I have zero authority

[ChiaWatermelon]

Hi,

Mum of two boys here, aged 8 & 18. Looking for some help and advice on how I can become a stronger mother with some authority in my house.

I love both of my sons to bits, and I wouldn’t change them for the world, but sometimes I feel bullied and manipulated, DS (18) isn’t too bad, DS (8) is the problem, I have tried to ignore it hoping that he will grow out of it.

He is very well behaved at school, but at home he is a completely different person

He is miserable, he is always moaning about something.

He is an extremely fussy eater, take this morning for an example, he asked for a salmon cream cheese bagel once out in front of him he decided he didn’t want it.

Since being off school he has refused to join in on the online classes (at the start of the pandemic, the school ordered for every child to get dressed and attend online assembly, he did it the first day then decided that he wasn’t going to do it again)

It’s been a struggle to get him out of the house for daily exercise and supermarket trips, he just sulks the whole time I find myself bribing him with amazon credit.

The list goes on.

@lifestooshort123 Thanks
@willowmelangell Thanks

Today is a disaster, I am really starting to lose hope. I want to give up.

Breakfast resulted in DS(8) throwing his food into the bin, he then poured his juice into DS(18) plate. DS(18) grabbed him, lifted him up of his feet and kind of threw him, he hurt him. luckily he didn’t need medical attention. I’m furious at DS(18) DS(8) literally cried himself into a nap.

What consequences is he do going to face for wasting food and ruining his brother's breakfast, OP?

What consequences is he do going to face for wasting food and ruining his brother's breakfast,

Sounds as if his brother took matters into his own hands 🙄

Ok. Well the first thing I would do is tell your older son that it’s the first and last time he is violent to anybody else in your house. Tell him that if he does it again you will call the police. AND MEAN IT. I don’t have a lot of rules, but any form of violence is a hard no. If you tolerate it now, what’s to stop him doing the same to a wife / girlfriend in the future? But for lockdown I’d seriously consider telling you to ask him to leave.
Your younger son is acting out, and pushing back against your rules. His behaviour is wrong, but not unexpected, and he doesn’t deserve to be attacked for it. I’d make sure he knows that.
OP I hope your day gets better.

Another one interested in what consequences your 8yo will face?

Now you need to deal with DS18, hurting his brother is absolutely not acceptable and I would give a strict warning that if he ever does it again he will be out. If you do that though you have to mean it. I’d also tell him that you didn’t cause a
scene in from of the girlfriend last night, but he doesn’t t bring anyone into your home until you feel it’s safe, and again if he blatantly disrespects you again he is out.

Don’t lose sight of the fact that you also need to deal with DS8. He poured juice in his brothers plate to provoke him into a reaction, possibly to take the attention off himself and his behaviour. He needs to lose a gadget or a privilege.

Don’t let him nap, get him up and tell him that he is going for a walk.

This hard, and as pp have said their behaviour will get worse before it gets better but you have to stick with firm fair and consistent boundaries no matter how badly them react.

If you give in now you will never have authority again.

Wow so many typos...

@ChiaWatermelon that incident when your older DS hurt his little brother is really worrying - you must have thought about how it could have been so much worse, for both of them - so you need to get professional support.

How is your DS8 now, if he's awake after his nap?? Was he tired because he was up late last night? (I presume he couldn't have got a blow to the head btw, in which case you should be monitoring him very carefully if he's sleeping?)

It makes it even more important that you tell school/GP/youth counselling or similar, AND it makes it easier to explain what's happening in your house.

You haven't said that much about the boys' dad(s?) and what their involvement with them is.

@SomeoneElseEntirelyNow

I have listened to @Fairybatman and taken away his Nintendo Switch, so he won’t be playing it when he wakes up.

I am furious with DS(18) I don’t even want him in my house right now. I’ve never seen him behave like that before, I asked him why he did it, he said that he doesn’t care and that’s why DS(8) needs because he runs the house and nothing is ever said, and that he is tired of him f**king with him.

@StrawberryJam200

I think he fell asleep due to the shock of what happened, he mainly hurt his back if he hit his head I would have taken him straight to A&E

Both boys have the same dad, DS(18) doesn’t speak to him or want anything to do with him. I left him due to cheating and being involved in illegal activities. DS(8) sees him quiet often but we aren’t on talking terms.

I'm not in no way condoning what the 18yo did, violence like that should not got unpunished but you have to admit what he said after is true ?

Stay firm. Your older son has told you the truth and it is why your younger son is playing up more, he's no longer the ruler of all he surveys! Once you've talked to ds18 about his violence I think you should explain to him that you are slowly changing the status quo by putting in boundaries so he gets what's going on. Ds8 needs to apologise to him for spoiling his breakfast and ds18 needs to apologise to him for the violence. Neither of them will want to (but it is essential) so decide beforehand how you will handle their refusals - stay calm and firm and explain that their actions have consequences, stop cooking any meals for 24hrs? Change WiFi password for 24hrs? Be strong!

Time for an honest conversation with your ds18. I suggest ‘you’re an 18 year old, you seem to think you are an adult but you do fuck all around the house. Have you told your gf how you have a tantrum when your mum doesn’t cook you breakfast? You have everything done for you. It is not your job to tell your brother off, do not ever hurt him again or you can start sorting your own life out. Don’t bother giving me a lunch order today, you can cook your own.

You need the talk to the DS8 and tell him actions have consequences, and today should be the first and last time he does something in temper.
Talk to him alone and ask him how he felt when he was hurt because of own his actions.
Explain that he needs to apologize to DS18 for what he did.
Also talk to DS18 and tell him that he is to apologize to his brother, after DS8 says sorry.
That no one will be hurting anyone from this point forward.

I wouldn't make 'no sulking' a rule. You're about to change up his cushy life and so he will definitely sulk, and that's ok, weather the storm. Let him.

That way he learns that sulking accomplished nothing and he'll eventually naturally stop doing it.

I'd say he has to do one hour of school or you are removing all devices for the day. Weather the tantrum.

And 18yo can sort out his own food if he wants something different, he's an adult. Stop asking him for help with your youngest though - this tells the 8 year old that sons are in charge not mums.

Wow. That is outrageous behaviour from both of your children. Now is the time to draw a line in the sand. Actually, the time to do that was long ago. But surely this morning’s events must be a wake up call. The actions of both the child and the adult son need to be addressed immediately, in a way that shows them they can never behave that way again.

Here's one of the NHS recommendation helplines for parents who need support at the moment:
youngminds.org.uk/find-help/for-parents/parents-helpline/

Helpline open M-F 930 - 4pm, or email. They say

What happens when you call the Parents Helpline?
You’ll get through to a trained adviser who will talk through the problem and listen to your concerns and questions in complete confidence.
Your adviser will help you to understand your child’s behaviour and give you practical advice on where to go next.
If you need further help, they’ll refer you to one of our specialists whether it's a psychotherapist, psychiatrist, psychologist or mental health nurse. They’ll arrange a phone consultation within 7 days.
Friendly and Confidential
We know it’s difficult to call the first time – but don’t worry. Your conversation with us will remain confidential unless we suspect that a child, young person or vulnerable adult may be experiencing, or is at risk of experiencing harm.

That is shocking on both parts. What did you do while it was going on? When things have calmed down later you need to tell them that this must never happen again. ds1 has a point but violence is not an answer. This is exactly why things need to change , as they asked you earlier in the week. Start afresh tomorrow.

Right

DS(18) is refusing to apologise to DS(8) he said that he is not apologising because its the only way DS(8) is going to learn.

DS(8) is still very upset, says he hates us both and he is going to go and live with his dad.

@LIZS I couldn't do anything it happened within the space of a few seconds.

Your adult son's method was shitty but he's done what you should have done years ago and shown your younger son that bad behaviour has consequences.

Of course your kid is now declaring he hates you both and wants to leave - he's never faced a consequence in his life, and he doesn't like it now it's happened.

Make it clear to your adult son that if he does that again, you'll kick him out. Make it clear to your child that bad behaviour won't be tolerated.

Get them together
Tell the 8yo he must apologise to his brother and promise it won't happen again
If he refuses, the consequences are removal of screen/TV/treats till he does.
Then the 18yo must apologise to his brother in return and promise it won't happen again
If he refuses again then he has consequences as well
Be serious with them both and tell them the current situation is making you very sad and it stops now. Take some control.
From tomorrow start homeschooling your youngest. You've been given enough ideas on this thread.

DS8 does not dictate where he's going to live, that's for adults. He also needs to apologise to his DS who then should do likewise. Violence is never the answer but clearly DS18 has had enough. I'm afraid your younger son will face this kind of reaction more and more throughout life if he is allowed to continue with his poor behaviour.
You need to take control. From now on you decide what you're cooking for every meal. They can help with a list of ideas but ultimately it's your decision. No more café /restaurant service. With regards to school work, half term is over so DS8 has to do school work and exercise otherwise absolutely no screen time. The earlier he does them the earlier he gets his screen time. It must be really hard for you OP but it's only going to get worse the longer you leave it. Some external help is probably called for as suggested above. Keep posting on here to vent and hopefully receive constructive advice

I'm not too surprised by 18yo's outburst. It's totally unaccepotable to be violent, but 8yo's behaviour was pretty damned shocking. Binning his own food and deliberately destroying his brother's? He wouldn't see a game console for week.