My whole life one girl/woman dislikes me for no reason and then gets everyone else to dislike me :(

[LocalNetter]

My whole life one girl/woman dislikes me for no reason and then gets everyone else to dislike me :(

I don't know why but this pattern has repeated my entire life so far. At school, in my house-share, at uni, at work.

There will be no argument, no fight, no disagreement. I would have maybe spoken to them once or twice and suddenly they'll be all cold (but some will pretend to be nice to my face) but will gradually stop the ones who do talk to me from talking to me. It will always be those most closest to that girl/woman who will firstly start acting off with me and then eventually most people get converted to that way.

Whilst the others wouldn't necessarily be my bestest friends, I know they'd like me enough to make pleasant talk with me etc and over time they almost start becoming a bully towards me.

Is this how some people bond? By talking about someone else negatively to build their own friendship?

The saddest thing is I would have had no fight or disagreement or done anything remotely unkind to deserve that hate. Fine if she's not interested in being friends with me but to actively dislike me for no reason and turn others against me is horrible. Sometimes, the girls who do this are initially much less liked by others than I am and yet they miraculously turn it around completely.

I'm just sick of being the butt of it for other girls to bond with each other and I don't know why it happens to me every time :( :( I always try and help people, have never been disloyal or even rude, even these girls themselves will often say I'm super nice, etc. - it's almost like that film "mean girls".

Have you seen people treated this way? Do you know what seems to make a particular person a target for this kind of behaviour?

I hate being a victim of this any longer :(

@JazzyTheDog
What part of this isn’t me saying it’s partly due to me...?
‘I know I am very likely behaving in a way that attracts this kind of situation towards me - possibly poor boundaries, being a bit of a people pleaser, too intense, etc. but I highly doubt it's superiority as that's one thing I've never been referred to as.’

There’s no way I’d accept blame on my behaviour for being hit and kicked though. Regardless of how socially awkward I am, I did not deserve that behaviour. No one does.

@ReceptacleForTheRespectable
If that was the only reason than why do gorgeous women never bully me as a result of my social anxiety? I think I behave equally to all but if subconsciously I behave differently, if anything I’d be more anxious etc around stunning women so they should want to bully me more?

No, No one does. But most of what you describe isn't as extreme as that.

Mostly it's just a pattern of people distancing themselves, and understanding why will help you to try to address it.

Ok what kind of behaviours falling under the titles I’ve described (intensity, poor boundaries, people pleaser) would make you intensely dislike someone?

You seem determined to be told that other women are jealous of your plump lips, DD breasts, and Mensa-level intellect.

You're not in school anymore. Forget about what your teachers told you. Try to forget about the bullying you received there (I know it's hard - I too was bullied, although mostly by boys, which some posters on this thread probably think is impossible).

Don't let what happened in school colour the way you view interactions with your fellow adults a decade or more later.

If that was the only reason than why do gorgeous women never bully me as a result of my social anxiety?

And here we go again.... You know attractiveness is subjective, right? There isn't a 'one true scale of attractiveness' by which you will always be able to score yourself against others, higher or lower.

School aside, most of what you describe isn't bullying. You perceive something and read a lot into situations, but it is equally likely that you are reading more into the situation than is there in at least some of these instances.

There are bullies out there. Hell, I've met more than a few. But most people just want an easy life and want to hang out with people who make them feel good. If someone is inadvertently intrusive (poor boundaries) or hard work to be around, they will drift away from that person. People don't generally invest that much time and energy in hating others unless there's a serious backstory.

Looking at the example at work, what about that was bullying? What made you think this woman (not 'girl') hated you in particular? You said she was overbearing with everyone.

This has happened to me a few times OP.

The second time it was a woman at work and I looked in to it obsessively.

I realised that she only spent niceness on those who could validate her. So it's nothing to do with ''jealousy'' as is often the reason put forward. I'm attractive but in an ordinary way, not going to cause a traffic accident.

The wendy at my work a few years ago, she didn't see me as somebody who could validate her. So she quite literally had no use for me. She was lovely to everybody who was young, confident, attractive, in a high up position at work, or already considered popular. I was quieter, well-liked by everybody on a 1:1 basis but not popular. I was like a ghost to her. At first it wasn't personal. She just didn't notice me, but then I challenged her a tiny bit (non confrontationally) and she shunned me and then started to manipulate the social dynamic around us so that others would exclude me or not think to include me. A million micro aggressions.

She was OK to me (ie, indifferent) until I let it be know that I had not bought in to the hierarchy she visualised in her head. She thought I knew that I was beneath her, and then when I said ''hey, I feel like you're really warm to everybody else, and quite cold to me, is that your intention?'' then she knew that I didn't know my place beneath her. That was the catalyst. She went from just ignoring me to manipulating the dynamics around us.

One of the most toxic people I've ever met, and yet 90% of people would think she was sweet.

Same thing happened more recently with a relative in fact. OK to me in a very indifferent sort of way while lovebombing all the other relatives. I had to ask her not to misrepresent me once, she was summing up what I believed and aligning herself to another relative in a ''we disagree with WhyDo''' and I had to say ''eh what, we all agree''. And that one thing let her know that I did not know my place beneath her in the hierarchy that exists in her head. I have literally caused her a narcissistic injury by asserting a small boundary. A boundary that all of the other relatives would be allowed to have. But not me.

These people are narcissists. They pretend to be nice. They don't waste niceness on people who don't validate them or admire them though. If they sense you don't know your place (ie, beneath them) that really triggers them.

I'm working on becoming less 'juicy' to female narcissists in a group. Twice in the last 5 years this has happened to me, and both times I did nothing wrong.

Luckily the second time I know that it's her, it's not me, I'm the lightening rod for her inadequacies. Healthy people do not carry on like this.

I really do think you need some help. You seem to view women like mythological creatures. A aibnow woman does not have the power you seem to think they do.

You seem to put value on people by how they look etc - and that’s not a great start either.

@LocalNetter don't beat yourself up looking for reasons why somebody MIGHT dislike you.

that's a total waste of time and it's a red herring anyway. I like some people more than I like others, but my basic personality is the same for everybody. I don't need to really like somebody to be myself around them. I can be my normal self around people I don't love or like. It's easy. I have one personality. It can be the case that that is what annoys these wendies. They recognise some sort of consistency, authenticity, empathy, ability to connect with people 1:1 and it threatens them. But they can't verbalise that because it's not reasonable, and they know that! so it is expressed in a very passive aggressive way. Through exclusion which is a form of bullying (kip williams).

It's not that they don't like you. It's their fear that others will like you.

I've been through this a few times in the last decade. I used to have an abusive boyfriend and I have really improved my boundaries and my self esteem and my sense of myself and my knowledge of human behaviour are all much improved from 10 years ago. The only fly in the ointment now is that even though I'd be turned right off any abusive man instantly, a female narc in a group seems to zone in on me and for some reason, she knows that my boundaries used to be poor, that my self-esteem used to be low.

I feel confident now, happy in myself, so it surprises me that this happens. The only consolation is that I dealt with it better when the relative pulled this shit on me than a few years earlier when a work wendy excluded me.

@ReceptacleForTheRespectable
If I was having a 1:1 convo with someone far away from her, she’d notice, come over, listen to what I was saying and tell me she disagreed. Nearly every time. I could almost predict it.

She’d often come up to whoever was sitting next to me and ask them to get a coffee with her whilst they were talking to me but couldn’t care less otherwise about inviting them.

She once told me she and another woman looked amazing when trying on some PPE and that I should go for another style for it despite not asking her for an opinion.

I know none of this is extreme bullying like the school stuff but it’s very wearing and unfair and damaging to self esteem to be constantly subjected to this day after day. Just like some word consider omission lying in some cases, making people feel bad in this way is a form of bullying.

She goes completely the other way with everyone else. Constantly touching them, inviting them to her house, constantly agreeing with what they say, to the point I seem non intense compared to her lol.
If I disliked someone, I wouldn’t go out of my way to help them but there’s no way I’d do the above and I’d be civil to them and just generally keep out of their way.

whydowendieswendy I recognise your description - there are people who are only nice if you are useful to them. And people like that do turn nasty if you assert a boundary, get in the way of what they want, or expose their behaviour, even in the smallest way.

But the difference is that you know why those specific women behaved like that. The OP has no clue why women (the focus is on women, even though she's given examples of men distancing themselves too) don't like her, and given the number of them she's encountered, the cause is likely to be different. I would bet my mortgage that it's not down to appearance though.

I know exactly what you mean @WhyDoWendiesWendy :( funny username lol

Genuinely, I have only had this sort of thing once, and it was with one, possibly two people in a cafe I used to work in. I don’t think the girl was jealous of me, I think that for whatever reason something about me irritated her and I caught her bitching about me a few times. Plenty of people irritate me so I imagine it’s just the laws of average. I manage to get along with most people.

I once worked with someone who was completely and utterly self-obsessed. If someone walked past her and didn’t especially smile at her she would have a whole conspiracy theory worked out in seconds about how they must be offended/hate her because of something completely random. It was fecking exhausting to listen to, never mind what it must have been like inside her head. She was so ridiculously insecure. I felt sorry for her and gave her a lot of air time, but in the end she started picking at me to see if I still liked her and that coincided with me moving teams with a sigh of relief.

Could it be baggage though, There's one girl in my dept who often goes to lunch without me, it would never cross my mind to be offended. She's much closer to someone else in another dept so wants to catch up with her.
Also you're her boss, superior? Maybe she thinks it inappropriate, uncomfortable, have you ever asked if you could go? If 2 of my colleagues said let's get a coffee, if I fancied one Id say I'll come too. It would never cross my mind they wouldn't want me there.

localnetter You said she was overbearing with everybody... talked over everybody etc. To the point that people didn't like her because of it. So talking over you or disagreeing with you wasn't unique, was it?

Tbh, she sounds like she has poor boundaries - touching people etc. I'd imagine that was also part of why they weren't keen. She clearly has poor social skills, which is why she's struggled to keep friends.

(If she were to ask on MN why people drift away from her, I wonder whether she'd be told it's jealousy because she's so beautiful?)

Your unhealthy focus on this woman (and others) is a real issue here - I think there's a lot of projecting going on. Focus on your EQ and social skills. Spend time with people who you have things in common with - work isn't a great place to make real friends. And yes, therapy.

If she was as you described people wouldn't like her & want to spend time with her.

Ok what kind of behaviours falling under the titles I’ve described (intensity, poor boundaries, people pleaser) would make you intensely dislike someone?

So you won't take on board any suggestion that you may be coming across as superior? You seem very focused on women's looks, almost like you judge them based on that. It's clearly coming across to people. And those "flaws" you mention such as people pleasing, they are just another way to make yourself look good. It's like you are answering the classic interview question "Tell me about your weaknesses".
Nothing about your self description is balanced either. You listed your tiny waist size, large boobs, gorgeous hair, plump lips, and called yourself a 9 but then said your nose is big- that's not balanced. Not only have you come across as incredibly self indulgent but you want everyone to tell you women dislike you because of jealousy and I don't think that true. The physical bullying you got in school sounds awful but you can't keep saying you are getting bullied at work because it doesn't sound like it.

You need to get some therapy where you can really self evaluate your actual flaws and come to realise how you must be coming across to other people. The issue is very obviously you.

What the OP describes is bullying though. Consistently shunning or mocking one person while investing extra attention and affection on everybody else in the group is bullying.

Kip Williams. Study on line if you want to read it OP.
Also, mean girls grown up, same conclusion in there.

Just rise above it OP.

You are a lightening rod for her inadequacies. It's nothing to do with you. Emotionally healthy, happy, secure people can be pleasant and good humoured and inclusive to everybody.

Since my wendy left work, the atmosphere at work has got a lot better. Instead of little fucking microaggressions to exclude one person, I do tiny little things when I can to make sure that we're all able to talk to each other.

I'm not looking for a medal for this. I should have been more aware of what it was like to be excluded but until it happened to me, it wasn't really on my radar.

In the Kip Williams study, he says 80% of bystanders notice but between 1 and 3 % will actually DO anything.

So keep your dignity. Get a mantra in your head that helps you rise above it. It is nothing to do with you.

After I'd read studies on bullying and books about adult bullying, then I listened to hypnosis overnight to give me confidence and to make me feel lighter and happier going in to work and it realy helped. I also read a few books about charisma and I just used it as a life lesson.

When I see this happening to somebody else now, I let them know that I saw. Just say ''you ok?''.

Having been on the receiving end of it twice, and having stepped back to look at my own values, being a bystander who ignores this when it's happening to somebody else is not who I want to be.

It's not enough for me to be in a group by the skin of my teeth at the cost of somebody else being in or out.

Harmonious, inclusive integration. That's easier for everybody.

all the people she chose to be in her inner circle turned against her quite publically (she was very loud, had an opinion about everything and thought everyone wanted to hear it even when not asked for and would often disagree with people about things that don’t matter e.g if someone said they liked tea, she’d pipe in with the fact she can’t stand tea and much prefers coffee and lists the reasons why despite no one asking.)

This is how the OP described this woman earlier. The picture painted is of a woman who is overbearing and critical with everyone, not just the OP.

"Thought everyone wanted to hear it"
"would often disagree with people about things that don’t matter"

@ReceptacleForTheRespectable yes she was intense with others too but positive intense - like overly desperate to befriend them whilst with me it was the polar opposite - finding ways to omit me as much as people, make digs at my clothing, intentionally disagree to everything I say - even subjective things like what food I like whereas with everyone else she’d be very vocal but to 100% agree with what they say. It was almost like she put everyone else on a super high pedestal and my super low down on the ground. She didn’t have anyone she was just meh about.

I remember once at the Xmas party, there was a man dancing next to me (completely platonically whilst having a chat) and she literally pulled him by the arm and led him to the centre of the dance floor. Then repeated that behaviour with the next 2 ladies that I danced next to. In a party of over 50 people. It was intense and weird,

I’m not technically her boss - I was just part of the interview panel that hired her.

I think touching people too much is part of the culture from the country she is from but still quite different to everyone else here

Op, you clearly will only listen to those who give you a pat on the head, tell you how amazing you are and say all those nasty women are jealous. Don't see what else you want out of this thread if you are unwilling to accept the fact that this problem is most likly caused by the way you are behaving. That woman at your work sounds annoying and if what you say is true than others wouldn't want to be friends with her so I wonder if there is more to it than what you have described.

@whydowendieswendy - this isn’t a single situation the op describes though - she says it has happened at every stage of her life. This is very sad but does give the impression that there’s more to it than a single incident

Why are you trying to be friends with these people in the first place? You describe them as women who are big on personality but small on looks and you describe yourself as the exact opposite of that. So this is never going to work, is it? Stop being fake nice with everyone and start focusing on being genuine instead. This way you are more likely to find your crowd.

Local, I was bullied at school too, there were a group of girls that brutalised me through secondary school. It started off with what I deemed to be a very innocuous exchange in 1st year (year 7 in new money), and carried on. It got violent at times, I was really quite scared, but as it progressed through the years I understood that there was a structural inequality combined with my inherent dickheadishness that kept it going.

None of us would give in. They were determined to bully me, and ultimately it came down to my confidence, and I was determined never to give up to it. I never took it personally though, I knew they'd keep coming and I'd keep on trucking. It was never about ME, it was about them.

They attacked me because they felt bad about themselves, but I didn't take it personally, I didn't think it was because I was so great that they needed to attack me in particular, anyone would have done.

When people are dicks (and the vast majority of them aren't), it's not about you, its about them. When you consistently struggle, over and over, and life keeps happening in the same way, it's you. It really is you. That's no bad thing, it's just a message to make change. You're either being disingenuous and you don't want change, or you're fairly young and up for it.