What have you sacrificed to send your children to independent school?

[cheeseismydownfall]

DH and I are considering this for secondary, having made some rushed decisions in difficult circumstances that has led us to being in catchment for a pretty underwhelming secondary school. Eldest is in Y7 and it isn't working out very well for him. Two younger children in Y5 and Y3 - obviously if we go the independent route it will need to be for all three of them.

We've run the numbers and for three children it is a pretty eye-watering number (all the independents locally are £15k+ a year). It is just about affordable but would mean a significant change in lifestyle and much later retirement (we were planning to start winding down in late 50s - it would mean working for another 10 years and would need to stop overpaying on our mortgage).

My biggest worry is that if our circumstances changed we would have very little cushion in terms of taking a drop in income. It is such a massive commitment.

I'd be interested to hear from others that have faced a similar decision. If you can comfortably afford the fees or have children at an amazing state school this probably isn't the thread for you!

I sent my DC to state schools and just let them pick what they wanted to do. My youngest son did karate, tennis,trampolining, tennis, swimming , drum lessons and his main thing was playing for the local football team. Another son was really into drama so did that a couple of times a week plus pottery classes and a few other art activities. My DC joined the local Cubs groups, went to holiday play schemes that did a lot of art and athletics. The drama DC also did some drama summer camps. They did lots of other activities too and also had lots of down time. I was really lucky with my DC as I never had to bag them to do homework they just got in with it in their own way.

nag not bag!

Some sports like swimming and squash can not be done at most state schools due to the lack of facilities.

Also things like pottery and drama.

More languages, and maybe classics.

I asked mine what they'd like to choose. An advantage of doing it out of school is instead of doing a bit of everything, kids can choose and do lots of their favourite. This then develops a genuine personal interest/skill.

@ComeBy in theory, yes In Scotland if you are in catchment you are entitled to a place at your catchment school but, certainly in central Scotland at least, the housebuilding in recent years has outstripped school building and so now you do have the scenario where you may not get your child into the catchment school, primary or High School. It is determined by a list of priorities for children in catchment which, off the top of my head I think is 1. Looked After children, 2. children with SEN, 3. siblings of children already at the school, 4. Children in catchment, by distance from the school. Lots of people in our primary catchment don’t get in some years and are bussed to other schools in the area. It’s hopeless.

@Thornhill58 - why would you do that to your child when you don’t need to just for your principles. What a really horrible thing to do.

Sorry, I wasn't clear, my prev post was in answer to @FrontRowSeat's question about what to do to supplement regular schooling.

As others have said it’s not just the fees it’s the extra costs

The plus smaller sizes not always better facilities but the extra support pupils may need pastoral etc

Another which no one really likes to talk about less disruptive pupils. A pupil that cause a lot of disruption there will be immediate support simply because there is money there and private schools do not have to keep pupils on should a pupil become too disruptive they can be asked to leave but also the parents will have the money to get their child the support they may need

Wouldn’t worry about keeping up you don’t have as much contact with other parents unless you are very involved with the school. Moaning about how poor you are is a competitive sport for many parents and how much you have had to sacrifice it’s nonsense if you can afford to make hat choice you are privileged

The pressure for children to reach a certain standard is immense many do have tutors too

[quote underneaththeash]@Thornhill58 - why would you do that to your child when you don’t need to just for your principles. What a really horrible thing to do.[/quote]
I don't understand this. We could all do anything for our children but choose based on principles we hold.

Only if you think state schools are bad is sending your child to state school a bad thing to do.

From personal experience - not all private schools are equal. And they aren’t all welcoming & fun. I attended 3. Just one of those was a positive experience and the other two were awful.

However (and some people may disagree) - but going private connects you to people who are good to know in the future.

Remember sometimes it’s who you know. Not what you know.

3 children potentially makes it more challenging. I want to do private for mine for secondary as our local state options are pretty poor but won’t start unless we have the fees saved up for one child so we’re not paying for two out of income. Our children are still small but it has shaped our choices (eg me continuing to work, having a long-term savings plan, less spending on holidays and home improvements).

I have no doubt that private gives a great advantage. I was one of those bright children that did well at an average to poor state. I’d say I was lucky- I saw lots of bright peers failing to reach their potential and progression to university remains a problem at the school even now. The school didn’t give me confidence in my abilities though- if anything it pushed that down and pupils didn’t aim high. There are always stories about how someone knew x and they did badly at private school but it belies the statistics and you just need to look at statistics for the professions to see how over-represented private schools are. The reality is though the vast majority of parents will never be in a position to pay for private education.

My parents put my brother and me through boarding school, and told us not to do it unless we could easily afford it, and to ensure we budgeted for all of the extras.

We have four children so private secondary was out of the question for us and although DS1 won a top scholarship to an outstanding prep, we turned it down and have gone state. My eldest 3 are in outstanding grammars where most of the cohort go to Russell Group unis and a good % to Oxford, Cambridge and Ivy League in the US. We spend a considerable sum on extra curricular activities, but it's a lot less than fees x 4!

I would be wary of private school fees in the current climate. If fewer foreign pupils come to UK private schools, fees will increase at an even greater rate than usual....

I am not sure if it has been mentioned but you need to take into account that fees go up by up to 10% each year. Something that could make it unmanageable for you. Good luck with your choice

We looked at an academically rigorous private secondary school for DD. She passed the entrance exam, and in the meantime we applied for a bursary, which unfortunately was turned down.

We took the view that, given that the local comprehensive school was a pretty good one, and that it wasn't worth living a very frugal life to not be able to support DD through university, she would go to the local comprehensive school; And that we would hire tutors if required.

With hindsight it was the best decision, not just financially, but practically. She had a poor maths teacher in year 11 so we hired a maths tutor so that she could keep up. In the end she took maths GCSE 6 months early and achieved an A. She achieved mostly As and As at GCSE and AAA at A level. I don't think she would have done any batter at the private school, and we hadn't had to spend the best part of £100k to get there.

It means that we can now comfortably support DD through university. We pay for her accommodation and she uses her maintenance loan to live on.

What have I sacrificed? My egalitarian principles

Choosing between bigger house, expensive holidays, bigger cars, larger savings pots and school fees is not making "sacrifices" its exercising privilege.

You haven't given much information about this local comp. My own child is at University doing one of the most over subscribed courses (outside of Oxford and Cambridge) in the country. She achieved this, without any additional tutoring at any point in her school career, at a London comp with a very high proportion of students on free school meals, majority BAME school population, a campus that was a building site for much of her time there. And she honestly loved it! She has friends at Oxford, Cambridge, Bristol, Manchester, Newcastle, Leeds, Cardiff - practically every University you could name. And friends who are doing nursing degrees, midwifery, fashion, all sorts.

I think private school "types" really have no idea what is possible in an average comprehensive school.

I went (good) local state and intended same for DC. I moved them after Y2 and I don't regret it for a second. What we get:

• no more bullying and daily violence (this was in a terribly sweet "nurturing" school, that translated as "unable to deal with actual problems")
• smaller, calmer classes (so the academic progress has rocketed for my DC)
• a motivated class (they all want to be there and learn)
• a wider curriculum with more specialist teachers

What I sacrificed:

• I budget, hard, to set aside the amount per month a term ahead (so

I always have the next term's fees ready)

• we save up for celebrations / events and do them creatively
• we drive a perfectly good but older car

On top of that I took out insurance to the level of school fees to 18, in the event I lost my job or became too unwell to work. Hopefully I'll never need it, but I'm glad to have the security in the back of my mind.

For us the reasons are neither educational (in terms of exam grades) nor social (in terms of rubbing shoulders with the right people), but more about the day to day experience. It's about being in a coed but academic environment (no local state options provided this). It's about subject choice (Latin, German etc taught by specialists in large and well valued departments). It's about an almost total lack of behavioural problems and disruption following a primary school career full of them. It's about the opportunity to play in numerous orchestras and ensembles and perform very regularly, even when you're not a 'star' musician - or to do several hours of sport a week and play regular competitive matches even when you're on the E team. And it's about teachers who have adequate time and resources - to run extra curricular clubs, to chat in free periods, to not be under such pressure of sheer student numbers and exam grade pressure that they have a proper degree of time and headspace.

The reason we can afford it is that our lifestyle is very different to that of our generally much wealthier friends. I work full time, they SAH. We drive a perfectly functional but totally unfashionable estate, they drive Range Rovers and SUVs. Our Saturday night is usually a film on Netflix or a game of Scrabble, theirs is dinner and drinks with friends in a nice restaurant. We still live in the same modest house we've lived in for years and haven't done any work on unless something breaks, they have mostly either spent a fortune on 'forever houses' (hate the phrase but you'll know what I mean) or have extensively renovated their existing houses. We do like to travel a bit, but it tends to be self catering and hiking, not Disney or skiing or 5 star resorts.

But the important thing is that this lifestyle difference isn't a sacrifice - we would live the same way anyway. We might spend a bit more on holidays or the house if we weren't paying fees, I suppose, but I certainly don't see the way we live as a 'sacrifice'. It's not that education matters more to us than our friends - it's just that other things matter much less to us than them. If we had to make real sacrifices to pay fees, we wouldn't do it.

Yes some of us do Chicchicchicchiclana

I’m well aware the best state schools in my area have a very small catchment area and another a selection process that strangely enough many from ds prep now attend

Oh and his school has a high number of BAME students too

Thank you everyone for your continued insight, it is really helpful.

One of the issues we have is that we live quite rurally and it isn't easy to supplement the extra curricular stuff out of school. Middle DC loves art and design and is definitely quite able, but there just aren't the classes or clubs available for her to pursue this outside of school (other than what we can provide her with at home). None of them particularly enjoy the traditional sports (rugby, football, netball etc) which is all that is on offer locally, both at the state schools and out of school clubs. The independent schools offer a much, much broader range of activities and more opportunity for them to find their thing, I think.

That said, both the possible independent schools are heavy on traditional sports which wouldn't be a particularly great fit for them.

I really appreciate everyone's views but it isn't hugely helpful to hear from people who are happily avoiding paying fees because their children are in outstanding grammars. This isn't an option for us so it doesn't help to have it pointed out. The options we have are:

1. stick with our not awful but average state school and supplement with tuition

2. move yet again to enable the younger two to get into a better performing state school (and possibly also supplement with tuition) but potentially leaving the eldest with a crap journey to get to his old school

3. make significant financial sacrifices to send all three to one of the local independent schools (which possibly aren't an ideal fit for them either, but as I said we live rurally and the range of options just isn't the same as you would have in a city).

Other info - moving into catchment for the better school would definitely mean a smaller house or a house in a worse area. Our current house is in a very good location and we love it, but the other school is in a more popular area because of better transport links etc.

One PP suggested moving so the younger two could go to the better state, and just move the eldest to private. It is a possibility but I feel the different would be too great to justify treating them so differently when there is no other factor (SN, outstanding ability etc) that could account for the decision.

A few PPs have mentioned fee increases - when we ran the numbers we allowed for 5% a year. More than this would obviously be very difficult. And £45K a year is conservative - at the 'peak' years we would be looking at £60-70K a year out of taxed, earned income.

I think the examples of how schools have responded to being shutdown during Covid-19 is a good example.
Although DS was A-level year, for him not so important, but the school still laid on a lot of extra teaching and 'enrichment' courses.
For other years, without national exams, they have had a full timetable of online lessons every day.
I don't know of any state schools that have been able to offer that.

DS's school is a well-regarded but not posh, rural independent school. He has a very wide variety of friends with very different social backgrounds. There is no sense of snobbery at all. Some live on housing estates, very few on country estates. Some in small cottages, others in rambling farmhouses. Quite a lot of military, GPs etc.

Everyone gets along great.

@C8H10N4O2, I do recognise this. I know that most of these things are not 'sacrifices' in any way.

We don't have a particularly lavish lifestyle. We do have a nice home, but we drive old cars that we bought outright and will run into the ground. We have travelled a lot (as expats) but our recent holidays have been simple UK self catering breaks with lots of walking. We don't spend money on expensive days/nights out etc. We are/would be very, very happy with the kind of lifestyle @noxestdormienda describes.

The only real 'sacrifice' in question is financial security I guess - our retirement, and the ability to help our children later in life with university fees and getting settled in their lives. And the anxiety that would come with knowing how stretched we are. And that is a very real worry.

I would be interested to hear what jobs their child ended up doing after going to private school? The people I have come across that attended private schools are a few nurses. I’d be a bit miffed if my child went to private school to become a nurse at the end of paying for school fees.

@UntamedWisteria, yes, the night-and-day difference of the provision from our schools vs friends with kids in independent schools has definitely bought into sharp focus the massive differences between what they offer.

@Thornhill58

Our son goes to a in need of improvement secondary. We can afford to send him to private school but we won't. He has made brilliant local friends. People of different backgrounds and all round brilliant kids. He'll be going to year 10 in September. We pay towards tutors if he needs help, karate and private piano lessons. We find that better than private school. Also keeps him humble as most of his friends aren't well off. Some are on free schools meals so he never talks about the things that he has. He is very aware and appreciates that not everyone lives like we do.

That’s so lovely to read.