How do I stop unintentionally offending my friends?

[ninjaturtle000]

Thoughts please, be as blunt as you like.

I'll try to keep this short but I will give background for context.

I have a small group of close friends who have been in my life for 20+ years. We're the same age. Our lives have all been fairly similar but my financial situation has improved over the last few years, while theirs hasn't and I feel it's starting to cause issues even though I do not discuss money.

So my situation is that I am now a stay at home mother. Before that, I worked FT and in a fairly well paid job for my age and experience (higher rate taxpayer). Before we had the children we saved really hard, sold our starter home and bought a 4 bed family home for quite a good price. It's shot up
in value since (although I expect that will take a hit!). DH has a really good job and earns really well. He works his bum off, and is out of the house 7-7 in normal times (currently WFH). We decided to have two children because we knew we could afford that comfortably.

We don't struggle for money but we are very sensible. We drive old second hand cars, don't holiday abroad, shop at Aldi etc. On the other hand, if I want to buy the children some nice clothes (nothing excessive, places like Frugi etc) then I do and don't worry about it.

In my friendship group we have another sahm with a high earning partner but they have lots and lots of debt and are renting. They have five children and find it tough financially. Another is a nurse, homeowner with three children with an average earning partner, they do ok I think. One is a civil servant, homeowner with three children and another average earning partner, again I think they do ok and the other is a secretary with a low earning partner, own home and four children.

As I said, I don't talk about money. But recently I've had quite a few comments which have been really off, and it's starting to bother me. I don't know if it's something I'm doing, or not.

For example, our group chat the other week one was really suffering with her skin. Asked for skincare recommendations. I sent a photo of what I use, and immediately got comments of "huh well we can't all afford that!" (It's nothing excessive, again, mid range I think it was £18). Didn't think much of it.

I put a photo on FB of my children playing in the sand the other day and got comments about how I let them messy play in expensive clothes (they were from Next) and that I must be made of money.

I went for a socially distanced walk with two of them yesterday and I had a new handbag. I didn't mention it, they did and asked where it was from. Told them Boden and I said I'd got it in the sale reduced from £100 to £30 but they didn't really listen just said how nice it must be to be able to buy leather bags willy nilly especially when I don't work!

We were discussing ordering the children's school uniform the other day as one mum has a child just starting at school. I agreed that is bloody expensive etc. Asked where I got trousers from, I said Next as I find they wash and wear well. Cue shouts of "what a waste of money, nothing wrong with supermarket clothes, don't be such a snob!".

What I haven't told them is that we've recently come into a substantial early inheritance. It's enough that we will be able to buy a significantly bigger house in a nicer area and some land with no problems and that is what we plan to do. Another friend is also moving house (buying a bigger one) and I said that we're moving too (didn't say a word about upsizing etc) and again it started "you can't possibly need a bigger house, your house is huge" (it not, it's just a normal semi) "you've only got two children why do you need more space it's ridiculous think of us all crammed into a three bed" (we don't need extra space per se but it's an investment) .

My figure was also commented on yesterday. I've been carrying 4st of extra weight since I had my children. We've had a tough time of it with health problems with one child and I've been lacking the motivation to sort myself out. Since lockdown I've lost 3 of the 4 stone. Again I didn't mention it, but when I saw them there was a "wow, look at you that's great" followed by "you're going to get so scrawny, how have you managed that don't you eat any more? Are you taking diet pills?" I am still a stone overweight I'm nowhere near scrawny (or even slim!).

Aside from this I have no issue with these friends. We share a lot, we're close and we have been for a very long time. I just seem to offend or annoy them just by living my life quietly. I know there is a difference in our financial situations and I'm mindful of it. I don't show off, I wouldn't dream of suggesting we go to an more expensive place to eat/drink etc. It's always commented on when I buy a drink as I only really like a certain type of red wine (my days of drinking shots are done!) and apparently it's 'posh'. I don't like alcohol much, but I do like a glass of red. Who cares? I'm not bothered how much money my friends do or don't have.

One of the working friends said the other day in our group chat said that sahms need to be careful because we're going to be "screwed when we're old because we'll have no pensions". I agreed it was a risk but said we pay into a pension for me so I wasn't worried and I got back "of course you do, Mrs sensible, I bet you've got life insurance and a will too!" (I have, LI is a condition of the mortgage and surely a will is sensible?!).

Some of our being comfortable is down to pure luck (the early inheritance). Some of it is down to sensible financial decisions, saving hard, not getting into debt and keeping our family small. But I'm constantly being made to feel like I'm doing something wrong.

Am I?

With friends like these and all that! A poster said above life is short and I agree. Why would you want to spend time with people where you're worried what kind of bitchy jibe they're going to come out with if you choose to wear a new bag or whatever. And then having to think about their bitchy comments afterwards?! It's possible to move on if they're making you unhappy. The best friends I ever had were mostly made in my mid thirties.

@Russellbrandshair

Although I do cringe a bit when people make comments about working hard for their money. Most people work hard for their money, it doesn't make well off people more admirable

It has nothing to do with being “admirable” though and everything to do with it not being luck. People implying it’s unfair you have more because you’re “lucky” does sting a bit when you’ve spent 6 years studying hard, racking up huge student debt then working several jobs to get through college only to finally get a well paid job after years of slog and debt and hardship . I’m sorry but that’s not luck, that IS hard work and it doesn’t in any way negate the fact that others also work hard. But it’s not fcking luck either!

But OP is a SAHM, so technically she hadn't worked hard for what she has. Having a rich husband could be seen as luck!

An early inheritance could be too, or not at all depending on circumstances/who died.

@Russellbrandshair

Although I do cringe a bit when people make comments about working hard for their money. Most people work hard for their money, it doesn't make well off people more admirable

It has nothing to do with being “admirable” though and everything to do with it not being luck. People implying it’s unfair you have more because you’re “lucky” does sting a bit when you’ve spent 6 years studying hard, racking up huge student debt then working several jobs to get through college only to finally get a well paid job after years of slog and debt and hardship . I’m sorry but that’s not luck, that IS hard work and it doesn’t in any way negate the fact that others also work hard. But it’s not fcking luck either!

But OP is a SAHM, so technically she hadn't worked hard for what she has. Having a rich husband could be seen as luck!

An early inheritance could be too, or not at all depending on circumstances/who died.

And yes, nurses, care home staff, shop workers etc all work hard for their money - long shifts etc but are not financially rewarded in anything like the same way.

But OP I do think they're all being a bit unfair and it must not feel very nice

Oh dear, the green eyed monster is out in full force here. Even though you are not making any comments on your relative financial situations, they are bitching to you and taking anything that happens in your life as a direct comment on how they should have done things differently.

They are no longer the true friends you believe them to be and you have become the group ‘whipping boy’ as someone commented upthread.

Are you feeling brave? I would put in the group chat when the next meeting is proposed:
“Hi all, sorry but I am going to be taking a back seat for a while. Feeling a little drained and low from all the comments about our finances and my weight loss so need a little time to repair”. If they come back with profuse apologies then maybe something can be rescued from this situation but if it is the bully’s response of “oh it was just banter/can’t you take a joke/don't be so sensitive” then I think its time to end this so called friendship.

Having a rich husband could be seen as luck!

Sounds like the type of bitchy comment op is having to deal with. OP mentioned that she had a good job to begin with so it's not all to do with a 'rich husband'.

´Hard to tell without knowing their tone. Giving them the benefit of doubt, they are just awkward around money and try to be funny to cover it up (and failing).

My vote goes to jealousy, too, though. We have similar problems with DH's childhood friends (well, he does, I went no contact with them ages ago and am loving it). Jealousy doesn't make for a comfortable atmosphere but he chose to continue seeing them because he felt supported by them in tough times.
I, on the other hand, remember the tough times he means a little differently - they did just enough to save face and not look like really crappy friends. And in my opinion only because they generally struggle to make friends (fair enough) and therefore stick to that long-standing friendship group because it is "better than nothing." I would recommend to not fall into that trap

Tell them to stop being dicks or they can do one.

Unfortunately deep attachment doesn’t always mean remaining attached is beneficial.

You’ve all been through so much together but now they are being mildly bullying to you. You’re being scapegoated and criticised. Even if they’ve loved and supported you your whole lives up to this point, you still get to decide a new boundary with people who suddenly feel entitled to criticise and undermine you.

I would try to address the issue with the least attacking person to see if there is a group think going on about you. Try to speak up and fix it - and if it can’t be fixed you’ll need to distance yourself.

It could be that in a few years there is another shift and you can all discuss it again.

@Quirrelsotherface

Having a rich husband could be seen as luck!

Sounds like the type of bitchy comment op is having to deal with. OP mentioned that she had a good job to begin with so it's not all to do with a 'rich husband'.

Why? It's not bitchy to say that.

Is this only since lockdown? Could a part of it be communicating in text/WA etc. The tone is missing so people project their own tone onto messages. I can see that the conversation about pensions and SAHMs could sound very different in different tones, with no emphasis.

"I'm okay, we pay into one for me." in a relieved conversational tone is hugely different from "I'M okay...." in a smug tone. You obviously meant the former, but could they have heard the latter? Similarly, "Mrs Sensible" could be affectionate or mean - everyone is just having to interpret things themselves. Add in people feeling stressed and worn out, especially as nurses or home schooling 5 kids. It's a recipe for grudges and bad feeling.

Not your fault in any way, and they have been mean, no doubt. However, it sounds like you valued their friendship before this, could you encourage more actual face to face chat and when you look hurt by these comments, they'll see it's wrong, it might go back to a human kind of interaction instead of a text one.

How rude of them

We aren’t made of money but my children have some expensive clothes. None of which I’ve purchased myself. They may have been gifts or second hand finds in charity shops.

A frugi T-shirt here can be worn in the sandpit or out whilst egging middy because I have one of those new fangled inventions called a washing machine

Just because it’s a slightly more expensive brand doesn’t mean it’s destroyed by dirt or going through the wash

Funnily enough it comes out the same or better than the cheaper clothes we have

Also - if I wanted to get into it, I’d rather my child have clothes like that than support slave labour with 50p throw away clothes

This definitely screams jealously to me. Some people hate seeing others, especially people close to them, do well.
I've had similar comments and we're not particularly well off. We have to be careful with money and save for ages for treats. We only have one child (not through choice) and that means we have a bit more disposable income. But a lot of times I've been made to feel guilty for having one child and going out to places and having days out. 'It's ok for you, you only got one...' 'nice for some ..we can't afford to go there' 'you go galavanting everywhere '
Thing is, we don't ..we may go for a day out once a month and some of these places are free. These people also have 3+ kids but don't realise we've suffered secondary infertility so in fact Wer not 'lucky' we only got one. I'd start calling them out OP otherwise it will never stop.

Thank you everyone lots to think about. I don't think I am insensitive, I try to be mindful of other people's circumstances but who knows I could have dropped a clanger here and there without realising.

Lockdown has obviously been really difficult for everyone and I guess could have exacerbated things - lots more messaging etc losing context. Plus more financial strain for lots of people.

To respond to a couple of points specifically.

1. I don't have 'a rich husband'. I actually earned more than DH did before I gave up work. He has now far out earned whatever I did back then and it had been through sheer hard work. He earns well, but not excessively! High five figures. That's not to say other professions don't work hard for much less. They do, obviously.

2. I don't work so I haven't earned it. Technically true. But we have our 'huge' house because of the deposit we both saved and from the equity in our first house which we paid for equally. We also paid equally for this house for the first two years. So no, my earnings may not have bought the bag I got the other week. But I have stayed home with our children - one of whom has a disability and needs far more care/time than your average child - put my career on hold (allowing DH to give his career his all and increase his/our earnings) and now volunteer doing office work three days a week at our children's old playgroup while mine are at at school. So it's not like I sit around drinking tea being a lady that lunches all the time.

3 We are lucky to have received an early inheritance, massively so. No one has died, we have relatives that would like to see us and the children use and enjoy the money they intended to leave to us after death while they're still here, they can easily afford it so they've done it. It's life changing money. But they don't know about that, because I haven't told them and don't intend to!

I need to try to find some new people to connect with I think. How to do that when you're 37?! I'm really boring, I don't have any hobbies except walking and reading!

I think I'd reply back to comments eg what do you mean by that, or why do you always comment on my money.weight/purchases etc.
If they fall over them selves apologising then they are real friends and will change their attitude.
If they can't see the issue then you are the group scapegoat and I'd back away.

I agree with @forrestgreen - if one of my friends displayed upset and hurt at a 'bantery joke' I had made at their expense I would be mortified and apologise immediately.

I don't like the way they all seem to have gone this way though - just one with a bit of a chip okay, but all of them? They can't all really think it's okay to make these comments.

You do need to say something.

I would batten down the hatches when they do find out about your house move then. Things really could get nasty!

I am so sorry OP. How old are your children? Could you meet anyone through them eg school or sporting activity?

Your friends don't like you, Op.

We had a huge early inheritance too, OP - my father gave us a 6 figure sum so we could buy a bigger house with loads more space. I prefaced every visit from friends with "My father gave us a huge lump and we've been very lucky"! Thus far they have all been decent and not remotely snipey, thankfully. I'd say that friends generally tell each other such things. Having said that, your friends were being awful well before your inheritance and so it probably isn't worth saying anything!

I've told them we're moving house, and they will be assuming we're off to somewhere similar, maybe a bit bigger. I've always said I'd prefer detached instead of semi so they probably just think we're buying a detached house similar to what we have.

In reality we're going from our normal sized 4 bed semi in a quiet, out of town but decent estate to probably a 5 large bed detached, with a bit of land in one of the nice nearby villages.

Are they good enough friends that you could say 'oh fuck off with all the comments about money, it's getting on my tits' and they would understand, laugh it off and move on?
If they are, then do that. You're not being offensive. If it leads to an open conversation about money and circumstances and how different friends are experiencing different things, then all well and good - if you are friends you can cope with these sorts of conversations.
A friend of ours is looking to buy a house worth five times what mine is, in a gated fucking community, sends her children to private school.
I had a laugh, a gentle piss take but underneath am thrilled for her - the house is absolutely lovely and her children will do very well and it will make them happy as a family which in the end is what we all want for our friends.

In regards to meeting new friends at 37 @ninjaturtle000 - I moved away from where all my friends still live about ten years ago (although I'd moved around a bit before that) and while I'm still very close to my friends from 'home' I now have a great network of new friends where I live now. Mostly made through work and via the kids - making friends with other mums, asking people for coffee, arranging nights out etc. I'm sure you will make some new friends if you broaden your horizons and look outside your current circle, you sound lovely.

It sounds like you've outgrown the friendship because some of them haven't the maturity to deal with the fact people have different lifestyles and make different choices.

Ignore the people saying you shouldn't talk about working hard. Acknowledging that your hard work has played a part in your position doesn't mean you're saying anyone not in your financial position hasn't worked hard, but unfortunately some people have massive chips on their shoulders and look for offence.
Eg. One of my acquaintances thinks it's lucky that DH and I have bought a house in a nice area. They can't seem to see that us choosing to go into a professional career after university Vs going into a lower paid job that would find travelling might have made a difference to our situation 10 years later. They think it's luck that we have savings and obviously nothing to do with the fact we have one modest holiday a year instead of several city breaks a year. They passive aggressively comment on how nice it would be to afford expensive hobbies when they piss the same amount of money away on alcohol and nights out.

People make choices and some find it comforting to bring other people's chociea down than look at the impact of their own choices.

OP you don't have to justify your income or lifestyle to anyone, let alone on here.

@Ellapaella Thanks. I will see if I can connect with some school mums when the children go back. I don't often see them for long (pre-covid, obviously no one has been hanging around recently!) as most of them have to rush off to work and lots I miss as they use breakfast and after school clubs so whilst we're all polite, lots of 'hello, hope you're all well!' in passing type interactions I've not really bonded with anyone. It's a really tiny village school. My children are quite young though so I have a few years left! We do have a school class WhatsApp group (which is surprisingly non dramatic and pleasant) and I rub along nicely with everyone on there so that may be a possibility. I could also get more involved with the actual school, I might meet some nice people there although the stories of crazy PTA mums do terrify me a bit

I might have to have a look into some sort of organised hobby related activity. Book clubs are out really, I like to read what I read for pleasure not have to trudge through books because it's that weeks pick and I've looked locally before, there's not much around here anyway. Maybe something with the walking, sounds boring but there may be some sort of local group I can join in with. Food for thought!