Friend called my kid a brat and us bad parents

[Boymom377]

We have a four year old son who can sometimes be a handful. We have very close friends who have a two year old little girl and the two of them often play together pretty well. Every now and again my son will push or do something like that ( not sharing , typical 4 year old behavior). Well the other day son threw something at the little girl. Her father screamed at my son very loudly to the point that he was hysterical. Then started yelling at us that he was out of control and we are bad parents and all sorts of horrible things that his little two year old would never do and he is a better parent and on and on. I am so hurt by this!! Not only that he screamed at my son like that but that he is one of our best friends and should be helpful and understanding not judge mental and mean. It’s not like we don’t discipline my son, we do we do not ignore his behavior but he is strong willed and we are struggling and now I know our best friend thinks our kid is out of control and thinks we are bad parents. Am I wrong here? Does he have a right to yell at my son and us about this?? This isn’t horrible behavior like punching or really hurting her, it’s two toddlers fighting over toys and making messes and not always listening. I’ve been in tears for days over this. I don’t want to hang out with them and have him judging us all the time. I’m having a hard enough time as is. Parenting isn’t easy. I don’t know what to even say to him when I see him. Does he have the right to yell at my kid and yell at us? I feel he was way out of line, am I wrong???

Your friend’s reaction seems way over the top, but perhaps your son lobbing something at his toddler was the straw that broke the camels back. What did you do when your DS did this? Because if you just sat back with a ‘kids will be kids
attitude I would be really annoyed with you too, especially as your DS is much older than the other child and is at the age where he really should have learnt about sharing, not hitting etc. On the other hand if you discipline your DS every time he does wrong, but this man jumped in before you got the chance then he was very much in the wrong and I would expect an apology from him.

I don’t know where @Boymom377 has vanished off to since posting and some of the opening thread does smack of a reverse to me.
But anyway, my view is that physical violence can escalate quite quickly between little ones....aged 4 he’s going to be quite a bit bigger than the 2 year old. A thrown missile can lead to eye damage, stitches etc...you can’t just shrug it off as a bit of rough & tumble OP. The dad sounds like a bit of a twat for ranting, but you need to get your DS under control OP.

Your son shouldn't be throwing things at other children. You need to tackle your sons behaviour. The othervparent may have shouted because he thought his child could have been seriously hurt. If you are ignoring agressive behaviour then of course this is not good parenting.

The OP's son sounds like a normal 4 year old who now needs to be disciplined (in the original sense of the word)
A 4 year old playing with a 2 year old needs an adult constantly supervising.

It is entirely possible the OP's son just threw the object with no cognition it was going to hurt the younger child. It's also, at 4 entirely possible he did it on purpose.

Neither child is to blame. Both parents need to keep a better eye on their children first and foremost and the OP's child now needs to start realising their are consequences to actions. He's old enough to know that.

Can't believe all the posters mitigating for a grown man shouting in a 4 year old's face.

I notice that the man is the parent of a PFB 2 year old girl and you have an older boy. I've seen that a lot from the dads of little girls; they are overly protective of their cute little princesses particularly when the other child is a 'horrible, rough, older boy".

My DS1 was 'a handful' and so I have been there and done that and to anyone saying it's bad parenting etc, my DS2 and DD were both gentle and relatively docile in comparison. So take heart OP. You have done nothing wrong.

And please do not have anything more to do with this abusive parent. In fact, I would ring him and tell him that if he approaches your child ever again you will report him for assault. I would also give him a piece of my mind that he would never forget.

I think it's a good warning sign to get your boy in hand before he gets much worse. It sounds like you feel overwhelmed so why not find some parenting classes (online) or even get some one to one coaching? It's not easy raising well behaved children and like anything you dont just automatically know it.

He shouldn't have shouted but maybe that's how you heard it and it wasn't that. He's protecting his little girl and so his emotions are running high. Don't use that as a deflection to avoid the fact that your son probably needs better boundaries and structure and that you may need to step up as a parent. And if you have a DH he does too.

Oh, goodness.

Can you not remember when your Ds was a toddler and you viewed older children as thugs and hooligans in the playground?

Parents of toddlers are incredibly protective of their Dc around older (but still young) children, as well they might be, as your 4 yo’s behaviour demonstrates.

4 year olds are still young and unpredictable and don’t always know their own strength. But your account suggests that you have not been on it as much as you should have been to demonstrate to your friend that you are playing your part in making sure their much smaller child is safe.

He absolutely should not have yelled like that. But a response to having something thrown at your child can be very visceral.

If you are very good friends you may be able to talk this out. But it will need you to apologise for your 4 year old and a commitment to manage his play when with smaller kids, as well as them acknowledging that the Dad was OTT.

But it’s no bad thing for a 4 yo to know that throwing things at people invokes a very angry and upset reaction. They live in the real world.

OP - if it was me I'd need to take back some control in this situation.
I'd tell the dad how much you value his friendship and enjoy your families and DC hanging out
I'd then tell him that what he did was absolutely unacceptable, and you couldn't tolerate it happening again. If he has a problem with your son's behaviour he needs to tell him CALMLY or better still let you know so you can discipline your son.
I'd then reiterate how much you'd like to stay friends with him, and ask him if this is something he'd like to do.
The only way for this to work is to keep all emotion out of it. Calm calm breathe.
I can understand why you're upset, what happened is horrible. But I have felt like yelling at other people's kids on many occasions, particularly if they hurt my younger child. i didn't yell though, because yelling at other people's kids is never acceptable.

Once my dc came home from school in reception with cuts on his forehead. Another child threw toy car at him. Lucky it wasn't his eyes. I would have been batshit if some child has done that in front of me.

Sounds like the straw that broke the camels back OP, if you’re son has been pushing over his daughter and generally not being very nice for a while but you’ve not done anything about it then I can see why he shouted.

How did you discipline your son for pushing her? A 4 year old pushing a 2 year old isn’t two toddlers fighting, at 4 he is a child.

P.S I am a parent of boys.

4 is not a toddler and I wouldn't say throwing something is normal. Push/shove ok maybe but really if they are used to playing together and sharing?

No he shouldn't have shouted but your child threw something at his?! What did you do in this.

"Every now and again he will do something" - sounds like there is weight behind previous incidents that he may have brushed over and this pushed him over the edge. He reacted badly but if they are close friends maybe think about where this came from overall.

If you really think it was out of nowhere and totally unfounded then yes end the friendship. It feels like there may be more to it and they have some frustrations about you being perceived not to discipline your son when he behaved badly around their toddler (again, yours is not).

**If you describe him as a handful and strong willed, others will certainly see him as destructive or aggressive

I'm going to repeat what someone else said to this comment that it isn't necessarily true. I call my 4 year old a handful and strong willed because she is loud and excitable, and is going through an lovely stage at the moment where she doesn't listen to instructions. However she is extremely well behaved around other people and they often tell me I'm being too strict on her (because she does know how to behave but just seems to only up for me). She is actually the child who is always on the receiving end of being pushed or hit, and it is awful to watch your child having to deal with that.

I stopped contact with one mum, over her DD pushing, hitting and throwing toys at mine. They were both toddlers so it was not the child's behaviour but the no response from the mum. It is really awkward as she lives across the road but I found it too stressful.

Report the dad for assault? Well I suppose OP could do that. I expect the police could do with a laugh and you wouldn't want them to do anything helpful like actually uphold the law!
It's not a police matter.

Screaming at your son and making him cry is unacceptable, I'm not sure I could continue with a friendship after that.
With that said, maybe this should prompt you to look at your son's behaviour and see if your expectations are too low. I have a 4 year old myself, they are not toddlers and should know that they need to be gentle with younger children. Throwing a toy to the ground because you are frustrated with it is normal, throwing something at another child is wrong and deserves a strong reprimand. It's also very telling that you didnt say what he threw.

Never accept behaviour in a 4 year old that you wouldn't accept in a 14 year old. Obviously the penalty will be different but if you do not put in firm boundaries with a 4yr old then you will have much bigger problems when they are 14 and harder to control. Start being really firm. Maybe plan to see these friends without the dc for the next few years.

In fact, I would ring him and tell him that if he approaches your child ever again you will report him for assault

I’m not sure if you lost credibility there or when you got all sneery about pfbs and little princesses.

I stopped contact with two people because of unacceptable behaviour that was never addressed by the parents. It's not the children's behaviour that's the problem is the excuses and defensiveness from the parents that is the major problem IMHO.

Still can’t find an answer to what did he throw. Also what did you do to reprimand him. He is practically school age so he does need a firm response from you. Sounds as if the dad was afraid of injury to his child and your lack of action. Okay, the shouting sounds bad but would have to have a clear picture of what happened before understanding the situation.

Shouting at your son wasn't ok but absolutely sounds like the straw that broke the camel's back.

Your four year old CHILD should not be throwing things at a two year old TODDLER.

There is a difference and if you can't see that then therein lies the problem I'd imagine.

Plus "parenting is hard" is a weird one. Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't. It shouldn't be so hard that it leads to this. Unless there are SN you should be able to administer calm and consistent discipline to stop this behaviour. I don't know that that's hard to do?

If it's out of character for your friend, then it seems like the last straw.

Honestly, I suspect you have to rethink your approach to your DS's behaviour.
I see too many parents going "darling, please don't do that, you know it's wrong and we've talked about this so many times, etc", which achieves nothing.

You need to be strict, with firms "don't do that" and warnings about consequences that you carry through regardless.
Even if it means picking up all his toys and sitting him by your side while the other child plays with them for a few minutes.

Throwing a toy will have been the last of a series of incidents your friend has put up with without you doing much about it.

He will have been worried about his child, and reacted poorly (no doubt), but he will have been thinking it for a long while.

Well I wouldn’t be happy if your 4 year old was throwing items at my 2 year old. He isn’t a toddler and should know better. Sounds like it’s not the first episode of this type of misbehaviour either, so if you fail to address it I don’t blame the father, I wouldn’t want your child around mine either.

Well the other day son threw something at the little girl. Her father screamed at my son very loudly to the point that he was hysterical. Then started yelling at us that he was out of control and we are bad parents and all sorts of horrible things that his little two year old would never do and he is a better parent and on and on.

Despite being wrong, and losing it, it sounds to me like someone has reached breaking point. Has your Child got form for hurting his Child? is your child way out of control? or is he over reacting ? only you can know 🌺

OP you need to be more in control of your child. Whislt screaming at your son is not acceptable - as a good friend - they have seen the situation as a repeat offender vs one off. I suspect this was the tipping point of your childs actions onto a child half his age. As a mother of boys, you need to parent with concern for your sons well being and those of others are interacting with .. otherwise they will soon gain an unshakable reputation of a bully at school. Children need to learn acceptable play with others. Grabbing, pulling clothes, pinching .. I have seen it all... sadly those "boys" have an increasingly lonely childhood at school. I believe you need to take an honest view on this. Good friends/Parents do not naturally scream at another child unprovoked.