“My child is top of their class”

[BluthsFrozenBananas]

I see this on threads quite often, I just saw it on another thread. Or my child is on a higher book band than any other classmate, or is top in maths, and I wonder, how the hell do people know that?

My DD is in y6, at no time since she’s been in primary have I known her “ranking” in the class, or that of any other child. Neither did I have any idea what book band others were on in the days of reading books.

I get if your child is super bright and doing extension work far beyond their years you might assume they were “top” of the class, but even then surely it’s not a given as teachers don’t routinely give out information about other children’s accidemic achievements.

Or am I missing out on something and schools publish super secret league tables of children which only the parents of children at the top get to see?

Iirc general intelligence is actually something that should apply across most domains - so in theory if you’re intelligent you will be good at most things at school. I don’t think it’s that straightforward of course as there’s a lot of social/educational factors that come in to play but you can be an all rounder. I think most people obv don’t have time to get to the same level in all subjects though- as adults if you study one thing at uni you just don’t have the time to do other things.

There also of course the difference between having an aptitude to do something an applying yourself - I learnt to read music v.quickly but was terrible at practicing so am rubbish at piano.

@ShamelesslyPlacemarking I agree, it does seem to be that we have to keep quiet about academic successes (esp at an early age), when being the fastest runner etc. seems socially acceptable to publicly celebrate.

Either way, I understand it must be hard for the parents of children who don't seem great at academics/art/sport/music and have yet to find what they're good at.

We've had this said by a few teachers.

Wasn't helpful told us nothing about them and last primary they were at has low achieving cohort – it’s a low achieving country for results with a school that gets a changeling intake.

As children are P/T conferences usually involved us having a conversation afterwards about not resting on laurels and how they need to compete with wider numbers of people.

I don’t think I’ve ever mentioned it to anyone else – top sets at secondary on here to demonstrate my DC have got past their problems or they haven't held them back as much as we worried.

First knew DS got into top sets at first primary because some other parent were questioning their DC about sets and who was in what to have it shrieked really loudly - that can't be top set if bigKite's DS is in in it he’s thick – only to have lots of excited children loudly insisting he was in all the top sets and usually top of them.

First knew DS got into top sets at first primary because some other parent were questioning their DC about sets and who was in what to have it shrieked really loudly - that can't be top set if bigKite's DS is in in it he’s thick – only to have lots of excited children loudly insisting he was in all the top sets and usually top of them.

Another parent loudly declared your child "thick" in front of a classful of children and other parents? I thought people like that only existed in movies.

My 5 year old in year 1 has his photo on the wall showing the phonics set he is working on. So I know he's either bottom or 2nd from bottom as he and another boy are on set 1 and the others are on set 7 or higher.

My 12 year old in year 8 has been in the top 10% in his year. We get a letter every term from the headteacher saying that and how he is a shining example to the school etc. I don't brag about it on facebook though, just tell him I'm proud of him and tell the grandparents.

retired teacher here. I have found it interesting both as a parent and a teacher that almost everyone I come across either professionally or as a parent describes their child as academically above average or average.Mathematically impossible of course for every child to be average or above average. As a society we need to value everybody regardless of ability then we will be able to do better for less academically able kids and people will hopefully be less likely to feel the need to either boast or cover up.

Incidentally it has been my experience that parents of genuinely gifted pupils are least likely to boast of their child's academic prowess.

Yes I have a top of the class ds. He tells me how he is doing and knows how the other "top" students are placed in tests etc. Ds is Asperger's type AS and he doesn't really have any other interests outside of academic achievements and Minecraft/ Pokémon. He has little interest in his peers and prefers a chat with the teachers. Currently he is reading my philosophy texts from my degree course (a zillion years ago!). So he is very focused on being very good academically, he spends his breaks reading improving literature or text books, he spends hours perfecting his homework and considers marks below 90% in a test as a failure. It is exhausting and not always fun parenting a pedantic, anxious perfectionist.

So yes sometimes you know when your child is "top of the class" sometimes it is not a brag but a concern - if fragile egos are involved. I have other younger children who are more well rounded and not the best and it is healthier all round. I wouldn't change ds but I would love to give him perspective.

I think that the children do often know whereabouts they are in the class.

However I've never heard a parent who has said "my child is top of their class" and been correct.
Sometimes they have added a positive spin to a teacher comment, however a good proportion of the time I think it's just that they believe it to be true with no evidence other than whistful thinking.

Parents whose DC are genuinely top don't have the need to tell people.

@TiaMariaAndCoke exactly this for me too with the older one and younger one 😂

My kids know who is top in the class in their schools for sure.

It all becomes a bit irrelevant past a certain point though. You can be top of a lower down class but who cares? Or you can get a 1600 SAT and still not get into Harvard because you just didn't have a balanced enough background.

The kids always know who the top few are. In particular, in year 6 our school did umpteen practice papers, and the DC were given their marks. Word gets round among the DC as to who got what.

@IHaveBrilloHair DS is tall, slim and prefers hummus to cake Do you know him?? (Mind, he loves a bag of Squares!)

In answer to the OP, until DS moved to a different class, I knew he was top of the class because his teachers repeatedly told me. DS was also aware of it. Now that he's in a different class with more kids who are also quite able, his teachers don't mention his class position - I'm guessing that's because it's not particularly interesting to talk about being 11th at maths. Or wherever he is. I don't care, tbh. I was top of the class the whole way through and it got me not very far in life

Another parent loudly declared your child "thick" in front of a classful of children and other parents? I thought people like that only existed in movies.

It wasn't an area you'd envision stuff like that happening. It was just his year and a particular group of parents in his year.

It was playground after school just outside where his year and year below came out with everyone milling round waiting for their children and talking to them as they came out. Very loud disbelieving voice but it was loud and did attact a lot of attention - though more of the WTF variety from outside her group I think.

They'd also been ones to exclude him and few other children from near whole class parties held when younger despite us inviting everyone so I don’t think anyone had them down as nice.

Ds had been in support groups in previous years - had struggled with basic maths and reading. He'd worked hard - school had put support in and we'd done a lot at home and it had all come together.

DS was embarrassed and I was stunned so I just got us out of there rather than confront her or say anything – I’ve always felt I handled it badly.

We moved for work reasons but it was nice to get away from this as well. TBH entire place was nice to put behind us - worse place I have every lived.

What has struck me is the awkwardness around celebrating academic achievements. Ds has been given a few academic awards in school one notable history prize in an end of school parent assembly was a bit of a disaster. Ds needs to be warned of changes, hates noise, clapping and unexpected events. The teacher awarding prizes in this noisy assembly hall (long list of awards, performance of "wild thing" by school band) started waxing lyrical about a brilliant unique mind etc. I was partly paying attention sat right at the back ds was with me instead of the rest of the y8 class at the front so he could run out if it got too much he was hopping out every time there was clapping and was strung out by this time as it was 3/4 through an interminably looong assembly.

So teacher says " blah blah brilliant blah blah unique ... Something about some inventor... Blah blah history prize... Blah blah Ds name" ... At this point ds bursts into tears and runs out. Queue turning heads and puzzled frowns ... Me red faced trying to get out to comfort Ds. Teacher has to fluff some lines and move on. Nightmare. And no one congrats ds on this prize it becomes yet another embarrassing anecdote about my beautiful boy. The school could have prepared him done his bit at the start and without waxing lyrical or expecting him to come up. Stupid! They know him he is autistic. Yet it was an achievement worth celebrating, still I see lots of Facebook photos of swimming, running, drama art awards and very few regarding academic awards... Like it is not the 'done thing' to be outwardly proud. I follow that habit and I don't post on social media if my kids get top marks, or history prizes but sometimes I fight the urge to do so and resent the fact I know how it will be received. Wierd.

I was on the highest book band in my class in yR and y1 and after class mixing for y2, one of two on the highest band. So for reading it was apparent that I was top of the class through infant school from my own observation as a young child (and generally good in other areas).

There are some all-rounders that excel at everything. There are more that will show particular aptitude for a specific area, so that widens the number that could be described as "top of the class" in some way. Some parents may just use it for the most able table, that widens the pool further. (Added to that, MNers are articulate parents with higher than average education so not a truely representative sample of the population and statisticly, their DCs will be higher than average too.)

I know which areas of the curriculum DS excels at but not necessarily in comparison to others. I know from various conversations that he has a reputation for being intelligent. He was on the G&T register for his general knowledge last year. I know where he struggles, and I know who else will be picked up/ dropped off for interventions in a particular area because I'm waiting with them

"Top of the class" can be quite an open position with maybe a third of a class being able to make some claim to it.

I think if you have a child who is way above normal levels then you just know.
When DS started reception his reading age was tested and was age 14+, spelling was age 8 and that was only because the test didn’t test any higher. So yes it was discussed that he was well above the top of his class.
I have absolutely no idea where DD or DS tank in thier classes, I know it’s not top though!

Parent of girl in DDs class tells everyone her DD is top of the class.
She lies about her exam results (I know because her DD tells everyone the truth).

She put on FB after parents evening that the teacher said she was ‘inspirational’ to everyone in the year. It would be funny if it wasn’t so ridiculous.

I have a top of the class (yr 5) DD. Its just clear she is, her peers know etc

She just happens to be academically gifted, she is however rubbish at sport so she isnt good at everything.

Particularly in maths they often do big maths challenges and times table challenges. Its clear she finishes and does better. I have had other parents come up and say their child said mine got 42/42 (within the first half term of starting) and I find it awkward as Im not sure what they want me to say,

They also all have reading ages which they discuss through the accelerated reading scheme.

No one has an issue about it (none of her peers do and no one has said anything to me) because I have brought her up to not be boastful etc about it.

What has struck me is the awkwardness around celebrating academic achievements.

Bigmouth, It's because of comments like these;

I love how many posters have come on to say their kid is top of the class, pathetic

I find the whole concept of bragging about your kid being "top" distasteful. In a time when we're trying to reduce pressure on kids in schools parents certainly shouldn't be competing to have the best kids. It's no different to "my dad's bigger than your dad" and quite frankly belongs in the playground. I hope my children never hear me behaving like a primary school kid and bragging to other parents. You all need to grow up

Incidentally it has been my experience that parents of genuinely gifted pupils are least likely to boast of their child's academic prowess.

Parents whose DC are genuinely top don't have the need to tell people.

There is always someone ready to knock you down a peg or two when they think you're being too big for your boots. It is sad that you aren't allowed to be proud or it's either mocked or belittled.

I don't think my DC are actually top of the class, they haven't won any awards, but it feels odd when I do have something to 'boast' about academically, I find it's easier to say that DS had crap A-levels than to say DS2 had good SATs results. There's something not right about that.

ClemClemFandango yep. I keep quiet, embarrassed I suppose, because my dc is at least two years ahead academically. It’s like the elephant in the room at coffee mornings if the reading levels are mentioned.

I’m a wallflower anyway. I find it so hard to know what to say.

The kids know exactly who is the top of the class, it's fairly obvious to them. My DS and his peers have definitely been aware since infant school. My friends DD (age 6 at the time) had moved up into Hexagon group in Maths and was really excited saying she was now in the 2nd highest group. I said how do you do Hexagons aren't the top group, she said because the cleverest children are in the top group.

It was then we realised that the kids knew everything about abilities etc and they generally didn't really care, it is just the parents that do.

I have heard time and again people coming out of parents evening saying oh they are top of the class. Its all BS as the teachers wouldn't say that anyway.

I was a parent governor at DD's school and we had a day once a year where we went into school and chatted to the pupils. Every class was well aware who the top kids were, from reception to Y6.

Pupils were quite happy to tell us that Lucy and Amy are the best readers, Max and Ben are on the bottom table because they aren't very clever, and Oscar goes out with Miss B to do extra lessons on Wednesdays. (all names made up)

DS teacher last year at parents evening told us that he excels at everything he does, whether that's maths, literacy, reading, science and even sport. He openly told us that this is unusual because most children either sway towards academic or physical type activities.

His teachers give him different work (usually maths) to the other children and he takes in his own books as he's read all the ones in the school library for his reading range (there aren't many as he is reading secondary books).

I would never say outright that he is "top of the class" and neither have school said, but from what we know from his teachers I'd think it's a fair assumption that he's thereabouts.

Like other PPs, I try to avoid conversations with other mums, one texts me every year on report day and after parents evening to get an update. I hate it because if I'm truthful I feel like I'm bragging.

I think it's pretty easy to know in maths because maths is mostly right or wrong, so is easy to measure.

For example, my DD knows she is in the "high ability maths group" (they don't muck about with coy names) and that they are all good at maths, but sometimes she helps the others in the group and she gets more questions right. I get the impression that the children in the group also discuss their relative abilities a bit and are capable of making reasonable observations. I suspect the whole group could rank themselves pretty accurately.

I'd say it's harder to know for English - there are some objective measures - reading age, spelling age, reading words per minute. But children don't seem to know each other's reading ages, despite them being recorded in an accessible place. And there are other aspects that are harder to measure - things like creative writing style. I know my DD has formed a judgement about where she is in the class in handwriting and it sounds about 6th to me.

Children spend all day with their peers. It would be odd if they didn't notice the differences between them.

You mean the school reports don't include your dc's position in their end of term/year exams in each subject?