Badly behaved children getting all the rewards at school

[magicgoldpot]

This really annoys me and I would appreciate it if any teachers on here could give me an answer as to why this happens.

My ds started reception a few weeks ago and every single day I've collected him the teacher says how well behaved he has been. She's even referred to him as a 'star pupil'.

Ds came home saying Ben ( not real name ) pushed him hard in the back and he fell and grazed his knee and hand. Next day Ben wouldn't do what the teacher said and so the teacher shouted and it scared ds. Other incidents too and not just with Ben.

Anyway, at pick up Ben comes out first and proudly shows his Mum he has 2 stickers, so do a few others. For good listening apparently! Ds comes out and has no stickers but I am told by the teacher he's been amazing today.

This has happened a few times and ds asked me yesterday if he will get a sticker one day. He says Ben always gets one but he's naughty. I told ds do not copy what Ben is doing as that is not the way to get a sticker/ reward. You will get one one day.

So why do teachers reward 'naughty' children for the slightest bit of good behavior, when the children who are always good and follow the rules get nothing?

I’m aware they do, I just don’t think we change the school system to suit judgemental parents and teachers, most of whom will never have encountered the adversity these kids face.

If the behaviour is chaotic and hard for adults to cope with, how much harder is it for the kids involved.

There are other ways of managing behaviour than random stickers. The other DCs think it's unfair and so resent the DC getting them. Counter productive.

How do you expect them to encourage the ‘naughty’ kids to behave if you’re holding them to the same standards as the ‘good’ kids.

My son who has ASD would never have had any reward his entire school life if he had to meet the same standards as the ‘good’ kids. Should he have just had nothing? No motivation, no reward for what may seem like small behaviour to you but is a huge step for him?

My son gets a sticker everyday, simply for eating all his lunch. He is in Y1 and has insulin injections for the total amount of carbohydrates that are in his food. If he didn't eat all his lunch he would go hypo and could collapse and have a seizure.

It's not badly behaved children get all the rewards. Lots of children with medical conditions have to cope with so much, and find daily tasks hard compared to their peers. so an extra sticker/treat here and there shouldn't be
Judged.

All wrong.
I decided to try a bit of reverse psychology on my little swine of a son.
Told him if he could get to end of summer term without a detention which was a term and a half away he would get £100.
Told the other two the same.
He did it.

It's so incredibly frustrating when you think about it, but I always think of this cartoon when someone brings up this scenario.

www.diffen.com/difference/Image:Inclusion.jpg

It's about recognising the little kids who need more help. This boy thinks it's alright to kick, punch, can't sit still, has never been taught how to sit still etc.

Your son is preparing for the world, he has advantages over this child. This boy may have additional needs, a poor home life, impulse control, struggling parents etc. Therefore the teacher needs to make additional efforts to help him overcome things your son has already achieved.

This is nothing personal against your son, give him a treat at the end of each week and teach him that sometimes in life what is perceived as 'fair' is in fact the very opposite.

@Wwwomble

Threads like this make me sad.

My child is a Ben. Even though he has only just started reception here has already been in trouble for hurting other children. The other children don’t want to play with him and I know the parents will think he is naughty and that it is down to bad parenting.

It’s not. He has asd (and probably adhd). He can’t control his emotions, which makes him go way over the top, and he is completely unable to read other people’s emotions and see when they are not enjoying things. He desperately wants friends but can’t make them at all.

We have sought all sorts of help worth parenting him- there is very very little out there. We have even been turned down for more than one parenting course because apparently our parenting is too good. It’s a massive struggle.

Parenting him is far harder than parenting most other children- including his sibling- in virtually every way. You have no idea how it feels to know your child won’t make other through reception without being excluded.

As for the pp who says they understand because their child has aspergers... well that hasn’t been diagnosed for a long time. And frankly that displays a frightening lack of knowledge of asd for such a parent. I mean, my child (for example) speaks, doesn’t have problems with food and sleeps reasonably well. I wouldn’t even dream of suggesting to another parent that such things are down to my superior parenting. IT IS A SPECTRUM. Your child may have better emotional control. My child doesn’t.

The thing is, however hard it is for us, it is so much harder for him.

I am sorry that he hurts other children. I am sorry they are not getting rewards and that makes them feel bad. Not sure why I should feel sorry though, as many of you don’t feel sorry for Ben, and he probably has it much harder.

Sorry to hear this

Shouldn’t your son have his own TA to help him/ other appropriate SEN support?

Appropriate support for SEN is nearly impossible to get, even with a diagnosis, a support plan and good, willing school.

I used to be regularly in charge of the points system and awarding star of the day awards at an activity group. We had to mentor young volunteers and I would get their assistance in awarding points and making the choice.

When points and prizes were given out then I would explain why they'd been given out. Most of the children knew which behaviours and efforts were directly being rewarded. I refused to reward children if they'd refused to join in or been rude. The same children would hugely react to not getting points or prizes themselves and seemed to expect their poor behaviour wouldn't have a consequence.

I had parents contact me about their children being unhappy they hadn't got a prize and they were unhappy with my answer of rewarding only good behaviour. A lot of parents were upset their children were upset and refused to back us up. They would reward/comfort their child with treats because their child had been poorly behaved and was upset not have been rewarded for it.

DS complained about this at the end of reception year. He said was going to start being naughty then be good so he could get a certificate. We had to have a serious chat about that. When I mentioned it to his teacher she said she didn't realise children were that bright .

He never got anything until halfway though year 1. BUT he has never been in trouble (he's at secondary now) and the teachers always like him.

The same children would hugely react to not getting points or prizes themselves and seemed to expect their poor behaviour wouldn't have a consequence.

So, my DD would be unhappy that having tried as hard as she could, she would never be good enough to get a prize. Because she’s always going to have difficulty meeting normal behavioural expectations, she often speaks without realising what she says sounds rude, and struggles with joining in type activities - according to your post she would never get a class prize.

Have to say that the latter part of this thread has been a much more reassuring read- thank you... it’s nice to know there’s folks out there not immediately thinking my child is an “absolute horror”.

Extra support though, sadly no. He will have to fail a lot more first. And whilst that is bad for him, there are children out there with far greater challenges without any proper support. The finding is not there, however good the intentions of the school may be.

@Catchingbabies

How do you expect them to encourage the ‘naughty’ kids to behave if you’re holding them to the same standards as the ‘good’ kids.

My son who has ASD would never have had any reward his entire school life if he had to meet the same standards as the ‘good’ kids. Should he have just had nothing? No motivation, no reward for what may seem like small behaviour to you but is a huge step for him?

Again; nobody resents these kids getting stickers (), they just don't see why other kids should become demotivated by not getting one too, occasionally. What's not to understand? Your son's reward would not be diminished in any way by the quiet little kid beside him also getting one once in a while, rather than flying completely under the radar.

@Jellycatspyjamas

Appropriate support for SEN is nearly impossible to get, even with a diagnosis, a support plan and good, willing school.

Exactly.

My DS has had an ehcp since year 1, autism diagnosed in year 2. School funded as much 1-1 as they could (mainly to cover the time in the afternoons when there was no TA support in the class at all)

It took a lot of fighting and quoting the law to get the 1-1 full time written into his plan. thankfully we have a wonderful school he is now in year 6 and has had full time 1-1 since middle of year 4 and now he is thriving to the point we actually think he may be able to access mainstream for secondary which was a pipe dream a few years back.

@Thisismytimetoshine this is exactly what I’m saying. What is so difficult to understand that quiet well behaved children also need some reward..

I'm a teacher.

If I were always to reward on 'outcome', some children would always get the reward and others never would.

I'm in year 4 and I have a child in my class with autism who is also working at nursery level.

I gave him child the reward at the end of our first full week back because I could see how hard he was trying with his work, with his attitude to learning, with his resilience and with adapting to returning to school. He didn't find it easy and his behaviour wasn't on par with the other children's but some of them could win the award every week without doing anything. This child had really tried. He wanted to make us proud of him.

Why should the child whose default is 'well behaved without even thinking about it' be rewarded for that over him who had tried so hard?

I will always find something to reward those children for too but it will also be an effort rather than outcome based reward - an extra kindness or helpfulness or pushing themselves outside their comfort zone or similar.

I've had plenty of children who always get their maths right and are always well behaved and it always comes so easily to them. And, of course, they also deserve recognition. Sadly, some teachers are so bogged down with so little support (this is my second year of having multiple higher needs children in my class with zero in class TA support, for example) that the naturally bright or well behaved children are sometimes overlooked. It's not right but years of funding cuts mean we are struggling to juggle an increasing number of balls.

Most teachers care very much about all the children in their class. A quiet word might well get the desired outcome but not because we are stupid but because its impossible to be everything all of the time.

“What is so difficult to understand that quiet well behaved children also need some reward.”

Nothing. It’s a fair point. Which could have been made in the OP without any reference to Ben or his issues and without sounding resentful of the very young child with potential special needs or a difficult home life or whatever else. A simple discussion with the teacher about whether X could have some recognition for y or z because they’re feeling a bit demotivated or disappointed would probably have sufficed.

No, the quiet child shouldn’t be overlooked, every child should be valued and celebrated in the class, but in the same way rewarding them wouldn’t diminish rewarding Ben, Ben getting stickers isn’t what’s stopping the quiet child getting a sticker either. Leave Ben out of it, stop being the “quiet under the radar” parent and actually advocate for your child and what they need. I don’t get the impression the OP has even me mentioned this to the teacher yet!

I don’t think anyone wants the quiet child to be overlooked. It doesn’t have to be one or the other.

(Which triangularbubble expressed much better than me)

I've just posted something similar on another thread, but as a teacher it really bothers me that the "quiet middle of the road children" get overlooked and I don't overlook my pupils (though I teach sixth formers).

For the subject I teach, everyone is involved I discussion, there's no special awards as part of my subject (like theres is for PE, maths etc)- it's easy to involve every pupil.

But I see it in other, younger year groups - the high achievers who win the awards, races, matches and trophies get celebrated...and the badly behaved ones get praised when they go a week without punching someone. Look, I understand that many (most) children with behavioural issues need positive reinforcement and incentives to behave, but it breaks my heart for the quiet ones in between those 2 who deserve attention as well. The ones who if you just take a chance to chip the surface away a little you'd find a smart, astute, and keen young person.

So I do worry that the light is being taken away from that group.

Your son will catch on soon enough and understand. Maybe explain to him that children who struggle in class often need to be kept on task and behaving appropriately through rewards. It doesn’t mean he’s not noticed. It’s not personal to him as the rest of the class are in the same boat

Not every child needs or wants attention, some are just happy poddling along.

When i was in primary i attended a group that held outside school hours. Every year the local schools would meet up and we did a quiz.

I attended for 4 years and we won the trophy all those years. We get to find out who answered the most correct questions. Each year i answered the most. I also had the highest attendance each year, i loved the group and gave a lot.

At the final assembly of the year awards were given to P7 children and the trophy was awarded to 2 members of the group.

Our teacher decided the only fair way to decide was to write names on a slip and put them in a hat. P7 was my last chance to win it, even other choldren said i deserved it the most. Yet names were drawn, it went to 1 person who joined months ago and a boy with poor attendance.
I was so upset but i never let it show.

In my secondary they introduced point systems , you'd get points for being on time, doing homework, respecting teachers etc. Points added up went from a free burger ftom Macdonalds to a free period.

Of course the books were only givrn to those that were not achieving academically.

Being well behaved and following rules never gets you extra benefits.

Being well behaved and following rules never gets you extra benefits didyougain nothing from your education at all?

@Itisbetter

Not every child needs or wants attention, some are just happy poddling along.

No but every child's strengths (or weaknesses) deserve to be noticed and more often than not teachers just don't have the time to notice everyone.