How long is "usual" to have off after a bereavement?

[ElderAve]

I'm sure this is going to make me sound callous but I'm honestly just trying to get an idea of what's reasonable.

I currently have three staff signed off with "stress due to bereavement". Initially, they were given 2 weeks' compassionate leave and thereafter, they've all had medical certificates of between 4 & 6 weeks. Two are now telling me they won't be well enough to return at the end of their certificates.

Our usual policy is an OH referral and informal meeting after two weeks for anything MH related but as there was a clear and not work related reason behind these absences, I didn't think that was worthwhile or fair.

Now, I understand everyone will be different, that anxiety is a real thing etc etc but I can't let this drift indefinitely.

FWIW these are women in their 40s & 50s who have lost a parent. Obviously distressing to them but nothing exceptional in the circumstances.

What do you think. Do I start "proceedings" or let them have a few more weeks?

I too want to know what at their age means. It sounds incredibly ageist. Does your work have policies against discrimination - there are certainly laws which perhaps your hr should do a refresher course on😊🙄.

Everyone is different. I thankfully haven’t lost a parent yet but have managed many people who have. Some were back in days some took months.

@GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman

That must have been awful. But please don’t dismiss others grief.

I lost three close family members within a two month period. Several people told me how their loss had been worse. Competitive grieving is sadly a real thing. But no one can dismiss some sone else’s grief just because in their mind And by their own formula their own suffering must be worse.

@Tombakersscarf I think @GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman had converted a lot of it. But also at 40/50 ones parents are likely to be 70/80 so death is, if not expected, within the same of what one has to expect from life. At 20, the death of a parent is likely to be more shocking, and possibly unexpected. I lost my dad when I was 40, married with kids and very independent of my parents. My daughters lost theirs at 20/21 while they lived at home. I don't think our experiences or our grief was comparable

Converted= covered. I must stop using Swype on my phone

I except someone in their 40s or 50s to be better placed to cope with a parent's death than someone in their 20s
Not necesarrily. I lost one parent when I was in my 20s the other when I was in my 50s. The second loss was much, much harder and took me a lot longer to recover from.

Also we all have very different responses and resilience. People cope very differently to grief, stress etc.

I managed a team member who came back a week after his mother’s death. He should not have been in work, and it was a very difficult situation to manage. But he needed to be in work to get through a very difficult period in his life.

I think as managers we need to show compassion rather than sneering that someone else was absolutely fine after two days.

When my dad died, late on a Monday, I was off for the rest of the week. Then back for 2 weeks, and then another 2 days off for the funeral.

I am still badly grieving 2 years later and I should probably have taken more time. I don't feel I can now, or at least not for that reason.

@Doilooklikeatourist I am sorry for your loss. But you cannot use your personal experience to judge the grief and mental health of people you have never met.

That is completely ridiculous.

I had 2 weeks, but after returning kept going to the toilets to cry.

Again. If this was just one person off for an unusually long period of time, we could venture exceptional circumstances. But THREE people off for eight weeks for the same loss at the same time, is very very strange. I suspect that they are each encouraging each other to some extent.

I am 50 and have had a number of bereavements. I find each bereavement harder as you are also reminded of past bereavements. I find it strange that you think being older would mean it is easier.

In most of my workplaces it's been a week off after the death, then the day plus travelling time (often a day either side) for the funeral.

I found it helpful getting back into the swing of things when my mother died. Having said that, I was only working part time because I was effectively a full time carer for her.

Spot on @GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman

Losing an older parent at 80ish is a normal and natural part of life's circle. Yes, of course it is sad at the time. It is always difficult to lose a loved one, but it is usually possible to look back on a life well lived, and - even when it is sudden, it isn't really shocking (in the most literal sense).
Losing a child or a partner is a completely different scenario.
(yes, I have lost both my parents, and my sister).
No, I didn't have even two weeks off, let alone longer.
On a practical note, some people will have to deal with more - in terms of inquests or clearing houses or arranging care for another elderly parents or many other things and this is more difficult if there is a lot of travel involved, but in terms of 'grief' that is still there after a week, a month, a year, 5 years, and then some, but you have to learn to deal with it.
Many people find some 'structure' and 'normality' quite helpful in dealing with their bereavement.

Don’t get me wrong, my best friend lost her mother in her late teens. It was an awful time and her grief was horrible to be part of. My grief at losing a parent is very different. However, in my 40s I have more responsibilities, I am supporting my grieving children and elderly mother. This has impacted in my grief as I’ve not had any time to get it out of my system or start to. I have allowed my family to do so. So losing a parent in your 20s is very different to your 40/50s because of the responsibilities. I have anxiety if I can’t get hold of my mother, I worry constantly. It’s exhausting. Yet still not a competition x

Incidentally it’s common to not get over grief for 2+ years. It’s worth remembering that when you see someone who seems fine :)

I think it depends very much on the job.
My Dad died when I was 22, a student with a part time job. I was in work the next day, in a busy restaurant, and managed ok. But I was unable to complete my exams that year, I couldn't focus on studying, and didn't want to be alone. Being in a busy environment worked for me. That might not have been the case if I'd had a more responsible/ stressful job, but waitressing was fine. I wouldn't necessarily have been capable of making strategic decisions though.

Blimey. I had no idea I could have taken more time off than I did. I felt guilty enough during the three days I sat at my dad's bedside whilst he was dying. He died on a Friday, and I returned to work the following Thursday. I arranged his funeral for my non-working day.
Six weeks????!!!!! Are they being paid? I wonder if people return sooner if they are financially penalised.

@GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman

I tend to agree as I also lost my Mum in my 20's and was totally unprepared for it. None of my friends had lost a parent yet so it was hard to talk about it with anyone.

Now I'm in my 40's and know that my Dad's health means that he won't be here for many more years, but I do feel more emotionally prepared for his loss. Many of my friends are also dealing with aging, ill parents or have lost a parent, so we can lean on each other.

Yes, we all have more responsibilities, but we're mature adults now. I was blindsided in my 20's.

To respond to the OP, I think following up with a phone call and perhaps an informal meeting might be the best response. You just need to find out what's happening and what to expect in the coming weeks.
What you don't want is someone struggling with grief (possibly not seeking counselling if they're too upset) and getting into a really bad way.

If they have doctors notes, don't you have to just wait until they're no longer signed off sick? I haven't ever been a manager so not sure how it works, but I thought there wasn't much a manager could do if they had a sick note signed by their doctor?

I don't think the age of the person who is experiencing the grief makes much difference - just because you are older doesn't make it easier - neither does the fact they are older - expected or unexpected loss does change the fact of loss.

I lost Mum in Nov last year and I am not sure I have really even started grieving yet we had such a shit time for 3 years caring for her, running on emotional and physical empty, dealing with families as well as Mum and Dad and full on care. Utterly utterly crap. Having said that some semblence of normal has to resume at some point and I think you need to rethink your policy on this situation and maybe after 2 weeks offer a course of counselling followed by considered return to work depending on the work, risks and the individual involved

My dad died last year. I'm in my 50s. I had around 10 days off in bits and bobs. Obviously everyone's situation is different but I'd be a bit bemused to have three people in the situation you describe. I think what you're suggesting sounds reasonable.

To the person who queried your mentioning the staff ages - yes it hurts however old you are, but at that stage in life you're a bit more prepared for it than when you're younger. So I think perfectly relevant.

I think that generally, six to eight weeks and then looking to extend that is excessive for the loss of a parent, especially at that age. I think for a partner or child it would be very different

I had a week off when my Mum died and went back to work before her funeral. I had two days off at the time of the funeral. I was working with terminally ill patients but had an incredibly supportive team, so I very much wanted to go back to work.

Look. This is not grief top trumps.

The OP has a specific issue. THREE people are off at the same time, for exceptionally long periods of time compared to anyone else. Can people not see that this has nothing to do with their, individual experience?

Jeeze.

The cynic in me is wondering if they would be taking so much time to recover if they weren’t being paid.

Well if god forbid any of my DC died I’d never go back to work again, I’d got myself off a bridge if it wasn’t for the fact I wouldn’t want to leave the other without me. I don’t think I’d ever be able to work again.

If my partner died at the age I am now then that would be tragic as were not 40 yet however I’d be ok but I’d need a good few weeks/months before returning to work.

If a parent dies, the younger you are the worse it is, in the overall sense. It’s awful whatever age but IMO losing a parent when you’re in your 50’s is not as bad as in your 20’s simply did the fact the 50 year old had had twice as long and more with their parent.

The older someone is the less tragic therefore the less time needed I would say.

In OP circumstances I think a pp is right and 8 weeks seems excessive when you’ve lost a parent when you’re in your 50’s.