up without arguing etc Count them out at the end of the week and trade for a reward.

If you need them to behave while you feed, make a phone call etc do you give them a choice of what to do or just expect them to occupy themselves will the older two play nicely together?

@Notanotherusernamenow

Our friends have 3 kids in a 1.5 bed flat in London and they survived lockdown without it being destroyed. She’s a nursery teacher so she a) kept them really well occupied b) kept them really well exercised c) kept them on a tight leash at home. Flat is tidy, not destroyed, and kids are polite, smart and happy. Delightful to take out. Not immune to the odd toddler tantrum but they are short lived and soon replaced by smiles.

I bet that's really helped the OP and made her feel loads better. Why can't she just be your friend?

@StellaGib would you really take their money to repair the doors?
my DH wants to take their pocket and birthday money for it but I have said no. I thought it was too far but that was when they broke door number one. there have been 2 more since.

I do think they get bored inside. I don't take away screens as much as I'd like to because it really is the only thing that let's me get the dinner on. I could be stricter but its a punishment for me too.

they can't go to grandparents no, I don't mind going with them but I wouldn't trust them with the children alone. They have already said they would smack them for being naughty.

I am so embarrassed. I don't even let visitors come in anymore because of the state of the house.

we aren't allowed laminate flooring- it's in out tenancy agreement because we are in a flat.

Have you looked at Cubs/Beavers? Only costs us £8 a month, with discount available for those who can't afford that.

@Hardbackwriter

People keep talking about treats, activities, etc. If the financial situation is that it's delayed what is clearly such a desperately needed move by two or three years then money must be really, really tight. I just don't think it's helpful to the OP to get responses that pretty much say 'have you thought about being richer and having more resources?'

Rewards don't have to cost money. In our house you are currently allowed ten minutes extra screen time for 5 marbles. It costs us fractions of pence in electricity and that's it.

Oh you sound exhausted - it must be so hard. I had five in 7 years and it was hard in a five bedroom house with a very big garden in the middle of the countryside!

Does 1:1 attention help? I know it's hard but can you get your DP to look after the others while you take each child out on their own? Maybe just the older two, to start with. Go to a cafe and have a 'serious chat' over milkshake. There's nothing like making a child feel grown up and responsible.

Lock away EVERYTHING that isn't essential. Pens, toys, everything - could they go in a crate to your parents' or into the car? Have as much clear space as possible, no pens or paints or anything extraneous.

Toddler's drinks in a sippy cup or sports drinker. No leaving the table during meals - if you can get the older two be to 'grown up' then this will help.

And what about an extra pair of hands? Not during lockdown, obviously, but a childcare student who would help out at weekends or evenings for a few quid?

And does your DP help out too? The older ones will be taking every opportunity of you being distracted by the baby to run riot. You need more eyes!

I'm sorry this isnt normal.

For all of them to be doing it I think that there really can't be many boundaries in place.

What is their behaviour like at school?

Both mine have ASD and tbh no. They didn't do stuff like that.

It seems to me you have 2 issues.

1. supervision. In a small flat it should be easier to keep an eye on them.

And 2) stimulation. Those kids need to be out each day for hours to burn off energy and keep their brain ticking over. When at home you need to be engaging them too. So they aren't destroying things out of frustration.

I'd actually look to getting something like this, it could be really beneficial in the months coming up. www.amazon.co.uk/Gorilla-Gym-Plastic-Climbing-Swinging/dp/B00FM62YD8/ref=asc_df_B00FM62YD8/?hvlocphy=9046724&linkCode=df0&hvptwo&psc=1&hvnetw=g&hvadid=310620100076&hvpone&hvlocint&hvpos&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl&hvqmt&tag=mumsnetforu03-21&hvtargid=pla-445024147643&hvrand=15797230112146054575

@yesiamyesiamokaycallmeback I would absolutely take their money if they deliberately, repeatedly broke doors. Once is maybe an accident (though I would still go bonkers if mine did that) but the second time they’d be paying for it!
Taking screens - yes, short term it makes your life harder. But longer term they need to know they can’t trash your house.

And yes. Take their money when they destroy stuff.

Accidents are one thing but they need to see real consequences for their actions. And if that means missing out on a treat because something they've trashed needs Paying for then so be it.

Where is your husband in all of this?

What is their diet like?

there is pen all over the walls, furniture and carpet. Biro on the sofa
Why do your children have access to pens in the first place? I would have punished very severely for an incident like this and it wouldn’t have happened again. They certainly wouldn’t have been allowed to have pens again. Sorry but to me this just seems like a lack of discipline.

@Hardbackwriter we do have some savings left so we aren't living paycheck to paycheck but we are trying to build the savings back up after lockdown

do also had to take time off whilst I was recoving from the birth of the baby which was pretty bad. he had to take 6 weeks off rather than the 2 we planned for.

also the banks have stopped all of the 95% mortgages. we are only eligible for an 80-85% mortgage now. so we need to triple or quadruple our savings to be able to afford a house now.

that was a hard pill to swallow. we thankfully hadn't paid for the survey on the house. we were just about to before lockdown. so thankfully we didn't lose out on those fees.

When my seven year old deliberately used his dad’s Paypal account to buy some nonsense to do with a computer game on the TV I told him he had to reimburse his dad with money from his pocket money. He knew it was wrong. Admitted as much. Pretty much confessed straight away (even though his brother also grassed him up 🤭). I’m not sure he completely understood it was stealing, but we had to explain to him that if he did something similar as an adult it would be a criminal offence.

So as a parent it’s really important to give explanations alongside consequences and those consequence have to be appropriate and impactful. We also had to make sure he couldn’t do it again so the laptop was given a password and the PayPal account was given extra security.

In this case the amount was something like £5.99 and he did end up getting it back as we were reimbursed. But 6 months on he still remembers the whole thing and says he will NEVER do it again.

You need to look for ways they can burn off their energy safely in the space you have. Can you get an indoor trampette for example? Or a Gorilla Gym to fit into one of the door frames?

would you really take their money to repair the doors?
my DH wants to take their pocket and birthday money for it but I have said no. I thought it was too far but that was when they broke door number one. there have been 2 more since

Yes, I would in this instance. If it had just been the one door then no I wouldn't, but the fact that there has been three doors and damaged wardrobes means that they think nothing of damaging things by climbing/swinging on them which isn't really acceptable. Next time a door gets broken, when you have 5 minutes of calm, sir down with them and explain that they shouldn't be climbing, and because they did the door was broken and now they will.need to pay to have it repaired (I wouldn't take the full cost, maybe £20 each it they have it - that's an absolute fortune for an 8 and a 6 year old) it's something that will make them stop and think, and also a good life lesson about taking care of their things because they cost money. I honestly don't think that shouting/time outs work as it gives them the attention that they're craving and it also adds to the chaos. The marble jar is a brilliant idea, as is "charging them" for big damages, communicate with them too, make sure they understand why you don't want them to act this way

Your toddler is unfortunately just being a toddler, and will be hugely overwhelmed by your new baby, and toddlers aren't able to communicate their feelings, so you need to be more pre-emtive of their behaviour, so if they run off at meal times, back in a high chair, remove pens/paints anything that can damage your walls and carpets from the house. Possibly give your carpet a good clean and put a big rug down that can be replaced and will protect your carpet. And get the sky man back to sort the wire!!

I know it seems to chaotic, but also try and be kind to yourself too, have a chat with your husband and figure out spending time with your children individually, so you stay home with the baby and the toddler and he takes your older two to the park or swimming or something like that for an hour and vice versa, they'll love that

I’ve had 3 dc and 2 of them would never do this, #3 is a little destroyer. Now aged 5 it’s slightly better but not really. She has ruined so much stuff that survived the other 2. Nice wall paper, bits of furniture, sofas etc etc.
Sometimes she’s just curious what will happen if she does something.
Sometimes it’s part of a game
Sometimes she’s ‘decorating’ stuff eg pritt-stick on the sofa, drawing quite a nice picture of a person on the wallpaper in sharpie.
Maybe it’s partly attention seeking.
We have plenty of space so it’s not that in our case.
She’s also just a fiddler so if a tiny corner of wallpaper is loose she wants to pull at it and see what happens.
It’s so depressing as can be in an instant when your back is turned.
She also has wee’d on the floor very frequently and past the age or stage you would normally expect it

I try to reinforce the message, give consequences, but also just accept that we can make the house nice again when she’s past this stage. We need a new sofa for example but absolutely no point in doing that now.