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Original poster

My DD is confused and a bit upset by gender fluid teacher

354 replies

CosmicCanary · 17/09/2018 18:12

DD is 11 and in her second full week at high school.
We were going through her home work today and part of it is drama.
She needs to learn the meaning of various words such as reflection, preformance spontaneous etc.
DD loves drama and is very enthusiastic about it now being a weekly lesson. I asked if she was enjoying it and she said yes but she is confused.
She said she does not know what to call her teacher.
I said Ms, Mr or Mrs last name.
DD said its not like that. The teacher has said they can call her Ms Mr or Dr as they are gender fluid and their pronoun is they.

I said well call them by any of those then if they dont mind. DD said its hard as the teacher is a Ms/she/woman and although she is trying hard to remember the they pronoun she (DD) keeps getting it wrong.

DD is a very kind and does not want to upset her teacher as she likes her/him/they very much. DD is also scared as she does not want to get in to trouble as, and I quote "misgendering is a crime".

I have reassured DD that her teacher has said its fine to call her Ms Mr or Dr so she has nothing to be scared of and wont upset the teacher.

In private I am very angry. My DD has enough to deal with and worry about just starting high school and now she has to deal with a teachers chosen identity and the worry that if she slips up because despite the short hair and Mr reference her teacher is a woman.

This is not trans bashing before that gets thrown at me I am just upset my DD has to deal with this when it only benefits the teacher and causes distress to a child.

OP posts:

EmpressAdultHumanFemale · 17/09/2018 19:06

If the teacher's a Dr, though, it seems odd that they're giving the kids the other options. My doctor teachers were simply known as "Dr Whatever". I don't think it would have occurred to anyone to use Ms or Mr.

CaligulaBlushed · 17/09/2018 19:07

Not necessarily ababucat, it's also used when you either don't know or don't want to express someone's gender. So,

"My new boss started today"
"Oh really? Are they nice?"

And if I don't want to say if they're man or woman (because why would I?) I might say, "yes they are, thank you".

TheFallenMadonna · 17/09/2018 19:07

I use Ms. Not Dr. Other staff sometimes use Dr when referring to me. Everybody seems to be able to negotiate the title confusion.

KurriKurri · 17/09/2018 19:09

I don't think this is too much of a problem, but I appreciate that children just starting secondary may be nervous of getting things wrong, they are still finding their feet.

Gender fluidity, identifying as non binary, and all other permutations of gender ID, are facts of life. The teacher has explained the situation to the children and given them a choice of what to call them and told them thier preferred pronoun is they. I'd advise your DD to go for doctor if she is uncertain about the other titles (and why on earth would anyone - apart from Gillian McKeith - claim to be a dctor when they weren't - do people think you can only be a doctor if you are a medic ??)

Your DD will almost certainly come across gender fluid people at some point in her life, and while it may be a little confusing for her now, it offers a great chance for her to learn about preferred forms of address and to be accepting of people who identify differently from her.

My DS and DDIL both teach in the same school, Ds goes by Mr HisSurname, DDIL goes by Ms HerSurname. The children know they are married but have no problem remembering their preferred form of address.

Reassure your DD that no one is going to prison or is going to be cross with her for making a genuine mistake or slip of the tongue, I imagine the teacher may have been rather clumsily making the point that deliberately misgendering them will be taken seriously. Maybe they have had this problem previously, wanted to explain that this is not acceptable and came on a bit strong.

gamerwidow · 17/09/2018 19:09

what if some parents aren't comfortable about their children learning about transgender people yet?

I have major issues with self-id and labels such as cis or natal women but I think it’s unfair to deny transgender people exist or to hide that from children at any age.

abacucat · 17/09/2018 19:10

caligula Yes it is, but it is grammatically incorrect. Schools need to model good grammar.

Bloodyfucksake · 17/09/2018 19:12

OP do you live in a lovely area with very nice kids? Most schools I've worked in, if you gave a class the option of Mr or Ms, there would be a percentage of the class who would be on the wind up immediately. I'm sure your daughter is not that kind of kid, so has nothing to be stressed about.

CaligulaBlushed · 17/09/2018 19:13

You're joking, surely, ababucat What other word would you use to ask what someone's new boss is like? "Oh, you have a new boss, what is he or she like?" - you're being unreasonable!

Lweji · 17/09/2018 19:13

If they really wanted to be gender fluid, then why even use titles?
Just use their names.

Although, I'd favour the singular it instead of they.

I'd also be enquiring which PhD they had, though. Because if it was the case that it had one, why not just say call me Doc?

Nothisispatrick · 17/09/2018 19:14

Why is it hilarious to call a doctor by their formal title?

Nothing. But assuming the drama teacher actually is a doctor, why would they not just offer that to the children to call them by (my name is Dr Drama)? Why add all this mr or ms nonsense?

CaligulaBlushed · 17/09/2018 19:16

Why add all this mr or ms nonsense?

Surely it's because they want the kids to know they don't mind if they don't call them doctor? Am I missibg something here, isn't that the obvious explanation?

abacucat · 17/09/2018 19:17

caligula the person replying knows the sex so should use he or she.
Lots of people have poor grammar, no big deal. Totally different in school though.

gylly · 17/09/2018 19:18

If the teacher has said that they are gender fluid and are happy to be referred to as he/she/dr then you can't get it wrong can you? Or have I misunderstood? I feel that I am out of touch with this whole gender fluidity thing and need to read up on the subject.

TheChineseChicken · 17/09/2018 19:19

If the teacher is female (biologically) and doesn't mind being called Ms, what not just ask the children to call her Ms and be done with it? Avoid all this palaver

RiverTam · 17/09/2018 19:20

I would want to know who told her misgendering was a crime and then haul that person over the coals for telling a child such bullshit.

And ‘they’ is a fucking nonsense. Why the fuck should children be expected to pander to this narcissist?

CaligulaBlushed · 17/09/2018 19:20

But they don't know though do they. You tell me you have a new boss, I don't know if they're man, woman or sentient computer. And actually even if I did know I guess I'd only have that person's word to go on because men and women can look however they want these days. So do I really know? I think you're being weirdly pedantic to be honest, even if it is a school.

AssassinatedBeauty · 17/09/2018 19:20

No, the teacher asked for "they" to be used rather than "he/she", but is ok with the titles Ms/Mr/Dr. So this teacher would consider being referred to as "she" as being misgendering.

MissMarplesBloomers · 17/09/2018 19:21

I'm sure Dr Drama would be upset herself if they thought your DD had been distressed.

As long as there is no deliberate misgendering going on then they would understand the child is just getting her head round it.

Your lovely DD likes her teacher & wants to "get it right" so I hope you can reassure her on that score when you find out about the "misgendering is a crime" misunderstanding.

PurpleDaisies · 17/09/2018 19:22

But assuming the drama teacher actually is a doctor, why would they not just offer that to the children to call them by (my name is Dr Drama)? Why add all this mr or ms nonsense?

Exactly. It’s very unusual.

Branleuse · 17/09/2018 19:23

if the teacher seems to be female and has said its OK to call them Ms or Dr then id suggest either of those two, and id ask her to try and remember to use "they" where possible, but id also want clarification from the school that your child isnt going to accidently get in trouble for using an apparently unacceptable pronoun.
The rest of it, id just ignore and hope it blows over.

Bicyclethief · 17/09/2018 19:23

Is this what we are coming to? Are children supposed to know what they identify as on a my given day? Perhaps she can write it on the board in the mornings. For goodness sake!

abacucat · 17/09/2018 19:23

Of course people know if their boss is a woman or man.

NoToast · 17/09/2018 19:24

I have major issues with self-id and labels such as cis or natal women but I think it’s unfair to deny transgender people exist or to hide that from children at any age.

My DD was upset after the CBBC documentary and was very anxious she would wake up as a boy when she loved being a girl. It's taken a long time for her and a lot of reassurance to stop worrying about it. I really don't think that gender identity is a topic for very young children, particularly given the evidence base is so very under developed. It's certainly not a scientific fact that some people are 'born in the wrong body'.

Lweji · 17/09/2018 19:24

Of course people know if their boss is a woman or man.

How?

YeTalkShiteHen · 17/09/2018 19:24

Of course people know if their boss is a woman or man

I think this thread proves that’s not true though?

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