Honestly, if you're a working mum, do you judge a SAHM?

[SAHMparanoia]

.....or dad!

Hi,

Just that really. Have been a SAHM for a long time (over a decade) and whereas I do like the idea of going back to work - starting my own business maybe at some point, I do definitely feel a lot of pressure and judgements from other women.

I think there probably is an element of internalised judgement too. I often ask myself if it's wrong that I don't contribute anything to the family money pot, but then I obviously contribute in many other ways that my DP doesn't have time for.

If my DP didn't earn good money, I wouldn't be able to choose, so I understand that I am fortunate in that sense, but I do feel a bit like I don't "fit" anywhere now.

I don't know if that's because I genuinely want to get back to work for myself or for others. I get genuinely anxious, borderline embarrassed, when people ask what I do. There have been plenty of times my reply has been met by raised eyebrows and questions such as, "god, aren't you bored?".

I find myself almost excusing and explaining my choice, which I HATE! I shouldn't have to do that. I know I don't have to, but I feel almost cornered sometimes.

So anyway, if you're a working parent, do you look at women like me judge? Or are you also a SAHM and do feel judged?

No!!

I have judged the types of SAHM who have older children and spend their daytimes with personal trainers or playing tennis, drinking coffee inanely and wanging on about their latest home extension or ski holiday.

Because it all just seems so inane and few of them seem genuinely fulfilled. The divorce rate seemed massively high amongst this type too.

I grew up surrounded by SAHMs like this. All my school peers had them. I mean, my boarding school peers had mothers who literally did absolutely nothing.

Thankfully since having my own children I've moved away from the Home Counties and moved down the social ladder a few rungs too where everything is a bit more real. People work, or don't. But generally people are purposeful with their time.

I can’t see an easy way for SAHMs to justify their choices without it sounding offensive to working mums. And I think this is where any (perceived) war comes from. Ultimately, it comes down to personal preference and the wonderful thing about being a woman in this day and age is choice. There doesn’t have to be a justifiable reason outside of that.

This thread seems difficult because “SAHM” appears to cover so many scenarios. It isn’t one particular type of woman who has chosen family over work. Seems there are some women who have given up a career, some that never really had a career in the first place, some forced into it because their job doesn’t pay enough to cover childcare.

However... I found this quite interesting to read! Good question OP. Has it helped?

No judgement - I know I couldn't do it! But, I do get a bit when SAHMs (and by no means do all do this, only a very few) bemoan all the housework they do etc. I work FT (with a lengthy commute on office based days) and also have kids, plus keep the house running so I never quite understand how they don't have enough time. None of my friends are SAHPs so I'm always a bit surprised by anyone my age who does SAH after having a baby. Financially, where we live is pretty expensive (house prices, mortgage repayments) so you'd have to have a partner earning a really very good salary to be able to afford for one parent to stay at home.

1. Small children need to be cared for. This can be done primarily by one parent or split with partner/family/paid childcare to enable them to work. Neither way is superior. Everyone’s needs and circumstances are different. Do what works for your family. Unfortunately our society and economy doesn’t not always make it possible for families to make the choices they would like to. Get angry about this and campaign for change, don’t judge people.

2. I’m a SAHM and I feel confident in my choices but I do feel judged, stereotyped and undervalued by people who don’t take the time to look past this ‘label’. I have a degree and professional qualifications but I couldn’t give a shit about returning to my former career now. I do minimal housework, I have never had my nails done in my life and haven’t been for a run in months. I’m in a secure independent financial position for the long term. I do voluntary work during school hours that I love and feel fulfilled and stimulated by. Would I, my kids or the world be better off if I re-entered paid employment? Do those of you have made sweeping generalisations and said you judge/pity me still do so now? Where do I fit into this ridiculous constructed SAHM vs. WOHM battle?

Where do I fit into this ridiculous constructed SAHM vs. WOHM battle?
This is a really interesting question. As I read your post I wondered the same. Does SAHM have to equal “not in paid employment”? How does volunteering 20 hours a week differ from a woman in paid work for 20 hours a week? Why would the former make you a SAHM but the latter not? I’m musing over it, don’t have the answers! Curious.

I have to admit that I've had a few giggles over this thread - all these people whose colleagues are such fascinating, intellectually stimulating companions.
I must have had bad luck, but I've met an awful lot of smooth-brained, dreary, petty, dull people at work! The type who haven't read a book since leaving school and give daily updates about their cats.

If I want a meeting of minds I have my husband, my family, and my friends.

@littlecatfeet I don’t find office chit chat overly stimulating all of the time but the “fascinating” bit for me is working collaboratively with colleagues.

@littlecatfeet same here! @ReeseWitherfork I feel I get that through my volunteering. We have zoom meetings and everything. Valuing paid work over voluntary or unpaid caring work is definitely a massive thing.

I honestly don't judge any mum for choosing or not choosing a career. But unfortunately I have felt judged plenty of times about being a working mum..

@notaskingforafriend well indeed, I’d think working collaboratively is rewarding in any scenario. Designing a rocket for NASA or organising a village pancake race. Same applies for chit chat and small talk - that can be just as painful whether you’re chatting to someone who you’re being paid to sit next to or to the local drunk on the bus into town.

My colleagues are producers, directors, cinematographers, set designers, pretty interesting peeps. Or I find them so mostly.
Together we put together amazing films and TV. It’s a creative, bonkers, challenging process every single time

Some real hardcore puritans on this thread 😁 life without work is “inane and unfulfilled” wow!

I was sahm for 6 years set up my own business been going 7 years now but the offices I used to work in were full of very dull people (law) the other mothers I met in my sahm period were way better company! All my sahm friends work now I see it as a life stage doesn’t define us

MsT it’s interesting isn’t it though that women are considered ridiculous for finding real purpose and enjoyment in their work but not men.
Whenever there’s discussion on here about giving up work, SAHMs will state that their husbands are hugely ambitious, love being the sole earner, adore their jobs. And that’s apparently as it should be.

MsT it’s interesting isn’t it though that women are considered ridiculous for finding real purpose and enjoyment in their work but not men.
Whenever there’s discussion on here about giving up work, SAHMs will state that their husbands are hugely ambitious, love being the sole earner, adore their jobs. And that’s apparently as it should be

This. Like mens surnames always being nicer and easier to spell, men’s jobs are always better paid, more interesting, with better career prospects. Women are never ambitious or enjoy their jobs.

Funny that. And they say the gender pay gap doesn’t exist. Societal and gender expectations are still alive and well.

Nah Dh and I feel the same we work to live not live to work

I think some of this is what you are use to. My DM and DMil both worked full time after maternity leave as did DSis and DSil. My friends all work full time. I didn’t go to any baby groups so perhaps there were more there who planned on being a SAHM.

I would have missed my career if I’d given it up when DT’s were born. I worked hard with years of study and additional exams and didn’t want to give it up. I would have been bored at home.

I have been one (for 5 years), so I see it as important and hard. I both miss those days and am glad not to be a SAHM too!
I actually try to pull mums up when they say ‘just’ a mum because usually they are family ceo and contributing in all kinds of ways that enable the main earner to succeed.

In terms of meaning, if you don’t have to work it’s totally inconceivable to me that you couldn’t find meaning without paid work. I was a trustee for two charities as a SAHM. I did meaningful work there. I also think parenting your children full time is deeply meaningful (and fricking hard work!). Not everything valuable has a price tag.

No. But i am a single parent so i hate judging. Always somebody who will use judging to make herself feel better. I wish i had more time and more money and sometimes when i hear of housewives going on holiday again i do think 😱 i am working so hard with few rewards. Doesnt make me resentful towards my own friends. Just like for a minute i think wow. How did i end up the one working and the one who cant afford holidays and a car. But it passes because i feel lucky to have a secure job.

MrsT honest question - is that not a bit depressing? Having to do something you don’t love for 8-10 hours a day?

My DC are all adults now at university and one thing I’ve impressed on them is to find a job they seriously enjoy. DH and I both love our jobs (I mean there are those days obviously) and I want that for my DC too more than anything.

Absolutely Notyoung that was the point I was making too.

Certainly I don’t judge. Despite all the media attempts to drum up mummy wars, I seldom meet parents who choose between SAH and WOH on any kind of ideological grounds - usually the decision is made for them because their employer won’t offer hours that fit around childcare, or the cost of childcare would wipe out their salary, or one of their kids has additional needs or long-term illness. Or, on the other side of the equation, the family simply can’t afford to go down to one salary. I work three days a week, not because I have any grand theory that that’s the optimum for child development and bonding, but because the choices were three days versus a potentially 80-hour week which wouldn’t work around childcare (and I’m a single parent).

I've done both and I have the upmost respect for people doing both roles. Both are incredibly hard in their own way and equally both have their own rewards.

@MsTSwift

Some real hardcore puritans on this thread 😁 life without work is “inane and unfulfilled” wow!

I was sahm for 6 years set up my own business been going 7 years now but the offices I used to work in were full of very dull people (law) the other mothers I met in my sahm period were way better company! All my sahm friends work now I see it as a life stage doesn’t define us

It's not about the people I work with (although I happen to like most of my colleagues) it's about actually achieving something with my time. Something beyond life admin and improving my backhand.