I have zero authority

[ChiaWatermelon]

Hi,

Mum of two boys here, aged 8 & 18. Looking for some help and advice on how I can become a stronger mother with some authority in my house.

I love both of my sons to bits, and I wouldn’t change them for the world, but sometimes I feel bullied and manipulated, DS (18) isn’t too bad, DS (8) is the problem, I have tried to ignore it hoping that he will grow out of it.

He is very well behaved at school, but at home he is a completely different person

He is miserable, he is always moaning about something.

He is an extremely fussy eater, take this morning for an example, he asked for a salmon cream cheese bagel once out in front of him he decided he didn’t want it.

Since being off school he has refused to join in on the online classes (at the start of the pandemic, the school ordered for every child to get dressed and attend online assembly, he did it the first day then decided that he wasn’t going to do it again)

It’s been a struggle to get him out of the house for daily exercise and supermarket trips, he just sulks the whole time I find myself bribing him with amazon credit.

The list goes on.

Your 18yo has taken over as 'man of the house'. He's placed himself in charge of you now.

@Charlotte

Yes I can admit that’s how the conversation went, DS(18) does need to apologise because what he did was disgusting, but he doesn’t care.

Tomorrow is a new day... I’m ready for it.

I'd tell him that adults don't hit children for misbehaving. If he wants to be an adult in the house with adult rights and responsibilities he's got to act like an adult, rather then a spoiled child.

They wouldn't just call you into school OP, they'd probably call social services.

Your oldest son is not a nice boy op. He might have lots of potential to be a nice boy but right now he’s a condescending up himself twat. And if you don’t recognise that he will probably be this his whole life. If he finds a nice girlfriend /wife, their chances of having a happily ever after are low because she will have to explain over and over again until it sinks in she’s not a doormat nor the housekeeper and she is worth respect, and the chances are she gives up and leaves.
‘You can always come and talk to me mum’ The answer is ‘I’m talking to you now. I’m looking at you and thinking I love you very much but I don’t actually like much of what I see and you have a lot of growing up to do. Unless you want to do it living out of home like the adult you think you are, you should think carefully. This is my house and you are not in charge. Don’t forget that again.’
Endless forgiveness and pandering is bad parenting. I’m sorry if it sounds harsh but you do really need to listen as he is 18, and you are running out of time to have an influence on him. I think the family counselling others have suggested might be a good idea to help you communicate.

Your youngest son acted/is acting appallingly and he wouldn't have his tec or tv for a considerable time but you do realise that you could have social services knocking on your door if your DS says anything?

Your 18 year old assaulted a child and that is a huge safeguarding issue!

If your 18 yr old was remorseful etc then that's one thing but he's not.

Would you be ok if your ex had done the same to your 8yr old or would you be just as pathetic about it?

There's nothing I can do

Yes there is, and you know that. You're just scared to because you're afraid of awkwardness or creating a bad atmosphere. Peopl have made suggestions and you're choosing to ignore them. Just going to your son and telling him you're upset isn't enough.

If he does this again will you get him to move out?

You're putting your own nervousness ahead of your child's wellbeing.

DS(8) is scared to come downstairs this morning 🙁

@rainbowstardrops If my ex did the same thing, I wouldn’t hesitate to call the police.

@Happicuppa He is my son I won’t get him to move out.

Prime example of absolutely shit parenting.

Harsh but true.

So you wouldn't hesitate to call the police if your ex did the exact same thing and yet because it was your DS, you've offered to cook him dinner instead????!!!!!
You couldn't make it up ........

More like he is milking it to get attention and to make you feel all sorry for him so things can go back to how they were and he can become the boss of you again. Tell him hes got 10 minutes to come down and have his breakfast and then you are going out for a walk before school starts. Then sit down at the table and do half an hour of work with him. Then a snack and a break and another half hours etc etc. Dont let him dictate to you, you dictate to him!

Are you going to address any of my other points? Do you really feel there's nothing you can do or are you just scared?

He's your son but he's an adult and behaved violently. So basically even if he continued to harm your 8 year old boy, you would do nothing and refuse to remove the adult that's harming him from your home, even though he's an adult and perfectly capable of fending for himself?

[quote ChiaWatermelon]@Charlotte

Yes I can admit that’s how the conversation went, DS(18) does need to apologise because what he did was disgusting, but he doesn’t care.

Tomorrow is a new day... I’m ready for it.[/quote]
Chia you cannot let this go with your DS18 it is too serious.

If your DS8 tells someone with a safeguarding responsibility what has happened and you cannot demonstrate that you have taken steps to protect him, actual concrete actions, it may well trigger SS involvement.

They won’t be overly concerned about a one-off incident but they will get involved if it appears you aren’t in control of the situation.

You must make absolutely crystal clear to DS18 that there cannot be any more violence. Tell him you love him and it will break your heart but he is an adult and you can’t tolerate the use of violence by an adult towards a child.

For your DS8 he may be scared to come downstairs, and you have to accept that a large part of the reason he is scare is because you haven’t demonstrated that you are the authority in your house and that DS18 will be made to behave reasonably and that you will keep DS8 safe.

For DS8 it might be time for carrot instead of stick. Tell him what he needs to do to earn the DS back. I’d suggest something like come downstairs, eat x for breakfast, do 30 minutes of schoolwork and a 30 minute walk.

Don’t make it too challenging, if he does it give the DS back. If he doesn’t then he got some more chance at lunchtime or you take the laptop too.

@Happicuppa

I don’t want to cause a bad atmosphere in the house (you’re right about that)

It is easy for us on the keyboard end to say the OP is being ineffective but we aren't dealing with it.
Parenting courses will help hopefully.

The 18 year old is 'in charge' of the house and has got fed up of his little brother and is now throwing his entitled arse around.
The 8 year old is learning that women are only there to dictate to. He will now learn that throwing your weight around is only way to be 'in charge'
OP has said she wants to sort this but really needs to get back in charge as the adult.
I would sit both down and point out you are not there to slave for either. If the 18 yr old is an adult but wants to act like a kid then he will be treated like it...remove privileges..curfews /bedtimes...if he wants to be treated like a adult act like it and take responsibility for his actions. Look up anger management courses and give him the link. He has to follow it up. Not negotiable. Remind him he is not in charge of the household he doesn't get to 'disclipine' his brother.
The 18 yr old is not sorry...I would say ok, a false sorry to get out of trouble is worthless. I would say he needs to leave either now or if it ever happens again...and mean it...covid or no covid. No second chances. His choice on how he behaves. He is a young adult not a child.
8 year old needs to be told that if you piss people off you risk someone objecting. Remove all 'prized' possessions and he earns those back on basis school work is completed, goes out daily, behaves respectfully. He cares...he is just playing you.
No more choices other than eat it or don't on food until he behaves properly. Again you choose the food, when they pay for it and cook it they get a choice. As you enjoy cooking, fine, but still your choice.

I was a pretty soft mum but they wouldn't have dared to behave so poorly. Although mine were cooking/cleaning for themselves and all left home at 18/19 for uni/college/jobs. Extending childhood into adulthood isn't a great idea IMHO.

Good luck OP!

Your house will have a really bad atmosphere when your adult son seriously hurts your child. You're on route to having him removed by SS.

I don’t want to cause a bad atmosphere in the house (you’re right about that)

What bad atmosphere is worse? Your son being scared to leave him room in case his brother is violent?
Or your son's being a bit grumpy and throwing a tantrum because they've rightfully been punished for appalling behaviour?

I understand that you're afraid of being in the house with a tense atmosphere and your older son perhaps being cross with you and it might feel uncomfortable. But it's so selfish to put that before the safety of your son.

Your house is in chaos and you need to reestablish control. Otherwise it will be awful for all of you. Your 8 year old needs boundaries and your 18 year old needs to understand that violence will never be tolerated. Being too soft has brought you to this, I am sorry but it is true.

I was reading posts & thinking this can't be for real... who could allow such behaviour at home as I note it is not a problem in school. You describe your younger son as miserable, whinging & sulky. Well, it worked for him up to now to get what he wants. And it sounds like it is going to work again with his refusal to come out of his room.

You are failing these boys with wishy washing no discipline parenting. How is it that you have no knowledge of rules, boundaries & consequences? Were there none in your home when you were a child? Did you have a cafe menu style mealtime with your poor Mother catering to every whim? Why is it you think verbalising what is/is not acceptable is threatening to your sons? I don't expect you to answer, I am just trying & failing to work through your mental process.

You need a parenting course & fast.
Forget about reading books in my view... you have too many obstacles set up in your head...like not knowing how to do it, how to say No...which way to deliver the discipline... & what is the 'not wanting to cause a bad atmosphere'. By the sound of things the atmosphere is toxic. You are the adult, address it with purpose & confidence.

Violence is never an answer & your 18 yr old's reaction was very wrong but you need to look at how it got to that. He has told you exactly why it got to that...

Also, your 8 yr old would not like if someone destroyed a meal on him (it takes long enough to find one he'll eat)....both need to apologise to the other in an age appropriate way. Does your 8 yr old ever say sorry for anything? So he may have some ocd issues, so what...accommodate where it is necessary but don't absolve yourself or use it as an excuse for not parenting & letting him away with bad behaviour. I still cannot believe the refusal at breakfast & making the fresh bagel at lunch. Let him whinge away...just leave him to it. Let him not eat then...he'll soon get hungry. He is okay in school, would he destroy another's child's meal there?

Speak to your children, tell them this behaviour on all sides, including your own, must end...not what can you do to make them happy but how ye can move forward as a family. Be honest with your 18 yr old, acknowledge you've made mistakes with 8yr old but that he himself has contributed also to things getting to this point with previous behaviour (not to mention this current one.)

Please get help with this in RL...

I’m back.

I’ve had to tell DS(18) to leave the house for a few hours, I don’t know if he is getting ready.

DS(8) come down to kitchen where DS(18) and said that he has to say sorry for hurting him yesterday.

DS(18) said “no I’m not, you say sorry and if you do that shit again, I’ll throw you out the window next time, now just sit and eat”

Op this is honestly quite confusing.

You're not listening to any of the advice or taking on board how serious this is. You're just giving updates on what happens and repeating that there's nothing you can possibly do.

I'm not sure why you're asking for advice when you're actually not willing to take any of it

What did you say/do when DS18 spoke to him like that?

Are you just accepting this situation, updating us with escalating bad behaviour & expecting that we repeat the eatlier advices given? Try to change for your kids sake...or don't & let SS get involved. Your 8 yr old who enjoys manipulation (judging by the whinging & sulking) will surely tell someone, his Father, friend...that he was attacked & since threatened by his older brother.....they may not have such a poor response as you & may actually do something to address it. If next post is more of the same defeatist attitude, I'm out...

OP's next post that is....