Overheard friend talking about us...

[HolidayHolly]

A what would you do...
For context.. On holiday in a villa in Spain with DH and his 2 friends and their DP. Average age early 30's, I'm late 30's and Anna is 20's. Plan was to go to a big club one night this week to see a famous DJ. This is not our usual type of thing or chosen night out (usually in bed by 12!) but it was a special request by my DH's friend 'Tom', who missed out on all the nightlife holiday stuff in his younger days and asked if we could all do this as a one-off. We all agreed ages ago and booked tickets for this one off event. The dj comes on in the early hours of the morning, (think 4-5am ish) so it's going to be hard work to stay awake!

Anyway we were all sat round at dinner discussing the event and DH and I were talking about how hard we were going to find it to stay awake long enough for the event and what our tactics would be, eg having a nap during the day before, trying to change our body clock etc. DH made a joke about why on earth we booked this, what were we thinking etc. Tom said we could always cancel if it's too difficult for everyone. I felt Tom was a bit concerned by me and DH being negative about the event, so I said sorry if we sounded negative, and that we were keen to go but just worried we would spoil it or not enjoy it due to tiredness so trying to come up with a plan. He seemed fine and said no worries, and made a joke about drinking loads of coffee. However, Tom's gf Anna became a bit passive aggressive, saying things along the lines of "don't listen to those two fuckers Tom" and "well they can fuck off and we'll go by ourselves", in a 'jokey' way.
Later on the conversation turned up marriage (DH and I are but Anna and Tom are not) and when another person asked Anna if she'd like to get married she was making disdainful faces towards me and DH and saying "no way" and making rolling eyes / yawn type faces. There has been more of this behaviour but I can't be bothered to list it all here.

Anyway on the way home Anna and Tom wanted to walk back by themselves instead of getting a cab with us, and I had the strong sense that Anna was going to be talking about us. At the villa everyone went to bed but I could hear Anna's voice talking to Tom for ages in their room (walls very thin). I could hear snatches of sentences and then lots of words I couldn't make out. I heard her say my name and then talk about me and. I couldn't make out whole sentences but heard things like "the problem with Holly is..." and "people like that they just..." etc etc. This went on for about 45 minutes and I could hear Tom interjecting with words but mainly Anna talking to him.

I feel crap this morning. I don't know how best to approach the day or the rest of this holiday. I hate all this crap which feels like teenage behaviour to me. None of my friends behave like this- we just communicate openly. I know that if it wasn't for DH friendship with Tom I would never choose to have a person like Anna in my life as she feels somewhat insecure and toxic, but for DH sake I have always tried to get on with her and on the surface have done so. I have shown her kindness, involving her in my bridal party things as Tom was DH's best man, so as not to make her feel left out. I am also sad because I do like Tom very much and feel sad if these conversations are being had.

It all sounds ridiculously PETTY I know - and that's because it is! Do I just zone out and get through this holiday with a false smile? I hate being disingenuous though.

Worrying about staying awake and saying do to friends is hardly crime of the century.
OTOH, bitching about weddings while sitting next to the bride or eye rolling about marriage while in the company of a married couple is spectacularly rude!

Stop trying to include her - it's clear she doesn't like you. She doesn't have to be your bestie but she should have the good manners to be polite for her boyfriend's sake, just as you have tried for DH.

I think she's probably desperate to get married and Tom is less so - people who genuinely don't care, don't feel the need to be so bitchy and rude about other people's weddings/marriages.

I don't think you behaved badly, I just think DH friend knew it was out of your comfort zone so tried to make sure you were all up for it, then when you and your DH made the jokes he probably felt awkward considering the event mainly was just for him. I would say your DH comment about why did we sign up for this was worse, Only because his friend would have immediately felt like a pain in the arse.

His partner picked up on it and by the sounds of it got arsey with you. Unless you pull her up on what you heard there isn't anything you can do, she has an image of party pooper In her head.

she has her own insecurities (eg about not being married), her supposed disgust at the idea of marriage is nothing to with you, and all to do with her.

Also, don't listen at doors (or through walls) if you can't handle hearing how people really think about you , play music or wear earplugs instead! I never try to overhear convo's about me, as I don't want the truth

As to the DJ, yes it was boring of you to make a fuss about staying up late, just do it or don't but don't go on about it. Then just don't go.

FWIW, I am almost 50 and am sure I could stay up one night and party away, it will be fun and an experience, and a great DJ is such a treat

Eg after a face pull saying “you seem not to be happy with that idea Anna” or some such.

Or "careful, the wind might change".

all the better if she doesn't know the reference, and asks you to explain.

This thread is a woman complaining or bitching (take your pick) about another woman who complained or bitched (take your pick) about her after she complained or bitched (take your pick) about a decision by a man to go clubbing.

Sorry OP but you and your husband were rude to be joking about the plans you agreed to. That you think it was light hearted isn’t the point. You now know it wasn’t received that way. From what I can see you and your husband need to own the fact you brought on the bad atmosphere in the group. Trying to deflect things on to the consequent bad atmosphere and, somewhat weirdly, a woman’s decision to not to want to be married tells me you don’t like to be in the wrong.

I don’t see any “honesty” in making comments about how “difficult” it is to go clubbing all night or that your husband regrets the decision. Your subsequent intervention was equally rude and patronising. I think Tom got the idea of how you felt from what your husband said.

I also don’t understand why you keep labouring the fact she is young and unmarried or that she earns less than you. Do you think you are better than her or have a preferred status as a mature married woman?

Most of my friends were still doing all night island clubs into their 40s. They earn an awful lot and some were married.

I wouldn't say anything. She clearly dislikes you, so anything you say won't go down well from what you've described about some of her reactions. It would sour the atmosphere more, just agree never to go on holiday with her again.

But you were being PA. By saying 'gosh I don't know of I can stay up that late' and 'let's plan a nap' you are basically saying that it's a rubbish idea and you don't want to go but not saying that so being PA.
Then you spout about how kind you are. I think what you are posting on the internet is much more bitchey and PA then talking to a partner about something that pisses you off.

I only stay up all night for things I really want to do, and, frankly, I wouldn't be going on this night even it was Tom's last-gasp dying wish.

But then I think that holidays where only half of the people are friends and others are their wives/husbands/partners who are along for the ride is a recipe for disaster -- they remind me of those depressing couples you sometimes see in city centres on Saturday nights where two men are striding along together, deep in conversation, and two women, done up to the nines, are trying to keep up in high heels six feet behind, visibly bored to death with one another, or total strangers, but loyally going along with their boyfriends' idea of a 'couples' night out'.

Isn't part of the issue here that, to contradict your title, Anna isn't your friend -- she's only in your life because she's your DH's friend's current girlfriend, and not someone you would choose to have a cup of coffee with, far less go on holiday with, if you were acting according to your own preferences?

We often go on holiday with friends, but only with friends where DH and I are both equally friendly with the other people involved -- I certainly wouldn't inflict on DH a holiday where I was happily ensconced with my best friend/s, but he was spending a fortnight with a person or people he didn't much like, and was stuck with a lengthy night out that didn't interest him purely because my best friend wanted to? That just sounds like a recipe for resentment.

Wouldn't it be easier to go on holiday either by yourself, or only with people you genuinely like?

Anyway we were all sat round at dinner discussing the event and DH and I were talking about how hard we were going to find it to stay awake long enough for the event and what our tactics would be, eg having a nap during the day before, trying to change our body clock etc.

For me, it's the fact that you were discussing this in front of them. As if you were about to head off into battle Hunger Games style and needed contingency plans to ward off falling asleep by 11pm.

We’re talking about a night out in a club, yes? And it’s caused this much agro?

FWIW the clubbing scene isn’t and never was my thing. But if I was planning to do something and someone went on and on and on about how they were going to be able to get through it, I’d think they sounded like my mother or a member of the older generation. I wouldn’t necessarily consider that you’d ruined someone’s night or similar but really the needing to witter on and on about something quite so trivial is incredibly tedious for an onlooker to have to be a part of.

And the truth is that everyone talks about people in negative terms sometimes in the privacy of their own home/bedroom/wherever else. Anyone says that they never do this is lying. In fact this is really no different to you having overheard Anna’s conversation with Tom, you’re having a discussion on here in the (assumed) privacy of your own username, but Anna could equally be on here and might read it. It’s no different to overhearing a conversation about you in a different setting.

Tbh, if I’d organised an event that I was really looking forward to and the other people going kept on about what a late night / how would they stay awake etc I’d be pretty irritated. Don’t go if you don’t want to but just shush about it.

That said, Anna sounds awful but I would like to hear her side of it

I don’t get why Anna saying she doesn’t want to get married is so offensive, everyone is entitled to like or not like something, it’s not personal to the OP just because she happens to be married?

You didn’t do anything wrong, you jokingly voiced a concern, people we chipping in and joking about it Anna was very rude. You apologised in case you’d rained on Tom’s parade.
Anna then did a character assassination of you in the room next door - no excuse. 45 mins of going on about you is not a shirt ‘oh holly says party pooper’ throw away comment.

And yes, she’s probably insecure in her relationship with Tom the way she’s mouthing off (rudely) about marriage

She sounds like an immature nasty prat, best ignored! Ignore her or match her comments (comments about immaturity or something) & eye rolls and focus on your friendship with Tom. Hopefully he’ll dump her soon!!

PS: I’m an insomniac, I get very little sleep and often don’t sleep all night. I function very well considering...however I’d dread an event where it didn’t start until 4am! Alcohol makes me sleepy not buzzy so I’d have to pace myself and drink water too. I think you and DH were nice to agree to go do Tom recspture his lost youth!- hopefully he’ll realise you can’t ‘go back!’ 🤣. Events that ‘just happen’ And you end up being up
All night are different and more fun IMO.

I HOPE you enjoy it despite Anna’s shitty attitude and hopefully by next year Tom
Will have a nicer GF 😊

Just get some MDMA, you'll have no trouble staying up and you and Anna will have bonded beautifully by the end of the night.

I had similar a while ago. DH and I were early thirties at the time and DHs friend (who is even older than us ancient folk!) had a girlfriend who was about 22/23 at the time. We went out for a birthday night out away from home in a new city, stayed out drinking until about 2:30am at which point I decided I'd drunk enough and was knackered. DH was happy to come home at that point too, and also wouldn't have let me catch a cab or walk somewhere unfamiliar back to the hotel alone at that time of night. So we said we were leaving and that if they didn't fancy coming we'd see them at breakfast the next day. DH promptly fell asleep in the cab!

Well they did leave, as DHs friend was also ready to call it a night but didn't want to say or lose face in front of girlfriend. She wasn't happy. Thought she was whispering quietly in the back of the cab, except we could hear every word. She was completely obnoxious and rude. Said we (me, mostly) were boring old farts and that I'd ruined the night for the birthday person by leaving 'early'.

I was tired, a bit drunk, my feet hurt and I was starving. Not at my best. So I turned around in my seat and gave her an earful. Made for an awkward breakfast the next day.

Girlfriend is now long gone, so I don't have to deal with her anymore. We have two small children now so god knows how boring she'd think we are these days!

OP I think the nice thing about being slightly older is having the confidence to say when you don't want to do something. A night out like you did would be my worst nightmare and I'd be quite comfortable to say 'thanks but no thanks' to that. If you don't fancy something, just say so! Own your choices, don't apologise for them and that's the end of it. You can't very well agree to something then moan about it.

As for what you overheard, I'd mention it to her, and just ask her what the problem is. If she's annoyed that you moaned, just say sorry and that you expect her to say it to your face next time. No need for any drama.

"I don’t get why Anna saying she doesn’t want to get married is so offensive, "

Because she was making faces & rolling her eyes?

Mind you, that's not really any more dramatic than talking about a nap the day before/altering bodyclocks for one late night/early morning imo.

Perhaps you're more similar than you think?

@ILikeyourHairyHands gets it 🥰😂

@diddl but again making faces they may not have been aimed at OP, it could be that she just can’t stand the idea of marriage. It just seems like looking for something to be offended over. Some of my mates make faces about having children I don’t take it as a personal offence despite having a toddler.

Btw just on the marriage thing, you have no idea what’s going on behind the scenes. Anna and Tom could have had a convo where she wants to get married and he doesn’t, and honestly having been in that situation it was fucking hideous every time people asked me if I wanted to get married / when we might get married. It’s actually quite a hurtful thing to ask an unmarried couple because you have no idea what is going on behind closed doors.

Anna sounds like an absolute wagon.

And she's the one ruining Tom's holiday, ranting to him for 45 mins in the middle of the bloody night when presumably he just wants to go to sleep.

I think you're getting a hard time here OP, and that you haven't done anything wrong. The conversation you describe is exactly the sort of conversation I'd have with my friends (i.e. joking about a need for caffeine) without anyone being upset or taking offence.

The sort of OTT emotional offended reaction you describe from Anna in that convo is the sort of thing I'd expect from someone a bit dim and unable to understand the nuance of the situation (i.e. we like you but not the activity/we will do the activity because of the liking/there will be a few minor activity-associated negatives which we will now acknowledge without reproach from you). She seems like the type who can't fathom that grumbles about lack of sleep are NOT akin to saying Fuck you, Tom.

She also definitely doesn't like you!

It's a tricky one.

I think you and your husband were inadvertently quite rude to be talking about how it would be hard to stay awake etc for the event. Comments like that can put a lot of pressure on the person who wanted to do the activity because they feel responsible for everyone's enjoyment. Anna was maybe concerned that Tom wouldn't be able to relax and have a good time because he would be worrying about you and your husband not enjoying it.

That said, her reaction was over the top. But most of us have been there and gone a little overboard when complaining in private (or so we believe) about someone who has annoyed us. She hasn't been reasonable, but I expect it was more of a vent than her real feelings.

It's up to you how you act now. It might clear the air if you discuss it with her. But you may just want to let it go and see how you feel in a day or so.

Either way I hope you're ok - hearing someone have a bitch about you is awful, and you didn't deserve it

ILikeyourHairHands
That is obviously an option....
Probably the most fun option.
Can't think of any other options....
Opt for disco biscuits OP.

Hearing that for 45 minutes must have been awful, OP. Out of interest, why didn't you tap on the wall to let them know you could hear them?