Sensitive issue with DDs friend WWYD?

[PrincessPearTree]

My DDs 11th birthday was last week but due to her having SATs and a massive amount of practice test papers over the weekend she’s having a small sleep over with a few friends this evening. They are all off tomorrow early evening to a class mates birthday disco. So tonight they are have had a pizza and are watching a film and tomorrow my hairdresser is coming round to do there hair and between us we will do there makeup if they want for the party. My DD outright refuses makeup but a couple of the girls wear it.

One of DDs friends is in the same year but is almost 12. She’s a really lovely girl and has grown up with DD. Preschool, nursery, primary and they are starting secondary in September together.

I’ve heard people describe the family as “alternative” it’s hard to describe them but they have no gadgets at all, grow there own food, don’t follow any trends and not materialistic at all. They are a very educational family from a young age, this girl is very advanced beyond her years and has always been.

They all went to the park opposite our house. They came back this girl was really upset saying two boys who used to go to there school (year above and now in secondary) were saying she smells and has nits. I know from DD this girl has been having a horrific time over the last few years with constant teasing.

This girl asked me to check that it wasn’t nits and was dandruff. I took her into the kitchen to look in private and said to her it could be a few things most likely may be not washing shampoo out properly. Explained dd and myself get a flaky scalp. I looked, her hair is very dark and it did look bad with tonnes of fine white specs but it seems like she has cradle cap it’s a yellow colour all over her scalp. When She took her ponytail down and not only has this to contend with but her hair is very very greasy and the top section below where the hair bobble is it’s completely matted.

I told her not to worry and showed her mine, mines bad and looks like glue. Told her I use a shampoo prescribed by docs and I would give her a bottle to take home if she wanted. She told me her mum won’t let her use that, they had been to the doctor about it but her mum won’t treat it.

I know from DD she’s been teased for many years for this and for being smelly. No judgment but bless her she does smell of BO. DD has said in the past her mum knows this but refuses to let her use deodorant. DD has said many times if her mum let her have deodorant the teasing would stop.

This girl has said she wants me to put the shampoo on it. I’ve got Nizoral here, I know it’s available over the counter but I’ve said I need to check with her mum first but she’s said her mum will say no but she doesn’t need to know. I explained it may not make it go in one treatment and I have to use it every 2-3 weeks to keep on top of mine and DDs.

What do I do? She wants curls done tomorrow and tbh her hair really needs washing first and also de-matting. She pleaded with me to treat her but not ask her mum. WWYD?

Mum has agreed to let her have her hair curled but no makeup.

A deep cleansing/clarifying shampoo is best for grease, I use Aldi's. Dd has terrible problems with her scalp and does have prescription shampoo but finds the clarifying shampoo and no conditioner the best solution, and once a month or so I comb her scalp, basically gently removing build up as the prescription stuff doesn't actually help that much

Ps dd won't use scented deodorant so she has unscented one which happens to be the "value" one, just 60p

I would definitely have a confidential chat with the school safeguarding lead... her physical needs are not being met by her parents (not following GP advice to cure skin condition on her scalp etc) and this is impacting on her emotional well-being. The parents may not be intentionally causing the neglect, but some form of intervention is absolutely necessary here for this poor girl. It's pretty poor form by the school if they are not already on the case to be honest (hopefully they are!!), especially if she's being bullied on top of the personal hygiene issues. And I totally agree with all PP suggestions re. bag of hygiene items for school, sleepovers so she has access to self-care products if she wants.

I would think she is “gillick competent” ie can consent to some things herself with no parental input. I would have no qualms going against the Mother’s wishes and following the girls lead.

Bless her. She must feel comfortable with you to talk to you.

I think you could tell the school. They may well be onto it already, but if not, they will know how to deal with the issues carefully.

OMG I was that kid. I have seborrheic dermatitis which started around the time I started puberty, and my mum was a bit of a hippy, but also totally uninvolved. Not only did it look bad, but it was really itchy and uncomfortable, I felt like my scalp was burning at times, and I used to try and pick the dead skin off, but my hair would come out too. I've actually got small bald patches in my hair now as an adult from this time

Eventually when was about 13 I took myself to my GP and got some lotion, which got rid of it, but wasn't the best as it used to make my hair look greasy. Eventually I discovered shampoo freely available in fucking boots that cleared it up, if only my mum had been arsed to look into it.

I'm still pissed off my my mum for that - I think she just saw it as cosmestic and therefore trivial, but it was so uncomfortable to live with.

This sounds like seborrheic dermatitis to me rather than dandruff.

Could you get her a 48 hour deodorant or at the very least a 24 hour one and some deodorant wipes.

If she can keep the deodorant at school, she may have time to do a quick arm out wash in the toilets at school and then reapply.

I would not mention her hair had been wash unless I was directly asked and if asked I would just say, It had to be washed so her hair could be curled.

That should say a quick arm pit wash at school

I've been in this situation. Just do it, I did & the mother was actually very grateful

So glad you're going to do it OP and I hope the girl feels like a million dollars tomorrow with her new hair do!

I welled up reading this - it must have been hard for her to confide in you and she obviously trusts you I feel so sorry for her. I would do the little bag for her and also maybe just discreetly make sure school are aware there's an issue. You are kind for helping her

@Crazycat16 RTFT

Poor girl is being neglected, unable to keep herself clean and refused medical treatment. I'd be reporting to ss and the school.

Adding a deodorant to a party bag is a great idea! Lush have some that should tick all the boxes in terms of natural, vegan, etc.

I doubt SS would be interested in a girl with dirty hair, tbh.

It's not just dirty hair

She has a medical condition that her mum is refusing to treat.

Cradle Cap? Yes, I agree it’s horrible, but I’m saying that SS would probably not be interested.

When my kids had cradle cap as babies my mum told me that sodium bicarbonate made into a paste with water and applied to the scalp and left for half an hour before washing hair would remove it. She was right, it worked really well. I would suggest rubbing the flakes with a towel or flannel to loosen them and combing it with a nit comb or similar before washing. Maybe the mum would agree to this if she won't agree to proper treatment.

I would sort her hair out for her - it's neglect on 3 levels:
hygiene
failing to take medical advice
emotional and social needs.

Yy to informing the school.

I'd also let her sleep over every few weeks and try and keep stocked up on the specialist shampoo, finances permitting.

Can you buy her a roll on deodorant and keep it in your daughter's bag (definitely not the friend's bag,) so that when she gets to school, she can put the deodorant on, and it can go straight back to your daughter for safe keeping?

Not sure if I'd address it directly with the parents, but if the parents approach you, and say you are at fault, maybe you could use the following to highlight how unfair and ridiculous they are being:

"Do you use toothpaste?"

Toothpaste creates waste, has chemicals in, but you don't stop her using that.

If the school haven’t noticed a smelly neglected child who is on the receiving end of bullying by now then someone telling them isn’t going to change much.

A good school leadership team would already have measures like a deodorant in her pe bag or social service involvement (sadly they are likely to be very uninterested in a case where a child is fed and housed because they are too busy).

lyralalala
They will have noticed but a child who is smelly doesn't in itself give evidence for social service involvement, nor automatically mean school would have things in place (though they should have addressed the bullying).

What the child has told the OP about having medical advice which is being ignored because of mum's beliefs, how the child is begging another adult to help them sort it is something the school wouldn't be aware of and they could do with that information to be added to the file and adds weight to getting some intervention.

LolaSmiles

The OP's DD and this child have gone through primary together, which means the school have had this child in their care for numerous years.

Either she was always neglected to this level, in which case they should have intervened, or she was a previously cared for child who is now neglected, in which case they should have intervened.

Neglected children who experience bullying to the lengths the OP has described without any effective measures being put in place to assist the child, or halt the bullying, tend to be attending schools with poor SLT's in my experience.

Good school staff can make a world of difference to a neglected or abused child. The fact they are not assisting this child more already suggests she doesn't have the fortunate luck to be attending one.

There is a very fine line for the OP to balance here between being able to help the child by speaking to other people (school, SS, her parents) and not losing the opportunity to help the child by putting herself on a bar list by her parents. Especially when you consider the child will be starting secondary after the summer with all new staff, lots of new kids and the loss of the familiarity of primary. If any speaking to the school is done I'd suggest speaking to the secondary school when she starts - they may be able to do more to assist (access to showers etc) than the primary who seem to have been very lack so far going by the sounds of the bullying.

lyralalala
It's not school's job to intervene. It's the job of social services to intervene on neglect and safeguarding issues.

In every safeguarding session I've ever done that's made very clear. It's not our job to investigate, nor make judgements, nor to decide what we think is best in a situation because we are not the experts in abuse and neglect.
Our role is to record safeguarding concerns to the appropriate person in school who then shares the information with social services who will then make decisions and give advice on how to move forward.
School's are already filling gaps from lack of access to other services by having learning mentors, family support workers, counsellors etc on site some of the time or by roping in well meaning but utterly underqualified teachers/TAs to do their best in some areas when the children actually her access to a qualified specialist professional, not a teacher with a metaphorical superhero cape on.

On the bullying, the school have let the child down and that stinks of poor leadership and ineffective approaches to tackling bullying.

But we have to be clear where the different remits are for different professions.

But we have to be clear where the different remits are for different professions.

If the school don't intervene and involve anyone else then no-one else can help. We're coming at this from a similar place actually - I don't mean the school should have swooped in and dealt with the problem solo, but they should have intervened by involving other agencies.

If the child wasn't being ridiculously bullied I wouldn't be assuming that the school are also shit on their safeguarding, however in my experience of working in schools the two often go hand in hand. Especially with long term neglect that's not overtly dangerous or abusive. There's a general acceptance that Mary's uniform is a bit whiffy or Peter doesn't wash enough, but given that other kids have what seem like bigger problems those just become the norm.

The secondary school will be in a better position to assist because they have the facilities, if the child wants it, to regularly shower there, if they have lockers she can keep deodorants etc. The low level things that can be done can be facilitated easier. Plus new school staff won't have that "Oh that's just Mary's parents, nothing actually helps" fatigue that the primary may have.

My main concern with the repeated "tell the school" comments is that anything that causes anyone to speak to the parents is quite likely to result in the child being banned from spending time at the OP's house. So the potential for help from outside has to be balanced up with risking the loss of her safe space.

Also with the time of year - that child will soon be on her own for the summer with no school staff around it would be absolutely the worst time for her to be banned from the OP's house.