Friend wants her DH to come on all female holiday.

[Oldbutstillgotit]

A few months ago a good friend , Anne, invited me and 2 other friends Barbara and Carol on holiday (These are not real names but I thought it would be easier than ABC etc) .
The background is that Anne has had a terrible few years and has needed a lot of support which we have willingly given. Thankfully she is now much better so decided that she wanted to treat us . She insisted that she was paying for a villa in the sun for a week plus flights . Very generous and we all said it wasn’t necessary but Anne really wanted to do this.
Further information, to avoid drip feed, is that Anne, Barbara and I have known each other for other 30 years since our DC were in Primary School. Anne knows Carol through a couple of interests but Barbara and I have met Carol several times and she has always been pleasant and fun.
Anyway, the villa and flights were booked and everything was fine. Until yesterday. I switched on my phone to a flurry of messages on our WhatsApp group, starting with Carol asking if it is ok if her DH comes on holiday ! Anne replied saying “ very funny, of course not”.
There are then loads of exchanges which are basically Carol saying that she has never been away from her DH for a week , the thought is making her anxious , he would be “ no bother” etc etc . To everything Anne has said no but Carol kept pushing. She even said that if they had the bedroom with the ensuite we would hardly see him !
I contacted Anne to see if she was ok . She was quite upset .
Yesterday afternoon, Anne , Barbara and I met for a coffee to discuss . Both Barbara and I said the decision was Anne’s but neither of us was happy at the prospect of a DH being there as it would totally change the dynamic.
The 4 of us are meeting for lunch later . Anne says she will cancel if Carol persists .
Anyone any suggestions ?

Taking it at face value that it really is her anxieties rather than his controlling behaviour (though how can he really contemplate coming unless he has zero self awareness?) then the kindest act of friendship would be to get her to come alone - especially if it meant travelling home solo if she wanted to cut it short. Thinking of the contrast between my widowed MIL who was able to muster up the strength and courage to live a rich and full independent life after FIL died and my grandmother who couldn’t and sunk into a decline for her final years - women often outlive their husbands. Helping her to confront her fears could give her the key to independence if that happens to her, rather than her ending up too afraid to leave the house.

I think the greatest likelihood is that Dick and Carol want a free holiday and the ensuite, it's possible this is just a garden variety case of CFery.

If this happened in real life, wouldn't people just say no, that not happening.
Job done, no saga.

Sadly, no, there are people in real life who muscle in because others can't say no. I was once unable to say no, which was down to years of abuse and which left me a people pleaser. Now, I can stick for myself, but it's been a hard road.

It is going to be an interesting lunch!

I had a friend who did this, her and her partner joined at the hip. Shes now and ex friend as it got very annoying and always changed the dynamics of holidays/days out etc.

He wasnt controlling, she was.!!

I wonder if Dick showed up for lunch?

Well if the four women are meeting for lunch today, then presumably Carol and Dick aren’t joined at the hip? Especially as it’s the weekend.

I love that you've named the husband Dick

Anne should get the room with the en-suite since she's paying for the whole thing.

Her initial response to Carol's cheeky request was spot on, I can't believe Carol wouldn't take no for an answer and continued to pressure her

Sadly she has probably damaged their friendship. That's on Carol, not Anne.

I hope she pulls out completely and the three of you can have a lovely holiday.

Anne WNBU to tell her she is no longer invited after all the drama.

Another alternative is to say yes he can come but Anne can’t afford for him to go and as it’s mucked up the villa and flight plans as well as the extra insurance there will be a surcharge of £7,000.00 for him to attend.

Plus meals and refreshments.

Let’s see how badly she wants him to come along, then!

Sounds like Carol and Dick just want a free holiday together.

I find it so tedious when I arrange something and then one of the invitees tries to change the arrangements. I have a friend, a very nice person in all other ways who does this every time. I’ll book a table at a decent restaurant for three or four of us and she always pops up with ‘why don’t we go to xxx, they have a Groupon offer on?’ Er no. Not only is it a crap place but Groupon only applies Monday to Thursday and we’re meeting on a Friday. And it isn’t because she needs to eat cheaply either. She just has this compulsion to rearrange.

I agree that I would be worried about Carol, that maybe her DH was abusive or controlling and insisting that he comes along too.

That being said it might make me pay a bit more attention to Carol in the future but it wouldn’t change my response to her question. ‘Sorry no, this is a girls week and men aren’t invited. I hope you still want to come?’ ‘.

In all honesty, and I know this sounds a bit harsh, but it really doesn't matter why Carol has done this - because it's Not About Her. The holiday is for Anne, and it's about Anne. All Carol is doing (for whatever reason) is re-focusing everything onto herself, and for that alone, she should be given a straight No.

Of course it would be sad if it was due to anxiety; it would be horrible if it's because Dick is a controlling bastard - but it still boils down to Not Relevant - because this holiday is for Anne, not Carol.

I imagine Carol is in a controlling relationship.

The answer still should be a flat "no" though.

You might like to remind Carol that this holiday is to support Anne, who is also paying for it!

Great idea in principle, except that pushy types often just see "explanations" as a reason to push some more. There are times when a simple "no, we don't want that" works best and I suspect this may be one of them

Anyway I hope the lunch brought a good result

Oooh good luck with this!

Can’t Carol just take a dildo?

I don't see how there is anything to discuss. Carol is being massively unreasonable and if you all either give in to her or cancel, this behaviour is basically condoned. No good friend would behave this way, it's ridiculous!

I don't understand the posters making excuses for Carol. All the anxiety in the world is not an excuse for spoiling other people's plans, let alone a holiday. I agree with a poster upthread who remarked that "anxiety" is being pulled out now by people who generally behave poorly and now expect everyone to roll over as it is a mental health issue. And believe me, I know anxiety with bells on.

As for the joined-at-the-hip couples ... I think this type generally have lost all awareness and are very thick skinned, and actually truly believe that their partner is welcome everywhere. In one such pair of my acquaintance the dh turned up at a spa day. I hate spa days but had felt obliged to attend this one. It was not improved by Lionel perched in the lobby in his anorak whilst a bunch of women were in bathrobes. He and his dw proudly declare that they cannot be separated, and she has remarked in a tinkly way that they love each other so much more than other couples. I don't know about that but they are bloody irritating.

Hilarious that you called him Dick!

My sister is like that. I get sick of hearing 'oh we come as a team'.

Carol saying that she has never been away from her DH for a week , the thought is making her anxious

And she is how old?

Honestly, how do some people cope with ordinary life? She is being very thoughtless and self-centred.

Yes, there's clearly a mental health issue with Carol, but that is no reason to visit her unreasonable demands on everyone else. Especially when Anne is treating everyone.

Why would anyone want someone's unknown husband along on an all-woman trip? And the solution is not for Carol and her DH to rent somewhere close by. You 3 (AB, and OP should go without Carol.

Honestly, I really can't believe the egocentric self-centredness of some people (ie Carol). Making a fuss like this as an adult because of their insecurities? Tell Carol to take responsibiity for her life.

Or better still, ask her if she needs help to escape from an abusive marriage.

I agree, Irma.

Is Carol related to the woman who brought her DH and baby on a hen do and took the Bride to be's room on the cottage that was booked for the Hen do?

Why do people do this?

Why do people do this?

Usually because no one pulls them up on it and tells them, 'No, not happening' and when they push, tell them no and to fuck off if need be. So bravo for Ann!