I feel upset, sick and cheated by Leaving Neverland

[Persimmonn]

I was one of those people who kept saying the men are out to make money. That there’s no evidence etc. But I finally watched the documentary yesterday and it’s hurt me a lot. I feel like I was lied to my whole life. I know it sounds so melodramatic and selfish but MJ was my idol growing up. I remember being 7 years old and dancing and singing his songs.

Now I feel sick to the core. If Wade Robson and James Safechuck are lying, then they’re incredibly good liars.

MJ was a paedophile.

Hobbes8

I agree. I don't understand why it's only now that these 2 men have come forward that people are piping up and believing he was a paedophile. It still hasn'tbeen proven and those boys stories were pretty much the same as other accounts, they just made a documentary. I don't understand why people need to hear every detail to believe something so serious.

Believed he was guilty since the first trial.
You only have to look at him to see what a messed up individual he was.

There are pedophiles everywhere. Why is it so surprising that he was one. Just because he's a musical 'genius'?. Nope. Never been interested in him and don't want to have to listen to his music.

I was mainly shocked to realise how effective and large scale his grooming was. How he managed to build this persona that allowed him to groom young boys in plain sight. How so many of us fell for it. And how many others are there who are doing the same to us now.

It's sad that some people need proof in a court of law in order to believe it. The same lot would probably have been saying a guilty verdict would've been a miscarriage of justice anyway.

Rape convictions are at 3% and that's out of those which are reported, and then taken on by CPS. I'd like to think that doesn't mean victims aren't believed.

I don't know when, if ever, I can bear to listen to his music again. I don't want to give the Jackson family any money because they will then use it to attack survivors and accusers.

Drogo it does not take a rocket scientist to see that he had an unhealthy interest in young children. The evidence found at his ranch by Police definitely points to him being a Paedophile.

@EstrellaDamn yes I would say the same. Everyone is entitled to the presumption of innocence. I know in the age of me too and pedophile priests we are told to believe all victims but it runs counter to the rule of law

I too am shocked that folk are shocked.

He was always spoken about with ridicule - baby over the balcony debacle and Bubbles his pet chimp were the butt of so many jokes.

And ofc the young boys sleepovers - nobody could have presumed any of that was innocent. What shocks me more is how he got away with it and was never called to task?

Add to that the men's accounts on the documentaries, the fact that Jordy Chandler was able to draw the exact markings seen on the underside of MJ penis, and that he liked the company of young boys alone.

I was a teen child when the case with Jordy first surfaced, and even then I believed he was guilty, although I realise only those directly involved will ever really know the full truth.

After watching the documentary, my opinion has only strengthened.

I'm not sure why his music should stop being played though, as whatever he was, some of his music is pretty good and I've enjoyed listening to it over the years.

Those ppl wanting it banned, is it so his estate doesn't receive any more money from his music, or are there other reasons? I'd be interested to know other ppl's opinions on this.

And yet some are still saying he is not a paedophile and cannot be proven. It takes pieces of the jigsaw like this to be put together to paint a very big and complete picture.

It seems as though some are clutching at straws really wanting this not to be true.

I’m 50 so was aware of MJ and his little ‘friends’ but I thought they were only around for photo ops & the odd sleepover. I am gobsmacked that he had children in his bed most nights I just can’t get my head around this. Even if (huge if) he never touched them sexually he was still massively guilty of foolishness ( people accusing him as now) and blatantly suggesting to that child that it was ok to sleep with a strange adult ( massive safeguarding issues). Also he kept them away from family & education for his own selfish reasons & obviously thought he was above anyone’s advice not to do this. So even if innocent (no way) he’s still an hateful man.

The documentary didn't convince me. Especially when there isn't a second side to help make judgment. Many of the so-called witnesses are disgruntled employees. Not to mention those two men as adults testified that he didn't touch them Also these men are suing the estate after all their opportunities have dried up. They are both unemployed guys looking for a buck.

DFOD

I didn't know his voice was put on! Aren't his brothers quite softly spoken as well though? His singing voice was quite Mickey Mouse-like. Ew.

Well according to Lisa Marie in this article and I remember David Gest saying something similar when he was a guest on Celebrity Juice a while back :

Intriguingly, she (Lisa Presley) has spoken often about the Jackson who existed behind closed doors, explaining that his voice and personality were vastly different to what he presented to the public. “Not a lot of people know who he really is,” she told Diane Sawyer in 2003.

“He doesn’t let anybody see it. And he has some idea about how he should represent himself in the public that he thinks works for him, which is the sort of meek, victim-y, quiet thing that he does, which is not like how he really is. He doesn’t let a lot of people see that. When he wants to lock into you, or intrigue you, or capture you, or, you know, whatever he wants to do with you, he can do it.”

www.telegraph.co.uk/tv/0/leaving-neverland-big-unanswered-questions-michael-jackson-james/

I could always see what a musical genius he was, but his voice and the blank look in his eyes always creeped me out.
So so sorry for those boys.

Well @lboogy I guess that accounts for the 3% conviction rate for rape really. Maybe society should lead the way on raising victims up instead of demonising them in court.

Never liked his music that much (Earth Song... really?) and always thought he was a creep / weirdo so no conflict for me but I am mystified how much some people idolised him. There seems to be some serious loyalty out there to MJ and I don’t know why. Was his music that good? Not good enough to justify ignoring the creepiness, let alone paedophilia, in my view.

Just watched Oprah Winfrey on YouTube with both accusers and the director of Leaving Neverland. This highlights why the men didn't speak up before now with a psychologist who has dealt with survivors of sexual abuse explaining the ongoing emotional damage that occurs post abuse. It is powerful viewing as the audience is made up of people mainly men who were abused as children. Apparently 1 in 6 men in USA have been sexually abused as kids. So many never are able to come to terms with it and will never disclose.
James Safechuck looks in a bad way in this interview and I hope he isn't pushed into suicide by all the negative comments around the world of people who don't believe him.

I felt deeply upset watching the programme too, that poor James looks shattered and broken. I can clearly remember looking at all the press photos of the trips (in Hello magazine or equivalent) to Disney etc hand in hand with various boys and it seemed accepted because it was Michael. We were all duped to some degree. Awful.

I’m a bit young to have been a proper fan, but my parents had both been Jackson 5ive devotees as kids and gone on to be fans. My grandmother was also a huge fan of his, so like you say the music is in the background of my life too. Feels dreadful to know that the innocent happiness and memoiries of my Nana I feel when I hear something like PYT or Rock With You will always be tainted now. I believe them.

I just wonder know will his music still be played? It just goes on and on.

I admit I was a glitter fan and really loved some of the stuff but now do not like to play it anymore (actually I no longer have the records but keep stopping myself from buying any cd's.

Does anyone feel the same way? I know some people won't watch films by some people who have been accused (and found guilty).

One of the boys was only 7 years old. 7!

Of course MJ can't answer back, but as another pp said, if these men are liars then they are amazing, Oscar winning liars.

I have no doubt he did what he is accused of. But why on earth did the parents not step in at the start. Sleepovers with a grown man is wrong in any decade, surely.

I always thought he was a nonce. Mind you, I remember a creepy and infuriating article written about him in the late 80s, comparing him to Prince. The tone of it was that Prince (about whom I don't recall any accusations of sexual misconduct, and certainly nothing about abuse of children) was a dirty pervert who made disgusting explicit porn music, while Jackson was innocent, childlike and spiritual. ISTR there were at least faint mutterings about Jackson even then, though this was prior to the first round of accusations going mainstream.

It's sad that some people need proof in a court of law in order to believe it. The same lot would probably have been saying a guilty verdict would've been a miscarriage of justice anyway.

That's not what anyone's said though. I've said that condemning someone without properly presented evidence is a bit shaky. It has no bearing on whether or not I personally believe him to be guilty. Which I do.