Help explain non-gendered clothes to DM & MIL?

[NewbieMumma]

Please can someone help me and DH formulate a neat phrase to explain to my mother and my MIL why my DH and I do not want gendered gifts and clothes for our new baby? We don't know the gender yet (due in a couple of days) and we have bought gender neutral baby grows and things. We want to maintain this once the baby is here, and not dress them in overtly blue dinosaurs or pink hearts, and slogans etc. This is all in line with our views and how we try to carry out our roles at home. Both MIL and DM are very old fashioned and were very 1950's style wives and mothers, which was their choice but not the way we live.

As generous as it is of the GPs to want to buy the baby clothes, we tried to casually say "nothing too gendered please" mainly so that it wasn't a waste of their money. However we have been met with constant resistance and questions. Eg "surely once you know the sex you'll be buying blue / pink"? "What if they are a girly girl" etc etc, "what is he loves trucks"? "It's so sad / cruel" etc!

I find it so time consuming to explain why I don't want to dress my child in "daddy's little princess" type stuff which only promotes gender role stereotypes in a tiny child who has no inclination towards any of this and no knowledge of patriarchy at first. I know there's only so much we can do and it won't be long before we start to see our child influenced by the patriarchal society is is immersed in, but I think it's reasonable for us to do what we can to balance the scales a little bit whilst the child is in their home environment, through books, toys, clothes, critical thinking and choice of language etc etc.

My mother and MIL just can't get it and say that we will struggle as the shops only sell girls clothes and boys clothes. DH answers his mum's comments with sensible rational reasons why our choice makes sense and tries to get her head around the concept, but she keeps on asking, or texting us photos of "cute" clothes, eg pink tutu dresses. We are also choosing not to dress the baby in "outfits" (dresses, jeans etc) mainly due to simplicity, and she's also questioning that alongside.

Anyway, does anyone have any ideas about something quick we can say that explains our pov and helps us make our point? Or do we just give up trying to explain?

I know I'm very probably way over thinking (tired and hormonal) and should just say a firm "that's our choice", but it irks me that they are trying to cajole us and that at this rate we will be gifted a bunch of stuff we don't want to give to our baby.

OP I am with you. My parents tried to be very gender neutral (even back in the 70s)
It worked somewhat, I wore largely my older brothers clothes up until i went to school and came home on day 1 wanting to be a princess :-)

BUT I still think it was worth doing, and I would say that my parents clear lack of interest in encouraging me to be overtly girly has helped shape me into the well rounded woman I am (turns out i AM quite girly, but I got to discover that for myself)

So if the MIL etc push:

a) don't overexplain, just say that you will be happy to go with your kid's feelings when they are older, but don't want to push anything on them from the outset.

b) Suggest (and send links) to some traditional 'granny friendly' cutesy stuff with animals, balloons etc (soft baby blanket, nursery decor, keepsake etc? make a big deal of it like it's the focus/special thing in the nursery)

c) Going forwards say 'he/she really seems to like his/her lion/tiger/elephant'. Give them a cute jungle animal or similar to work with and focus their purchasing on.

The above has work for us. Good luck!

There's nothing gender neutral about beige. Likewise, pink is just a colour. It just so happens that as one of the first posters on this thread pointed out, no matter how 'gender neutral' you are, you'll find that your children will gravitate towards things they like! You'd be an idiot for forbidding your dd for e.g. to dress in a little frilly dress if that's what she so desires. Likewise, if young Billy-Bob fancies Thomas the tank engine, you're an idiot for forcing him into the beige section.

Seriously? Just how old do you think these women are, 103? my mother was a 1960s 'housewife' and I wore wee corduroys and jumpers.

My dc were reared by a childminder who hadn't time to be gender neutral or otherwise. She was dressed in whatever was clean at the time from childminder's elder siblings. Some were pink, some were blue, some were a colour at some point but bore no resemblance to said colour now. My dd naturally LOVED and I mean LOVED getting into frilly dresses (which I loathed as a child - a female child). I hated being dressed up like a doll and not being allowed to muck about like the boys 'in case I got dirt on my dress'. I fucking loathed those prickly frilly things. Now? I'm the most 'dolly' woman I know. Heels, fashion, skirts, dresses - I'm all in it.

Gender neutral shite is pure bollocks.

Wait until the child hits two and just be grateful they put clothes on.

OP I feel very much like you and have always dressed my kids in neutral clothing. When they are old enough to pick their own you may find that they gravitate towards blue or pink or trucks or princesses.

With my oldest my Mum was overjoyed when she found out she was a she and went out and brought lots of pink. I remember arguing with her about it and many conversations about it.

With my youngest, now 2, who now has one remaining grandparent, I pick my battles more carefully. It's not worth it.

Explain your views. It likely won't make a blind bit of difference. Dress the child in the clothes for a photo or when Grandma is coming round for lunch and dress them your way the rest of the time.

plus I guarantee you that when you grab a spare change of babygrows or pjs at 3am for a baby or a child covered in sick, you won't give a monkey about the crushing patriarchy and gender enslavement. Even if your boy ends up with the unrealistic image of a Barbie doll on his back.

Don't worry. You've told them. If they choose not to listen just don't dress the baby in those clothes. I do think you might find yourself relaxing in time tho

@Tootletum that's a really nice shop, thank you

@veggiesausages thanks for your balanced response

@JaniceWebster I think you keep spectacularly missing the point

Personally I don't get all this gender neutral crap. What's wrong with blue for a boy and pink for a girl? I've got two little boys always dressed in boys clothing, yet my youngest favourite colour is pink. They are what they are and will be what they will be as they grow. Be thankful for ANY gifts you get. Pushing your preferences to hard on old fashioned relatives will be the least of your problems when you are a new mum.
Get over it. Why do we live in a such a fucked up society that boys and girls aren't allowed to be boys or girls anymore?

Well that post got a lot of responses! I wasn't expecting that! I was hoping for a handful of suggestions. At one point I scrolled back to check I hadn't accidentally posted in AIBU based on the amount of "passionate" responses! (Not to mention some rude and unkind ones).

It's amazing how some posters with DC can be so unkind to first time mums, as if they were never in that position. I'm sure if I'd posted about breastfeeding or sleeping I'd have had a lot more supportive responses, even though there are many different views, approaches and schools of thought about those things also. This topic seems inflammatory.

There have been some balanced responses and helpful tips from those who felt similar to us and who have experience of this which will give me food for thought.

@Thisismytimetoshine well polo necks and little shirts with million of tiny buttons are not very practical for newborns are they? And jeans are not comfy. Limiting colour choices to only blue and navy for boys clothes is also a bit boring isn't it. When you're presented with seven blue vests and three navy trousers and ten navy cardigans your heart sinks a bit.

Instead he wore brightly coloured babygros for the first six months, now at age of six his choice is mostly plain black or white tshirts, but that's his choice. His little brother has a fine collection of pink leggings because that's what he likes to wear with Lego character t-shirts.

It's a bit patronising to be honest. I've not discussed limiting choices once the child is older. The post was about a newborn.

Well, many people are essentially telling you that you are potentially setting yourself up for a fall from a great height.

I’m also confused why you don’t care about this with a toddler/young child - given you won’t limit them apparently not impose this philosophy on them, but a newborn is different? Newborns couldn’t give a flying fuck if they are dressed in pink, blue or a black death metal outfit. As long as nothing is pinching them, digging in etc they just could not care at all yet it seems the hill you are prepared to die on?

I think gender neutral is more about having a variety of colours/style rather than only going for gender neutral colours.
Where it is harder is if you decide to buy a dress or a skirt for a girl because it just cannot be gender neutral as such..
It is easier to buy gender neutral clothes for boys because trousers and shorts are worn by both gender.
Dinausors are OK for both boys and girls imo.
And you can avoid the extremes of combat trousers, girly pink etc...

fwiw I found it easier to tell people to avoid those extremes rather than telling people to be gender neutral.

I also found another way is to get them get a dress but have one with spaceships and starts printed on it rather than the girly, frilly dress.
Or for a boy, having a tshirt with soft colour (that you usually only find in the girl section) rather than the one with weapon using character etc...

Not commenting on clothes but toys. My son played with prams and had a kitchen. When we played with the kitchen I used to say that we had to be careful of the hob because it could burn you. When we talked about his favourite toys he said he liked the kitchen because there was "danger" and he liked the pram because the wheels went fast.

once the baby is born regardless whether its a boy or a girl people may buy blue or pink clothes, i think you kinda need to suck it up and accept your child has someone who wants to buy things for him/her
buy neutral clothes yourself and as someone up thread says accept gracefully, take a pic of them in it sent it to them (or keep the clothes when they will see the giver) and put them away

Today my 3 year old put on a dress from last year that she found in a bag that just about covers her bum, with sparkly velvet leggings and a fleece, all of which are different colours. My two year old is wearing wellies and a t-shirt with paint on, she hasn't worn trousers or shorts for about 90% of lockdown. I wish I could go back to dressing them myself

I'm sure if I'd posted about breastfeeding or sleeping I'd have had a lot more supportive responses

Hahahaha try it and see

I am breastfeeding-= don’t be a martyr, give a bottle, fed is best, you just need “permission” to give up.

I am bottlefeeding- = don’t you know breast is best, why would you not try, everyone is so obsessed with breastfeeding bottlefeeders are judged and ignored...

This is nothing. It always surprises me how attached people are to the pink vs blue and think it’s harmless. Come join FWR :)

I’m gonna be flamed for this but this is such a middle class problem. My kid was given and knitted all manner of things I would never have brought her, but she needed clothes. I was on a budget and I was so grateful that the first 2 years of her life she lived in clothes that other people brought or donated. I just accepted them gracefully, appreciating that they do it because they love me and my DD. On MN people have issues with everything

Simplify things and don’t mention gender neutral. So say that you want them to have a wide variety of colours or no florals or just animal prints or just plain or whatever.

Then tell them a few sites that do the kind of clothes you like.

FWIW, I think purposely avoiding dresses is just as blinkered as only wearing dresses for a girl. Let them have the full range of clothes. I’d also add that pink was considered a boy colour in the early 20th century, so things change.

The real battle to avoid gender stereotypes comes at school. That’s where my DC learnt about “girls toys” and “boy toys” 😕

I hate this PFB rubbish. Mumsnet is up in arms about parents who procreate without thinking through in detail financial/house size/schooling options. But also, seemingly, about those who do dare to have parenting ideals!

I think it's a very valid point, OP - there is a huge amount of aggressively gendered messages thrust at kids from an early age, I too like to do damage limitation where possible. And I have managed to have two of them who are still dressed fairly neutrally. They're still preschoolers, so I expect it could change - but that's as they get more into the aggressively gendered wider world, not because of some latent sex-based imperative towards sparkles or camouflage, IMO.

OP you seem rather 'passionate' yourself! I've seen a few lighthearted posts such as JaniceWebster's last on about a son with a barbie doll on the back of the shirt and giggled like a loon, because that is what motherhood is about, and you'll find that out yourself. You just grab whatever you can find. That poster made a too true lighthearted comment and your response was unnecessarily dour and serious. From your posts you seem quite highly strung and take yourself far too seriously. Geesus have a laugh!

Believe me you will find that as a new mum there will be times that if you don't laugh you'll cry. Stop being so tightly wound. A lot of people are like you in how they want to raise the baby but after the baby is born you settle down and start to think more rationally. A newborn doesn't even understand colours. It's toddlers up, that is where the clothing counts more, all babies look the same. So who cares what a baby is dressed in? Worry about this 'gender neutral' stuff when they're older and people will even notice or care, let alone the child.

I think many posters are like me. Don't even go into the separate sections like Relationships, Chat etc, just look in the Trending Now box which shows posts from any and every section.