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Original poster

My DD is confused and a bit upset by gender fluid teacher

354 replies

CosmicCanary · 17/09/2018 18:12

DD is 11 and in her second full week at high school.
We were going through her home work today and part of it is drama.
She needs to learn the meaning of various words such as reflection, preformance spontaneous etc.
DD loves drama and is very enthusiastic about it now being a weekly lesson. I asked if she was enjoying it and she said yes but she is confused.
She said she does not know what to call her teacher.
I said Ms, Mr or Mrs last name.
DD said its not like that. The teacher has said they can call her Ms Mr or Dr as they are gender fluid and their pronoun is they.

I said well call them by any of those then if they dont mind. DD said its hard as the teacher is a Ms/she/woman and although she is trying hard to remember the they pronoun she (DD) keeps getting it wrong.

DD is a very kind and does not want to upset her teacher as she likes her/him/they very much. DD is also scared as she does not want to get in to trouble as, and I quote "misgendering is a crime".

I have reassured DD that her teacher has said its fine to call her Ms Mr or Dr so she has nothing to be scared of and wont upset the teacher.

In private I am very angry. My DD has enough to deal with and worry about just starting high school and now she has to deal with a teachers chosen identity and the worry that if she slips up because despite the short hair and Mr reference her teacher is a woman.

This is not trans bashing before that gets thrown at me I am just upset my DD has to deal with this when it only benefits the teacher and causes distress to a child.

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 18/09/2018 06:30

OK-your ds is confused. She's at an age where her world is expanding and she'll be meeting lots of new things- just treat this very casually as just another new thing when you're talking to her "Oh, there are people in the world who don't feel if they are either men or women. Would you find it easier to call your teacher Ms, Mr or Dr? OK, just use that one from now on. What are you doing in drama- is it fun? Oh, by the way, who told you misgendering is a crime? It isn't- it might be a bit rude but it's not a crime"

Then today be on the phone to the school and get to the bottom of the "minsgebdering is a crime" thing.

Perfectly1mperfect · 18/09/2018 06:35

**Reminds me of the 2 teachers on GMTV, 1 lesbian and one bisexual, smugly wittering away about them coming out to their pupils. They were so very pleased with themselves.

No idea what interview you are talking about but this may have helped some pupils struggling with their sexuality.

Perfectly1mperfect · 18/09/2018 06:37

Reminds me of the 2 teachers on GMTV, 1 lesbian and one bisexual, smugly wittering away about them coming out to their pupils. They were so very pleased with themselves.

No idea what interview you are talking about but this may have helped some pupils struggling with their sexuality.

YeTalkShiteHen · 18/09/2018 06:39

I don’t see how it’s relevant to a lesbian and bisexual teacher though?

The issue is not confusing or scaring the children. Which could all be sorted by explaining it clearly, and ensuring that rumours and gossip aren’t going to scare them either.

It wasn’t handled in the best way if OPs DD came home frightened and confused.

Calling OP prejudiced because of that is ridiculous.

If a teacher puts their owns wants above the welfare of their pupils by failing to be clear and explaining things properly, that’s not right.

Which is what’s happened.

Original poster
CosmicCanary · 18/09/2018 06:51

Thentodaybe on the phone to the school and get to the bottom of the "minsgebdering is a crime" thing.

I already know where it came from. I spoke to DD about it yesterday. I also reassured DD that calling the teacher Ms Mr Dr is fine but stick to Dr teacher if that is easier.

OP posts:
Original poster
CosmicCanary · 18/09/2018 06:58

Clearly that's not the issue here. You have an issue with someone who has probably struggled with life and their identity. You clearly think this is a load of rubbish and have your own agenda. I didn't realise that at the start but it's very clear now.

I have no issue with the teacher apart from the confusion she has caused.
What agenda do I have?

This situation was brough to my door. I did not seek out this out. Why announce to a group of 11 yo you are genderfluid anyway? Does the teacher being genderfluid impact on the lesson they are teaching?
Why announce 3 choices of address why not just pick one announce it and get on with teaching?

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 18/09/2018 06:58

Where did it come from?

Original poster
CosmicCanary · 18/09/2018 07:13

Where did it come from?

A new friend while chatting at lunch.
DD was asked if the teacher was nice and DD replied yes she is.
Her friend then said you shouldnt misgender somebody my auntie says its a crime.

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 18/09/2018 07:31

Did your dd know what misgendering is?

Perfectly1mperfect · 18/09/2018 07:39

I have no issue with the teacher apart from the confusion she has caused.

Then call the school and clarify exactly what this teacher said...but you refuse to do that even if it helps your daughter.

What agenda do I have?

At first you made it sound like you just wanted to help your daughter to stop feeling anxious about this. Now it just seems like you are annoyed with a teacher being 'allowed' to identify how they want to. Your daughter will have to deal with this in life, she will meet and work with people who do not necessarily fit into the boxes that you are both used to. Some people will have had a very difficult time with their identity, hopefully all your daughter will have to deal with is doing her best to call them the name they wish to be called.

Why announce to a group of 11 yo you are genderfluid anyway? Does the teacher being genderfluid impact on the lesson they are teaching?

To explain their name choices, I guess. Why does any teacher announce their name? So that the children can use it to address them. None of this has to affect the lesson. Children should call the teacher one of the names that they have been asked to. If they get it wrong accidentally, they shouldn't worry, as I am sure the school would clarify if you would just call them.

TerfsUp · 18/09/2018 07:42

I need to change my username to DrTerfsUp. The heck with being misgendered; I am concerned about being mis-titled.

AsAProfessionalFekko · 18/09/2018 07:43

The teacher should have just said 'I'm Dr Drama - OK so we are going to practice improve comedy, get into pairs' not go into a lesson in modern gender politics.

Original poster
CosmicCanary · 18/09/2018 07:51

Did your dd know what misgendering is?

I dont think so no. From talking to her yesterday it sounds like her friend explained it.

Then call the school and clarify exactly what this teacher said...but you refuse to do that even if it helps your daughter.

No I have not refused to do that. What I refused to do was call the school so they could reassure DD she has not committed a crime.

Now it just seems like you are annoyed with a teacher being 'allowed' to identify how they want to.

I dont care how the teacher identifys. I care that they made something simple confusing. I care that they made their idenity a thing when there was no need to.
If the teacher is happy to be called any 1 of 3 things then why not just pick one introduce themself at the start of the lesdon then get on with teaching.

OP posts:
MaisyPops · 18/09/2018 08:07

Now it just seems like you are annoyed with a teacher being 'allowed' to identify how they want to
Far from it.
The OP only wants a simple 'Hi I'm...' to a group of 11 year old children without a half mention of gender fluidity which sends a bunch of (understandably) misinformed 11 year olds on a rumour mill about what gender fluidity is and whether it's a crime. It was irresponsible of the member of staff.

BertrandRussell · 18/09/2018 08:09

Presumably the teacher has ambiguous looks? It seems perfectly sensible for them to explain-so long as it's a simple, one off explanation. I imagine (assuming that they are not an attention seeking narcissist) that they were trying to make it easier for the children by saying that they were happy with whichever title the children felt comfortable with based on voice, clothes, whatever.

And I would most definitely have a word with the school about the misfendering being a crime thing. They need to know the kids are saying that.

YeTalkShiteHen · 18/09/2018 08:13

If the teacher is happy to be called any 1 of 3 things then why not just pick one introduce themself at the start of the lesdon then get on with teaching

Absolutely.

Original poster
CosmicCanary · 18/09/2018 08:19

Presumably the teacher has ambiguous looks?

DD said the teacher is female. She said she has short hair like your friend Nicola but DD was quite sure the teacher is a woman.

I do think the teacher was trying to make it easier but all it has done is cause confusion as DD is now trying to pick 1 of the 3 options everytime she wants to address the teacher.

I think I will call the school today to talk about the misgendering crime issue. I am confident that did not come from the teacher.

OP posts:
YeTalkShiteHen · 18/09/2018 08:23

I think I will call the school today to talk about the misgendering crime issue. I am confident that did not come from the teacher

I’d do that too, also it gives the school a chance to clamp down on gossip and rumours and ensure there is no confusion.

Perfectly1mperfect · 18/09/2018 08:48

I think I will call the school today to talk about the misgendering crime issue. I am confident that did not come from the teacher.

Glad to hear it. The main issue is that your daughter goes to school without worrying.

I’d do that too, also it gives the school a chance to clamp down on gossip and rumours and ensure there is no confusion

Absolutely. I think the OP will be pleasantly surprised by what the school has to say. They will want both teachers and pupils to be comfortable and happy whilst at school.

flapjackfairy · 18/09/2018 08:55

The world is completely mad !

redwinebreak · 18/09/2018 09:09

I agree with what @Perfectly1mperfect has to say.

I personally struggle to understand why you wouldn't discuss this properly with your 11 year old daughter. People come in all shapes and sizes. If she's compassionate and smart then this doesn't need to be a big deal. You've said that she likes the teacher, so the teacher clearly isn't coming across as "narcissistic" or authoritarian. It sounds like the teacher has tried to downplay this with "call me Mr, Mrs, Dr" but this has backfired and is causing your dd anguish. Children will inevitably talk outside class and get things wrong eg "it's a crime to misgender". Arm her with the correct facts and reassurance and I'm sure she'll be fine.

Original poster
CosmicCanary · 18/09/2018 10:17

I personally struggle to understand why you wouldn't discuss this properly with your 11 year old daughter.

What makes you think I havent discussed it with DD?

OP posts:
RiverTam · 18/09/2018 10:26

It is very hard to discuss with a child (or indeed anyone) something that at best requires leaps of cognitive dissonance and at worst involves outright lying. Child sees woman. Child calls woman Miss when in front of them and ‘she’ when not with them, because her brain can decode the female in front of her and has been taught that the correct pronoun for a female person is she. But now child has to ignore bran decoding and rules of grammar? For what? A raging ducking narcissist. I actually think gender fluid is even more narcissistic that trans because we’re all expected to keep up with how this special snowflake is feeling on a day to day basis.
Fuck
Off
With
That
Shit
In
Our
Schools

Perfectly1mperfect · 18/09/2018 12:04

What makes you think I havent discussed it with DD?

This wasn't directed at me, but I presume it is from a few things you said.

Firstly, the description you gave of what your daughter thinks gender fluid means (something about having short hair and not liking dresses).

Secondly your daughters total confusion about the teacher suggesting 3 names that they are happy to be called.

Also the fact that this has caused her so much distress. Usually when children have things explained to them, they accept things and they won't feel so anxious.

All of these would make me think you haven't discussed this with your daughter and explained or that if you have she doesn't understand.

YeTalkShiteHen · 18/09/2018 12:09

Is it really a topic that we’re all expected to have sat down and discussed at length with our children?

I think that’s a bit of a stretch tbh.

Surely it is discussed as and when it comes up?